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balderclev
April 30, 2013, 10:05 PM
I see some responses on this forum that seem holier-than-thou towards new re-loaders. Most of the responses are beneficial and are trying to help in training the new guys but a few see to be almost vindictive in nature.

Some of us are new reloading and are just trying to learn. There is a wealth of information on this forum and we feel blessed to have access to it.

But the "stupid", "why would you do that", and "what were you thinking", kind of responses are counterproductive to our being here. If you are an expert in reloading, why are you here except to pass on your knowledge to new re-loaders?

I have been reloading for 3 weeks. I need a lot of help as I don't have a mentor. Most of the people here give great advice based on my current level of expertise and lack of components available to me due to the current situation.

There are several people here who have helped me greatly in understanding the complexities of reloading that are not available in the readily available books. I thank you so much for your comments. As for the others that just want to slam me for not "instinctively" knowing, I don't want that kind of help!

I apologize for the rant. Just tired of the "why did you do that" kind of responses. I also want to apologize to the wonderful constructive learning experience I have had from most of the members here. This knowledge is not available in any publication that I am aware of and I am very appreciative of the opportunity to learn from you.

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bds
April 30, 2013, 10:26 PM
Nicely said! Welcome to THR and the wonderful hobby of reloading.

You know, we too were all "reloading newbies" once. :rolleyes:


Don't let a few frustrated members' posts get to you as most of the THR members are helpful and respectful of those new to reloading (They really are).

Instead of responding/arguing with the offender in a thread that may hijack the thread and/or cause it to close, just forward/report the offender to the moderator of the category - this will help moderator review the post and determine what course of action to take quicker with a lot less frustration and wasted time. BTW, THR also has some of the nicest moderators compared to "some other" gun forums. ;) :D

You can PM the moderator to report the offending post (copy/paste URL) or click the "Report Post" icon just above the "Post Reply" button.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=183481&stc=1&d=1367375113

1911Teacher
April 30, 2013, 10:26 PM
This is a great forum. Also try the 1911 forum. Check out the stickies.

Fire_Moose
April 30, 2013, 10:29 PM
Welcome to the internet.

Really though, I have not noticed any of that behavior here. Most that I've seen, on other forums, seems to be the guys who have been doing it for 3-5 years and think some things should be common sense....which they are once you know ;)

Good luck.

Sent from my CZ85 Combat

rfwobbly
April 30, 2013, 10:30 PM
You know, we too were all "reloading newbies" once.

I'm not sure about that. According to my mom, I was born with a Lyman book in one hand and a powder scale in the other.

:D

bds
April 30, 2013, 10:32 PM
OK, "except" for rfwobbly ... but then what about rcmodel? :neener:

raddiver
April 30, 2013, 10:39 PM
Id say the same applies to him as well.
In fact didnt they both have a hand in creating the first handload?

;)

zxcvbob
April 30, 2013, 10:43 PM
Devil's Advocate here: Sometimes knowing "what were you thinking" or "why did you do that" is a necessary step to giving useful advice. Just a thought.

Welcome to THR. And never apologize for a good rant ;)

Geno
April 30, 2013, 10:47 PM
balderclev:

Well said! Wow, I remember my first-ever session of reloading. I made it out the door of the gun shop without small rifle primers for the .223 Rem I had just bought, and 100% of the supplies needed. Got home, unpacked, set up and went to town. Pause ... primers?! My first lesson learned. So, I packed up, drove alllll the way back to the gun store, only to be laughed at. I don't think I ever went back to his shop. Not because of the extra trip, but the mocking. I trusted him for honest help. He didn't give it. That was about 1986, and I haven't forgotten it.

The best advice I can give, and do for everyone including myself, purchase multiple reloading manuals. I have at least 5 manuals, and they do not say the same thing. Second, never be shy to ask a question. In closing, thank-you for your post. It is well stated. Stick to the reloading; it's just plain fun! :D

Geno

ljnowell
April 30, 2013, 10:48 PM
Balderclev, welcome to the forum. I hope I'm not one of the guys that got after you, if I am I apologize, I can be a moody ol' crank sometimes. If there is ever anything you need help with I would be happy to offer any help or advise. I have been loading for awhile and like to share what I know and learn what I dont.

bds
April 30, 2013, 10:51 PM
Devil's Advocate here: Sometimes knowing "what were you thinking" or "why did you do that" is a necessary step to giving useful advice. Just a thought.
I am sure it can get quite unnerving for some to ask reloading questions on a gun forum based on what they read on many gun forums (believe me, I have seen how badly they can be treated by some members on other gun forums ... it can get ugly). And what's worse, the moderators/Admins allow it! :eek:

There are much nicer/respectful ways to ask "Let's find the root cause of what happened" than posting, "What the #*$! did you do that for?" or "You shouldn't be reloading - sell your equipment and just shoot factory ammo." :rolleyes:

TheSaint
April 30, 2013, 10:56 PM
New reloader here too. I'm still waiting for my press and components to arrive, even if it might take a few more months due to all the backorders.

