9mm Ammo Question


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45R
February 3, 2003, 04:20 PM
Does anyone have the specs for 124gr. Geco ammo in the blue and black boxes. I have heard reports that this ammo is loaed well about +P SAAMI specs. Heard this "GECO is loaded to CIP (International) specs, max 9mm pressure is 39,200 psi, above the SAAMI limit of 35,000 for std, 38,500 for +P."

Is this true? I was planning on buying a case of this 124gr ammo, but I dont want to give my guns a steady diet of super " Hot " ammo. I was planning on shooting this out of my Sig 226 since it seems that 124gr is what it likes.

TIA

45R

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goon
February 3, 2003, 06:00 PM
Try a box. I have a SIG, and I doubt that a few hot rounds would hurt it, especially if it is commercial ammo made for the caliber that you have. You would know if it is too hot within about 3 shots anyway.
My brother tried a box of Fiocchi 115gr JHP one time. Several of the rounds sounded and recoiled "like a 357" in his words.
"Strange", thought I, "a 9mm should be mild and gentle, at least on the friendly end."
Upon closer inspection, we found that several of the casings were split the whole way up the side. Some of the unfired rounds seemed too short, suggesting that the bullets were seated too deep. That is a big No-No with a 9mm (know this from reloading manuals), since there is little room for error with the small 9mm case anyway.
We returned the ammo, and barring SHTF on a massive scale, I will never touch Fiocchi ammo again.
But, to the point. My brother's 9mm held up just fine.
But it is your right hand, and your eyes and worst case scenario, your life. Do what your gut tells you.

garrettwc
February 3, 2003, 07:17 PM
It is NATO spec ammo. German made. A little hotter than the usual US made stuff, but it is good ammo. I've shot quite a bit through a Browning HiPower with no ill effects.

T.Stahl
February 4, 2003, 05:34 AM
I've shot more than 1500-2000 rounds of the black&blue 124gr FMJ Geco ammo through my Glock and have been quite satisfied with them. They are a bit on the hotter side, +P probably, but not as hot as 100gr Hirtenberger JSP. Geco used to advertise them as THE ammo for Glocks.

Be aware that the bullets have a steel jacket. Just in case you don't like steel jacketed ammo.

Currently I prefer the IMI 124gr FMJ. Same performance, lower price.

762x51
February 4, 2003, 10:35 AM
Don't have specific specs but have put about a case through my P99 and am working on my second case. Very good ammo albeit a bit on the dirty side. Seems a tad hotter that the Winchester white box 115s and American Eagle 124s I was shooting before. Nothing too crazy though. Where are you planning on buying yours from? The website I have gotten mine from in the past seems to have gone belly up. :(

45R
February 4, 2003, 03:07 PM
762x51

I can get the ammo at my local gun store. The sell for round 6.99 a box in these parts. Real good ammo. If you need a number let me know.

T.Stahl
Didnt know that the casing was steel though. It looks like brass, has the same color as brass.

Were can I find IMI ammo?

ENC
February 4, 2003, 03:27 PM
Umm

He said steel jacket (outside of bullet itself) not case

45R
February 4, 2003, 03:33 PM
Doh!!!! Oppssss :what:

My little booo boooo

cheygriz
February 4, 2003, 03:36 PM
CIP is STANDARD pressure for 9MM ammo manufactured outside of the U. S.

The rest of the world does not consider this to be "hot" ammo, just normal 9MM ammo.

If your pistol IS NOT American made, you should have no problems with European ammo.

American 9MM is loaded very light in deference to junk 9MM guns like the S&W 39, and Spanish and Italian junk brought back from the wars.

Zak Smith
February 4, 2003, 03:38 PM
I have shot about 2k rounds of the 124gr GECO 9x19.

This has a mild steel jacket on the bullets, which will wear on the barrel a little more than a copper jacket. But remember, old .45ACP ball had mild steel jackets, too.

I have no pressure measurements for the GECO 125gr, but I have chronographed it. Depending on ambient temperature, I get around 1115 fps out of a full-size 9mm. This is in the range of normal-pressure 9mm, but of course we don't know what powder they used.

-z

T.Stahl
February 4, 2003, 03:45 PM
Where to find IMI ammo:

At your pro-Israeli dealer perhaps? ;)

COHIBA
February 4, 2003, 03:59 PM
if its the same as the black tip SAMPSON stuff 'd stay away from it in anything but full size HK's and glocks.

T.Stahl
February 4, 2003, 05:05 PM
No black tip, just regular 124gr FMJ. Not hotter than similar Geco or Fiocchi.

45R
February 4, 2003, 10:15 PM
Thanks for the information. I'm going to the local gun store to get some Geco ammo. :)

45R
February 5, 2003, 11:32 AM
I just got an email from KBC on the Walther Forum regarding the use of Geco ammo. He emailed Dynamit Nobel.

I got an email from Dynamit Nobel.
Here it is. (I have replaced the European decimals
with commas that we in the states use)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
the max pressure Geco 9mm is determined by the
CIP-Regulations: 2,350 bar.

Nr. 212 5870, Geco FMJ, 124 gr., Vo of 360m/s
(1,181fps) from 125mm test barrel, energey Eo 518
Joule:
is loaded to 2,100 up to 2,200 bar; piezo-quartz
measurement, position of measurement hole: 12mm from
head of case (internal case pressure measurement,
barrel length 125mm).

Sincerely,
Andreas Paggel
Market Analyst

Dynamit Nobel - RWS Inc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So, according to the manufacturer, this particular
Geco 9mm cartridge is loaded within SAAMI std pressure
limits (max 35,000psi).
My conversions:
2100 bar = 30,458 psi
2200 bar = 31,908 psi
2350 bar = 34,084 psi



I'm going to continue using this ammo for the Sig P226. :)

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