The State of Gun Ownership


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meatcreeper
May 11, 2013, 12:16 PM
Hello All,

Yesterday, in Houston, TX, I walked into an Academy store saw a Bushmaster AR-15 on display for about $1000.00. It was alongside a Springfield M1A. This marked the first time I'd seen ANY semi-auto rifles in Academy since I'd bought mine. I purchased my AR-15 (with the help of a store employee) a little after the Newtown tragedy when ARs were starting to disappear off display shelves.

I was not surprised to see the AR and M1A at Academy, I had an idea that things were "different" when I stepped into a local gun store earlier and saw several ARs and Mini14s on display and at reasonable prices. Maybe it was the high I had after attending the incredible NRA Convention here in Houston, TX as an NRA Life member, but I was starting to feel that we (as gun owners) had fought an enormous battle and were now getting a chance to breathe if nothing else. Of course, I am not saying the battle is over and we can relax, but my question to the forum is: What do you perceive the state of gun ownership to be? Are things getting better?

I welcome your comments.

MC

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Water-Man
May 11, 2013, 12:21 PM
Quite the opposite.

swalton1943
May 11, 2013, 12:24 PM
Depends on where you are. NY, NJ, CO, CA, ; not so much. The anti's don't care about a civil war about the constitution; they think the military is on their side. I wonder....

mydawgg
May 11, 2013, 12:57 PM
It was nice to hand obama his butt in the senate. But they are constantly scheming. Manchin is still in news trying to get his universal registration bill going again.

In Oregon we are fighting multiple bills still. So far it looks like we are winning here for now.

Obama, Bloomberg, Feinstein, Schumer among others are still breathing and in positions of power.

Celebrate quickly the victory in battle number one. But jump back in as the war rages on.

Rancher5
May 11, 2013, 01:41 PM
As a long time Coloradian, who has been going down to Texas for a month or two a year, Appreciates the Sates full support of our 2nd Amend, Yes Academy Sports is a great store while their picked up FMJ 230 45's for 18.69 a 50 ct box, As written in our Constitution all States have the right to be like Texas , though Colorado fail from grace quickly, people need always to be proactive, 4 million new citizens in Texas in the last 10 years,Law and rights can change quickly, I foresee Texas fighting for their rights if 2014 or 2016 go towards a Democratic controlled Government, Bright side Texas seems the place to be for now.

Texan Scott
May 11, 2013, 02:05 PM
A fair number of Texas Democrats are pro-gun and generally more conservative than a lot of east coast Republicans. R & D don't really always mean the same things here that they might to some of y'all.

ADDED: In fairness, some of our big cities elect a handful of reps that emulate Chicago and New York... but just like NJ's governor is a RINO (Republican in name only), these ultra-libs are what I'm gonna call TINY- Texan in name, y'all. Not to many of those, thankfully.... the TINY minority.

I really don't see us leaning to the left next year, or in 2016.

We're large, well armed, and our economy has outproduced every other US state for a decade. We aren't going anywhere.

sidheshooter
May 11, 2013, 03:23 PM
I think we've had some major victories in the face of a tough climate.

As I see it, the main upside-aside from enough collective fingers in the dike stemming the recent tide of new anti-2A legislation, of course-is that the sheer numbers of people shouting on both sides of the issue has raised awareness enough that the middle ground of Americans who have previously had no major commitment in the debate have started to pay more attention. As they've paid more attention, the facts and numbers have come to the surface in a more mainstream way; a *major* plus for our side.

That's the good news.

Now for the bad--and I'm not trying to ruin anyone's breakfast here: the anti forces are becoming more adept at using grassroots tools and groundswell opinion. Y'all need to be aware of what's going on behind the lines, for example, here is a recent email sent to (presumably) 8 million people on their email list. Note especially credit taken for getting Sen. Flake to reverse his pro 2A position on background checks. This is what we 2A supporters are up against. The fight is not over, it's still spooling up, IMNSHO:


----------
Ellen Davis is a MoveOn member in Phoenix, AZ, who became a tireless gun violence prevention activist last summer, the night of the Aurora, CO, moving theater shooting.*

Ellen's committed leadership helped get Senator John McCain to vote for background checks, and the pressure she and other MoveOn members and allies are putting on Senator Jeff Flake is getting him to change his mind.1

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid indicated this week that gun legislation could come back up for a vote, and would have more votes this time.2 If enough of us step up like Ellen and pressure the senators who voted against commonsense reform, we can win on this issue this year.