That being said, most of what I've read here in the reloading forum section has been positive. Every once in a while it seems like there's been some gloating of guys that were fortunate enough to purchase components when things were cheaper, but some of us are paying these 2013 prices due to never having been into building our bench setup, or stockpiling supplies.

In all, keep searching out new info would be my advice. Reloading seems to be a school that you never graduate from completely, but continue to build your body of knowledge. As soon as my bench setup is complete, I'm going to my local gun range and gun stores and try to talk to the customers and find a fellow reloader that can mentor me. I highly recommend you do so likewise. Mentorship rocks.

Gillie Dog
April 30, 2013, 11:01 PM
You are on the right track with the right attitude and you will do well.

It will come around and what you learn from experience and forums like this. It will make it all worthwhile.

Think about the decades ago some of us started and there was not this unbelievable resource available, the internet. You guys have it much better than we did and I sure wish I had the availability of all this knowledge back then.

Let the comments of mean folks will roll of your back like water off a ducks back and push forward. You will find them everywhere on the net along with crooks, liars and cheats. But to me it is worth it for what you will learn from the nice and honest folks which outnumber the others on these types of forums.

Good luck and continue asking for help.

GD

armarsh
April 30, 2013, 11:06 PM
One of the most difficult aspects of posting on forums is that is easy to misinterpret a fairly innocent comment. There have been many times I thought someone was trying to get under my skin but with follow-on posts I discovered it was not as I thought. There are no facial expressions or tone of voice here.

Imagine a judge looking over his glasses at you and asking "What the ---- did you do that for?"

Now imagine your buddy smiling as he is getting cold beers asking "What the ---- did you do that for?"

They both read the same here.

JSmith
April 30, 2013, 11:09 PM
I'm coming up on my first year of reloading and have gotten a great deal of excellent advice from this forum. I've never noticed any condescension from anyone here. I'm a long-time veteran of internet forums and this one is one of the best I can recall for civility of discourse.

climbnjump
April 30, 2013, 11:33 PM
I'm not sure about that. According to my mom, I was born with a Lyman book in one hand and a powder scale in the other.

I didn't start quite that young. I was old enough to drive a tractor but several years before being able to get a driver's license for a car. After I convinced my folks that I would be careful, they limited me to one 1/2 lb can of DuPont PB at one time. I had to empty that before I could get another. Herter's all plastic shot shell hulls were all the rage back then. Still have a few.

Beentown
April 30, 2013, 11:38 PM
I am sure it can get quite unnerving for some to ask reloading questions on a gun forum based on what they read on many gun forums (believe me, I have seen how badly they can be treated by some members on other gun forums ... it can get ugly). And what's worse, the moderators/Admins allow it!

There are much nicer/respectful ways to ask "Let's find the root cause of what happened" than posting, "What the #*$! did you do that for?" or "You shouldn't be reloading - sell your equipment and just shoot factory ammo."

Hence my thank you post in the "where is the reloading supplies" thread. I went to a well known reloading forum and it gets way outta hand. If you don't agree with the group think, a vendor will call you a Socialist (and I am a Libertarian) and a Mod will back it up :rolleyes:

That is why I will continue to use THR and TFL.

35 Whelen
May 1, 2013, 01:14 AM
I see some responses on this forum that seem holier-than-thou towards new re-loaders. Most of the responses are beneficial and are trying to help in training the new guys but a few see to be almost vindictive in nature.

Some of us are new reloading and are just trying to learn. There is a wealth of information on this forum and we feel blessed to have access to it.

But the "stupid", "why would you do that", and "what were you thinking", kind of responses are counterproductive to our being here. If you are an expert in reloading, why are you here except to pass on your knowledge to new re-loaders?

I have been reloading for 3 weeks. I need a lot of help as I don't have a mentor. Most of the people here give great advice based on my current level of expertise and lack of components available to me due to the current situation.

