40 S&W data


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Metalman1
June 22, 2013, 04:13 PM
I've been looking for 40 S&W reload data for Remington 180 gr. encapsulated flat nose. I found everything else but. I have the Lyman's book and Robert Lee's book. Help with powder load and OAL. I have found some data information but I don't feel comfortable using it. Thanks.

LH

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bds
June 22, 2013, 04:26 PM
What powders do you have?

Metalman1
June 22, 2013, 04:57 PM
I have long shot, 231. Lets start with those. I have one more but for the life of me I can't think of it. :banghead:

HOOfan_1
June 22, 2013, 05:01 PM
Hogdon lists 4.4-5.1 grains for W231 for 180gr. I use 5 grains in mine and it is actually a pretty light load, cycles my FNP find though. 1.125" as OAL

6.5-8.0 grains for Longshot

bds
June 22, 2013, 05:14 PM
For Remington FN bullet, you should be OK using load data for Berry's plated FP and Hornady XTP HP bullets.

Current Hodgdon load data - http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp
180 gr Berry's FP Wi231 OAL 1.125" Start 4.4 gr (872 fps) 26,400 PSI - Max 5.1 gr (984 fps) 33,500 PSI

180 gr Hornady XTP W231 OAL 1.125" Start 4.1 gr (797 fps) 23,800 PSI - Max 5.0 gr (947 fps) 32,900 PSI


180 gr Berry's FP Longshot OAL 1.125" Start 6.3 gr (1013 fps) 26,200 PSI Max 7.5 gr (1150 fps) 33,400 PSI

180 gr Hornady XTP Longshot OAL 1.125" Start 6.5 gr (1009 fps) 25,000 PSI - Max 8.0 gr (1159 fps) 32,300 PSI

Lyman #49 used .401" groove diameter test barrel for their pressure testing and often will show higher than powder manufacturers' load data for 40S&W. If your barrel's groove diameter is more typical .400", I would suggest using the lower powder manufacturers' start charges to conduct your powder work up.

With 180 gr jacketed/plated truncated flat point bullets, 4.3 - 4.5 gr of W231/HP-38 at 1.125" OAL will cycle the slides of my 40S&W Glocks to produce lighter recoiling target loads. 1.125" OAL will work with most pistols but of course, use the OAL that works with your pistol/barrel - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=8864541#post8864541

FWIW, my preferred target load for 40S&W is 165 gr Montana Gold JHP with 5.0 gr of W231/HP-38 at 1.125" OAL.

steve4102
June 22, 2013, 06:59 PM
Lee data is just a copy of Old powder manufacturer's data. It's best to put that book aside and go to the source. All of the powder manufacturer's have Free on-line data that is more up to date than the Lee Second addition.

Hodgdon, Win and IMR powders can be found here.

http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp

Accurate powders here.

http://www.accuratepowder.com/

Ramshot here.

http://www.ramshot.com/

Allinant here. Note the warning page, read it to understand their data.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/default.aspx

It is perfectly acceptable to use published load data of Same weight bullets with similar construction of different manufacturers and design. Just Start Low and Work Up.

Metalman1
June 22, 2013, 10:25 PM
The third powder is Power Pistol Powder. Everyone has been great helping me with the other powders and I need help with this one. I'm also looking for data with 165 gr. 40 S&W.
Yes sorry about that.

HOOfan_1
June 22, 2013, 10:35 PM
The third powder is Pistol Powder. Everyone has been great helping me with the other powders and I need help with this one. I'm also looking for data with 165 gr. 40 S&W.

Power pistol maybe?

steve4102's links are where all the information in this thread originated.

BTW Power Pistol is made by Alliant.

Alliant only lists the max loads on their website and suggests you start your load workup at 10% less than the max load....so take whatever powder weight they list and multiply it by .9 and that is your starting load.

bds
June 23, 2013, 11:38 AM
steve4102's links are where all the information in this thread originated.
Good point. Always good to provide source for posted load data. I added link to Hodgdon load data for my previous post I pulled my 180 gr load data from.


The third powder is Power Pistol ... I'm also looking for data with 165 gr. 40 S&W
Here's current Alliant load data for Power Pistol (use 10% reduction as start charge) - http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/powderlist.aspx?type=1&powderid=8&cartridge=29
40 S&W 165 gr Speer GDHP Power Pistol OAL 1.12" Max 7.8 gr (1,081 fps)

40 S&W 180 gr Speer GDHP Power Pistol OAL 1.12" Max 7.2 gr (1,013 fps)


Here's current Hodgdon load data for W231/Longshot - http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp
165 gr Berry's FP W231/HP-38 OAL 1.125" Start 4.7 gr (933 fps) 25,200 PSI - Max 5.4 gr (1049 fps) 33,400 PSI

165 gr Sierra JHP W231/HP-38 OAL 1.125" Start 4.8 gr (946 fps) 28,100 PSI - Max 5.3 gr (1001 fps) 32,500 PSI