Read Ellen's story below. Then click here to commit to pressure Congress to vote for gun violence prevention when it comes back up.

Thanks for all you do.

–Garlin Gilchrist II, MoveOn.org Civic Action

*

Ellen Davis, MoveOn gun violence prevention leader and Founder of Arizona People Acting for a Safer Society
Dear Move On member,

On the evening of the mass execution at the premiere of the Batman movie in Aurora, Colorado in July 2012, I started a MoveOn petition to reinstitute the federal ban on assault weapons. Through the efforts of family and friends, the petition gained about 10,000 signatures.3 In August and September, after the shootings in Oak Creek, WI, and at the sign business in Minnesota, and with MoveOn's Twitter and Facebook support, the signature count to more than 80,000 signatures. Then local press picked up the story,4 and the petition rose to over 90,000. Despite this momentum, I was unable to convince my member of Congress or Senator McCain to accept the petition.

In January, after the Newtown shooting, I hosted a MoveOn Community Committee Against Gun Violence meeting in my home, and also invited petition signers. More than 30 people showed up! We met again that weekend and formed a nonprofit organization called Arizona People Acting for a Safer Society (AZPASS).5 AZPASS now has more than 80 members, who attend monthly meetings. We have participated in many rallies, town hall meetings, assemblies, and visits to Senators McCain and Flake. AZPASS has joined coalitions, participated in many conference calls, and freely shares information and ideas.

In April, just prior to the Senate vote on background checks, we printed two copies of the petition, one for Senator Flake and one for Senator McCain—more than 11,500 pages and over 22 reams of paper. AZPASS asked a Phoenix family who lost their son, Alex Teves, in the Aurora shooting, together with a Colorado family who lost their daughter in Aurora, to wheel the two full dollies of paper into the Senate offices and ask the senators to vote for sensible gun laws. More than 75 people from the coalition joined us. Both the local and national news covered the event and the follow-up interviews with the Teves family.6

Senator McCain voted for the background checks bill.7 He held an impromptu meeting with our coalition outside his office and promised to vote for the bill if it came up again. Senator Flake voted against the bill. Since then, we have staked out his office and used the media to condemn his actions. My email about our visit to Senator Flake was posted on Daily Kos.8 Senator Flake's popularity has fallen dramatically in recent weeks, and the polls attribute it to that vote.9 Senator Flake now says he will vote for background checks if the bill comes up again.

The local community paper just asked AZPASS's secretary to become a regular contributor, and AZPASS people have participated in over ten local television interviews. We have begun a letter-to-the-editor campaign. Next up: printing "No Firearms Allowed" signs for local businesses, to make people more aware of the presence of guns and the issue of gun safety.*

Our motto is this quote from Margaret Mead: "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."

Thanks for all you do.

Ellen Davis*
MoveOn member*
Founder, Arizona People Acting for a Safer Society

Sources:

1. "In Turnaround, Flake Says He's Open To Expanding Background Checks," Talking Points Memo, May 7, 2013*
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=289830&id=67419-25501248-oobAPnx&t=2

2. "Background Checks Bill Would Get A 'Couple More Votes' Now: Harry Reid," Huffington Post, May 6, 2013*
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=289831&id=67419-25501248-oobAPnx&t=3

3. "Ban Assault Weapons," SignOn.org, accessed May 8, 2013*
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=289832&id=67419-25501248-oobAPnx&t=4

4. "Ahwatukee mom petitions for the reinstatement of the 1994 Federal Assault Weapons Ban," ABC 15, August 12, 2012 *
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=289836&id=67419-25501248-oobAPnx&t=5

5. Arizona People Acting for a Safer Society, accessed May 8, 2013*
http://azpass.org

6. "Parents of Aurora Shooting Victim Invited Jeff Flake, GOP Senator, For Dinner," Huffington Post, April 11, 2013 **
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=289837&id=67419-25501248-oobAPnx&t=6

7. "John McCain Supports Background Checks Deal, Breaking With Vast Majority of GOP," Huffington Post, April 17, 2013 *
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=289833&id=67419-25501248-oobAPnx&t=7

8. "What turned Jeff Flake," Daily Kos, April 22, 2013 **
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=289838&id=67419-25501248-oobAPnx&t=8

9. "Jeff Flake: 'Pond scum' popularity in poll," POLITICO, April 30, 2013 **
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=289839&id=67419-25501248-oobAPnx&t=9

Want to support our work? MoveOn Civic Action is entirely funded by our 8 million members—no corporate contributions, no big checks from CEOs. And our tiny staff ensures that small contributions go a long way. Chip in here.