There are several people here who have helped me greatly in understanding the complexities of reloading that are not available in the readily available books. I thank you so much for your comments. As for the others that just want to slam me for not "instinctively" knowing, I don't want that kind of help!

I apologize for the rant. Just tired of the "why did you do that" kind of responses. I also want to apologize to the wonderful constructive learning experience I have had from most of the members here. This knowledge is not available in any publication that I am aware of and I am very appreciative of the opportunity to learn from you.

I hope my response doesn't fall into the catagory you mention, but I have to tell you to be very careful taking general reloading advice from an internet forum. I had been reloading, and digesting reloading manuals for over 30 years before I "discovered" internet forums. Almost daily, I'm still stunned at some of the blatant misinformation...O.K., I'll just say it....deep, dark, heaping, steaming, smelly B.S. I read on reloading forums! Almost none of the misinformation is dangerous, but most of it could really confuse a new handloader.

For your own good, read every manual you can get your hands on, specifically the Lyman 49th. Also there are really good books out there. As a boy, I read "Modern Handloading" by George C. Nonte and probably learned more from that one book than all manuals combined. There's one on feeBay righrt now for $5.99.
Read, THEN if you have specific questions, direct your specific questions on forums. but honestly, I can't imagine any handloading manual or especially book leaving any subject matter out.

I'd be really careful about judging advice as "great" if you have relatively little knowledge on the subject.

Please don't any of this as criticism.

35W

ReloaderFred
May 1, 2013, 01:45 AM
I agree with 35 Whelen's comments, and I've been at it 20 years longer than he has. We learned the hard way, by reading and experimenting. The internet is populated with all kinds of folks, who claim to be all kinds of experts. Some really want to help, and others are the same people that shoot up road signs...........

As mentioned by armarsh, the internet is a very one dimensional medium, where you can't hear the tone of voice, facial expressions or body language, all of which we're used to using to interpret someone's intent. I put very little faith in some of what I see posted on the various forums, unless I know firsthand that it either works, or doesn't. I'm leery of taking the advice of a total stranger, who is faceless, nameless, and who may or may not know what they're talking about. I've seen many posts where someone has stated something is an absolute, where I know from experience it isn't, at least not for me. I've also seen posts from people who claim to know a lot about a subject, only to find in other posts by the same person that they just started working on that subject a short time ago.

What I'm saying is, be careful. Don't take what's posted as gospel. Not by me, or anyone else. What works for one person may not necessarily work for another........

Hope this helps.

Fred

Jesse Heywood
May 1, 2013, 02:34 AM
Gosh darn no-count kids that come in here getting their feelings hurt over a few comments cuz they don't know squat and are to stupid to read the manuals and learn the old fashioned way.

Wait! I used to be one of those. And all those things applied to me. A long time ago. Started in fifth grade and have had a couple of stops and starts. Thankfully we have a place like this for those without a mentor. Ask your questions and someone here will answer them.

Welcome to The High Road. With your help we can continue to live up to the name.

Fire_Moose
May 1, 2013, 02:43 AM
I do agree about people boasting about stockpiles and such.

I guess that most reloaders have gone thru at least one of these droughts. Odds are after the first one they learned to stockpile. I did, I started at the end of 2011. Figured by maybe 6 months in, I should just grab what I can. I'm still not hurting but I've shot a little less(which is way more then if I'd been buying ammo) and can only hold out without buying for maybe 4 more months. I do need LRP tho hah.

Sent from my CZ85 Combat

Walkalong
May 1, 2013, 07:49 AM
This is a very frustrating time to start reloading that's for sure. Many people are edge about availability of components. Throw that on top of trying to learn a new hobby and I have no doubt it is doubly frustrating.

The internet is a double edged sword, but THR is a wonderful tool for those interested in learning reloading if they are willing to wade through a few briars to find the big batch of blackberries in the middle.

We try to keep the briars trimmed to a minimum, but you know how weeds are.

Like many here, all I had were articles in mags, and a reloading manual. We have a wealth of information here to be gleaned, with hundreds of years of experience, and many many posters who are so patient sharing their knowledge.

If you run into the occasional weed, help us out by pulling it up (Report button) and continue on. We all collectively make THR what it is.

The members are what make THR great.

MtnCreek
May 1, 2013, 09:32 AM
FWIW, I’ve seen some posts in the reloading section that do warrant a little harsh criticism to get the point across that someone is very likely to hurt themselves or someone else.

but then what about rcmodel?