180 gr Berry's FP W231/HP-38 OAL 1.125" Start 4.4 gr (872 fps) 26,400 PSI - Max 5.1 gr (984 fps) 33,500 PSI

180 gr Hornady XTP W231/HP-38 OAL 1.125" Start 4.1 gr (797 fps) 23,800 PSI - Max 5.0 gr (947 fps) 32,900 PSI


165 gr Berry's FP Longshot OAL 1.125" Start 6.9 gr (1091 fps) 24,500 PSI - Max 7.8 gr (1199 fps) 32,300 PSI

165 gr Sierra JHP Longshot OAL 1.125" Start 7.3 gr (1139 fps) 29,600 PSI - Max 7.8 gr (1185 fps) 33,400 PSI

180 gr Berry's FP Longshot OAL 1.125" Start 6.3 gr (1013 fps) 26,200 PSI Max 7.5 gr (1150 fps) 33,400 PSI

180 gr Hornady XTP Longshot OAL 1.125" Start 6.5 gr (1009 fps) 25,000 PSI - Max 8.0 gr (1159 fps) 32,300 PSI

Metalman1
June 23, 2013, 05:29 PM
So I can use the same data for a FN that I would use for a HP? So what about a round point? What bullet reload data is the same as a FN?

bds
June 23, 2013, 06:31 PM
This is for jacketed bullets - Due to the hollow cavity in the nose of the HP bullet, the bullet length is longer and the bullet base will get seated deeper in the case than same weight round nose or flat nose bullets at the same OAL which increases chamber pressure. So if you are using RN/FN bullets at longer than listed OAL, you can use HP load data as the RN/FN bullet bases would be seated not as deep which lowers chamber pressures.


But keep in mind that Berry's bullets are plated and not jacketed. I included the plated load data for flat point bullet as you should be able to use the plated load data for jacketed bullet but my guess is that the Remington encapsulated FN bullet is copper plated. Picture below shows a factory Remington 45AUTO RN round (RP head stamp) pulled apart to show a plated bullet. Does your bullets have a disk at the base or is it completely copper covered? If it is completely copper covered without a distinct disk at the base, it is a plated bullet and you should be able to use load data for Berry's plated flat point bullet.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=180682&d=1362283379

Metalman1
June 24, 2013, 01:27 AM
This is for jacketed bullets - Due to the hollow cavity in the nose of the HP bullet, the bullet length is longer and the bullet base will get seated deeper in the case than same weight round nose or flat nose bullets at the same OAL which increases chamber pressure. So if you are using RN/FN bullets at longer than listed OAL, you can use HP load data as the RN/FN bullet bases would be seated not as deep which lowers chamber pressures.


But keep in mind that Berry's bullets are plated and not jacketed. I included the plated load data for flat point bullet as you should be able to use the plated load data for jacketed bullet but my guess is that the Remington encapsulated FN bullet is copper plated. Picture below shows a factory Remington 45AUTO RN round (RP head stamp) pulled apart to show a plated bullet. Does your bullets have a disk at the base or is it completely copper covered? If it is completely copper covered without a distinct disk at the base, it is a plated bullet and you should be able to use load data for Berry's plated flat point bullet.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=180682&d=1362283379
Yes the bullet is completely covered without the disk. So I have 500 plated bullets.
Thanks for the info bds. There is more to reloading than I thought. I have all the parts to reload but, I'm not comfortable yet to start. Maybe soon.

bds
June 24, 2013, 01:43 AM
Since they are plated bullets, you should use the load data for Berry's plated bullets for W231 and Longshot.

For Power Pistol, there is no current Alliant load data for plated bullets and Berry's recommends using start-to-mid range jacketed load data (http://www.berrysmfg.com/faq-q9-c1-How_do_I_load_Berrys_Preferred_Plated_Bullets.aspx). So for 180 gr plated bullet, start charge of jacketed load data max of 7.2 gr would be 6.5 gr with mid range around 6.8 gr.

With Berry's plated bullets, I have used lead load data with good results and 2004 Alliant load data (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=182147&d=1364769070) has lead load data for 180 gr lead bullets. 10% reduction of 6.9 gr for start charge would be 6.2 gr.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=185608&stc=1&d=1372049917

Metalman1
June 24, 2013, 10:37 AM
. There is no copper on the bottom. I was looking at my Rainier plated bullets. My mistake. This is what happens when I don't take my time. So they are jacketed 180 gr. 40 S&W. is there any other data I need besides what I have been told already?

bds
June 24, 2013, 10:50 AM
If they are indeed jacketed bullets with exposed lead base, you should be fine using the posted load data for jacketed/plated bullets.

Of course as a rule, determine the OAL that works for your pistol/barrel first then conduct your powder work up from start charge.

So the bullet base looks like this picture of factory Remington load?
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=180679&d=1362282951

Metalman1
June 24, 2013, 11:12 AM
Thanks again for all the help.

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