Sam1911
May 11, 2013, 04:46 PM
I was starting to feel that we (as gun owners) had fought an enormous battle and were now getting a chance to breathe if nothing else. Of course, I am not saying the battle is over and we can relax, but my question to the forum is: What do you perceive the state of gun ownership to be? Are things getting better?
You're seeing things the right way. Remember that, prior to the Sandy Hook killings, gun control was all but a dead issue. Handgun Control, Inc. (the Bradys and friends) had dropped all but out of sight and appeared to be down to one employee and a part time janitor with a second-hand fax machine. (:D)

With the tragedy, those sorts and all their legislative pals got the fire stoked again and they poured everything they had into FINALLY making one last do-or-die push. They were going to push the new AWB through, they were going to make "hi-cap" mags illegal, they were going to ... everything they ever wanted.

As time passed, though, their locomotive started to run out of steam. And the big goal they were driving for kept getting smaller, and more modest, and less extreme ... until it was the merest pipsqueek of the horror they wanted to push on us. In the last battle, all they even hoped to be able to get was a little old "90%-of-the-nation-wants-this" UBC law. The President wanted it, the old-school anti nuts wanted it, heck, even self-professed conservative big whigs were in favor! Surely they had resurrected enough of the old 80's era gun-control animus to be able to drive this through on the outrage over dead children!

And in the end, they FAILED. Not just failed to get the law passed. Failed to even get it through the Senate, which was THEIR turf! They didn't come half-way to where they could get a law passed -- EVEN FOR THE TINIEST PORTION OF THEIR PACKAGE!

On the national stage, this was about as abject a failure as any such effort could have seen.

...


So now what? Oh, there are those who will keep trying. There always are. And there are states which suffer under gross oppression of gun rights, and that will take time to rectify.

But other states -- MORE states -- have passed (or at least considered) bills strengthening 2nd Amendment protections in that same time. How many states are we up to now with federal-gun-law-nullification bills? That's pretty wild! And the NRA gained how many members in the last 6 months? And how much ammo was sold? And how many guns -- to new gun owners?

This was a kind of Pickett's Charge for the gun control war of the early 201Xs. Anti-gun legislators aren't going to have anything like the critical energy to get so close again for a very long time. Every new proposal is going to lie in the shadow of the painful failure of even the pale wisp of gun control (UBC) that was so soundly defeated in 2013. Few non core-anti politicians will have any interest in or stomach for putting their political capital out there on the chopping block again for another doomed effort. The momentum is OURS.

We just have to make sure that large numbers of those politicians who supported this stuff suffer cold, decisive, political death because of it. Many will be up with an electoral "Kick Me!" sign on their backs next year. Make sure you show them just how much you disapproved of their position!

r1derbike
May 11, 2013, 05:15 PM
Our motto is this quote from Margaret Mead: "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."This quote, shows the misguided ignorance of all those wanting and demanding gun control. They really have no clue that disarming law-abiding citizens leads to letting the criminal element out of the genie bottle, with mass murder, rape, robbery, home invasion, carjack, and murder becoming so rampant, that this group will wonder aloud, "What went wrong"?

Their vision of Utopia and buying the world a coke is born of ivory tower dreams.

We must fight these thoroughly misguided attacks on our freedoms, and we will stay vigilant in that cause, come what may.

Texan Scott
May 11, 2013, 05:19 PM
What Sam said... thing is, THIS year's defeat won't discourage people from supporting a second swing at it unless it carries over cleanly and clearly into a painful pounding at the polls next year.

We need to not only REMOVE some antis, but MAKE EXAMPLES OF THEM. It's not enough that die-hard antis remember 2013 with bitterness; moderate swing vote politicians need to remember 2014 with trepidation.

That's why we can't just gloat and polish our laurels. We need to keep pushing to capitalize on our gains.

barnbwt
May 11, 2013, 11:13 PM
You're seeing things the right way. Remember that, prior to the Sandy Hook killings, gun control was all but a dead issue.