RCModel is the Chuck Norris of reloading!

bigdaa
May 1, 2013, 10:07 AM
I'm new here, too.

However, I am in year 33 of reloading.
I've been smashed for certain things here, too!

However, any knowledge that I pass on is tempered by the hard , universal caveats that I have read from manual to manual, brochure to brochure and not by personal whim of experimentation.

I can see where the frustration comes in and especially where you are asking the so called "pros" for advice. It's like 35Whelen says.............we older bullet crankers didn't have anybody elses' anonymous advice. We learned with people one on one and through reading over and over manuals on the subject. I remember having questions on bullet depth from years way, way back. I remember looking at multi cannelure bullets like they were things from outer space. I remember running cases through a steel sizer that I had not lubed/wiped clean properly and scratching up the die thinking my whole world collapsed around me! I remember the day I decided that any primer hitting the ground was a tip for the clean up lady!

Personally, there is no stupid question asked of me (and many others here to be sure) Starting off in this hobby has turned into a lifelong adventure for me as I'd never have been able to shoot as much as I have if I didn't start cranking out my own ammo. And this is or at least can be true for all of the "New Guys" on the block.

The inquiring mind must always be ready to use common logic and cool thinking in the endeavor of reloading with all knew information. It's got to be taken in and digested and understood. The manuals are for just that. Don't be frugal where purchasing new, up-to-date manuals from different manufacturers. They are your Holy Grail, and they will give you the red light or green light where internet advice is concerned once you've digested their information.

Stay patient and grow a thick skin as how "personal" can a snarky comment from a total stranger be?

kerreckt
May 1, 2013, 11:16 AM
Welcome to this forum. I have been reloading metallic cartridges since 1983. I am relatively new to this forum. I congratulate you for expressing yourself and for asking questions. I didn't have anyone or anywhere to ask when I started reloading and made some mistakes as is expected. Fortunately, none created serious problems. I probably wouldn't have asked, anyway, out of pride (stupidity). I am also here to learn from others and if I can help someone all the better. I hope that I never display some of the arrogance and malevolence that I have witnessed from others. When I read these things I always figure it says more about the person writing than the person asking. Best wishes and enjoy.

Arkansas Paul
May 1, 2013, 11:21 AM
It's true that there is a lot of that going on. However this forum has over 11,500 active members. Some of them are bound to be jerks. That's just part of it.

The vast majority however, are nice folks that will help you all they can.

hang fire
May 1, 2013, 02:04 PM
I see some responses on this forum that seem holier-than-thou towards new re-loaders. Most of the responses are beneficial and are trying to help in training the new guys but a few see to be almost vindictive in nature.

Some of us are new reloading and are just trying to learn. There is a wealth of information on this forum and we feel blessed to have access to it.

But the "stupid", "why would you do that", and "what were you thinking", kind of responses are counterproductive to our being here. If you are an expert in reloading, why are you here except to pass on your knowledge to new re-loaders?

I have been reloading for 3 weeks. I need a lot of help as I don't have a mentor. Most of the people here give great advice based on my current level of expertise and lack of components available to me due to the current situation.

There are several people here who have helped me greatly in understanding the complexities of reloading that are not available in the readily available books. I thank you so much for your comments. As for the others that just want to slam me for not "instinctively" knowing, I don't want that kind of help!

I apologize for the rant. Just tired of the "why did you do that" kind of responses. I also want to apologize to the wonderful constructive learning experience I have had from most of the members here. This knowledge is not available in any publication that I am aware of and I am very appreciative of the opportunity to learn from you.
I know of which you speak, and it uriinates me every time such arises. Bears repeating, but when it comes to all aspects about firearms, there is no such as a stupid question.

I have been reloading for 50 years +, and have had the pleasure of imparting information to many of those new to the hobby.

hang fire
May 1, 2013, 02:06 PM
Id say the same applies to him as well.
In fact didnt they both have a hand in creating the first handload?

;)
LOL, that thought has come to me also.

Certaindeaf
May 1, 2013, 03:11 PM
I think there's about nothing but compassion here for our fellow men. We're not a genie in a bottle though.. information has always been/is there and assume responsibility. Don't be lazy.

afponiky
May 1, 2013, 03:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by raddiver
Id say the same applies to him as well.
In fact didnt they both have a hand in creating the first handload?

Now that just cracks me up!

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