I know, right? They spent something like 5000$ on the 2012 election--that was it! But they're like Sea Monkeys, or something, always ready to spring back to life when rehydrated. :D

Maybe in 2014 we can see if we can microwave the jar, instead of simply letting it dry out? :evil:

Our motto is this quote from Margaret Mead: "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."
Talk about the most empty platitude ever; Yes, small vocal groups influence passive majorities, by definition. Whether they are right or wrong, or their goals pure or evil, small groups will always effect changes to the majority status quo. Because the majority doesn't do much but look after itself--duh. It's like the activist group's motto being; "we are activists" :rolleyes:

TCB

yzguy87
May 12, 2013, 12:17 AM
"We just have to make sure that large numbers of those politicians who supported this stuff suffer cold, decisive, political death because of it. Many will be up with an electoral "Kick Me!" sign on their backs next year. Make sure you show them just how much you disapproved of their position!"
Copy that Sam!!!
I beat this drum to all my pro 2A friends and acquaintances and even some who aren't pro 2A! I just really hope people stick to their guns (Ha!) when the next elections come around and don't forget those who wanted to further the restriction of our basic rights!

Cryogaijin
May 12, 2013, 06:17 AM
In Oregon we are fighting multiple bills still. So far it looks like we are winning here for now. As of a week ago, all gun bills in the state were tabled. (Read as: Put on hold.) The shear storm of emails and feedback about the bills shocked quite a few of our state legislators. Easily 10x as many emails as on any other issues during their terms.

Oregon has spoken; no more infringing of our 2nd amendment rights.

larryh1108
May 12, 2013, 07:36 AM
If what has happened hasn't given good reason to those who do not vote the desire to vote out the antis, then I don't know what it will take. Everyone here who did not vote basically gave a vote to Obama and anyone else who is anti-gun. We have to show those on the fence who is really in charge in 2014 and 2016, the voters. Not voting is an individual choice but as we've seen, we have to show up in force on election day or it will only be a matter of time before they get their way.

SleazyRider
May 12, 2013, 08:11 AM
Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere, so until the citizens of New York, California, Illinois, and elsewhere enjoy the same protections afforded by the Bill of Rights, we aren't out of the woods.

Pilot
May 12, 2013, 08:26 AM
It is time to go on the offensive, and start getting the rights we've already lost, especially on the state levels, rolled back. Instead of fighting their push for more illegal restrictions, let them fight our push for a change.

steelerdude99
May 12, 2013, 09:22 AM
In those states that wrote laws supporting Second Amendment Rights crime will drop. In those states those in states that passed more restrictive gun laws crime will increase. After a few years those states where crime increased will look for an answer as to “why?”. The obvious reason will not be accepted and their mindset will tell them it must be because of the states with what they call “lax gun laws” (what THR readers know as freedom). So, the gun control groups in NJ, NY, CA, IL and the new ones like CT will try to influence elections in states that don’t trample on Second Amendment Rights by funding anti-gun candidates. It’s not that NJ, NY, CA and IL did not have plenty of restrictive gun laws to begin with. A few states are trying to one up one another by having the most restrictive gun laws.

I’m not sure where CO sits on the issue. I hear from other THR threads that there are recall petitions circulating to rid CO of the anti-gun politicians in hopes of repealing the recently enacted gun control laws. That can be a slow process as first enough “in-person” signatures must be validated against registered voter lists. IF that passes, a recall election is held. IF the new Pro Second Amendment candidate wins, there must be a new bill introduced, passed and signed by a governor who signed the anti-gun law in the first place. More likely, a recall election sends a message to anti-gun candidates that their role in the legislative process can be cut short.

All the while, the president will push for more gun control an every opportunity. I saw him push gun control yesterday (it may have been coverage from May 10) while giving a speech in front of a few rows of police officers. It’s an implied lie as the message that the president is sending is: The police want gun control and gun control is the only way to stop crime. The president is also willing to give away U.S. Sovereignty to the UN.

Just one guy’s opinion,
Chuck

docsleepy
May 13, 2013, 06:43 AM
Our church's second "reloading party "will be next Saturday. It's a small church. 13 people showed up for the first one! I count now seven different presses in our church.

You just have to keep pushing forward.

flylo
May 13, 2013, 10:13 AM
IMHO I think we're in the "eye of the storm" while the antis reload & rethink their statagy.

scaatylobo
May 13, 2013, 10:39 AM
I see things getting very interesting in as much as the Gov is really upset that all have not bowed down to his will.

We in this county [ Niagara ] just sent all 14 votes to repeal or throw out his "brilliant idea" that he rammed through without it being read by those that voted it in ?.

It liiks like Cuomo is shooting himself in the foot REAL early in his bid to be on the ballot for prez.

And I see Hillary has a friend [ Ben Ghazi ] that is going to hurt her BIGTIME.

As long as the present putz dont get the right to run again,we might be looking at a real Govt,by and FOR the people - once again.

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