Belling rifle case mouths?


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Muddydogs
June 27, 2013, 12:03 AM
I mostly load Speer Grand Slam bullets that have a flat base. I just loaded some 30/30 and decided to bell the case mouth a little to help with bullet starting since these rounds needed crimped as they are for a tubular magazine. Well the bullets are a lot easier to start and of course there is very little copper shavings. So I got to thinking that belling for other rifle calibers would probably help out but I'm not sure if I would need to set the crimp on these to remove the bell or if I keep the belling light I would be alright without a crimp?

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788Ham
June 27, 2013, 12:27 AM
Do you also bevel and chamfer the case mouths? This helps tremendously when using flat based bullets. Even though you might get a tight fit, after B and C'ing the cases, you might want to crimp anyway, since the tubular magazine. Just another option to consider.

shinz
June 27, 2013, 12:44 AM
Belling case mouths is normally only done for loading caste bullets. It should be sufficient to champfer the inside of the case mouth with a case mouth champfer tool which should be on every reloaders bench,the Lee one does a decent job & costs very little, the machined steel ones like this one https://a248.e.akamai.net/f/248/9086/10h/origin-d4.scene7.com/is/image/GanderMountainOvertons/424775_L1?$product$ do a better job but cost a little more. +1 on the recommendation to crimp the neck for loading in a tubular mag.
Steve.

Certaindeaf
June 27, 2013, 12:52 AM
.So I got to thinking that belling for other rifle calibers would probably help out but I'm not sure if I would need to set the crimp on these to remove the bell or if I keep the belling light I would be alright without a crimp?
You don't have to "set the crimp" in those cases, just erase it/"iron it out".
Don't bell (or crimp) where you don't have to.

rcmodel
June 27, 2013, 01:25 AM
Chamfer the case mouths slightly, and there is no need or good reason to bell a rifle case when seating flat base jacketed bullets.

Your typical rifle seating die will not do a good job of returning the belled case mouth to normal straightness and case neck tension, unless you crimp.

Which you shouldn't, unless forced too by an elephant rifle caliber recoil, or a tube magazine.

rc

DeadFlies
June 27, 2013, 08:45 AM
I load both cast and jacketed in 30-30.

With jacketed bullets, I don't bell or flare the case mouth; the jacketed bullets go right in. For cast bullets I bell the case mouth just a little with a needle nose pliers.

In either case I give 'em a good crimp with the Lee FCD. Tube mag, ya know.

Muddydogs
June 27, 2013, 09:25 AM
Thanks RC, this is what I was trying to get at.
Your typical rifle seating die will not do a good job of returning the belled case mouth to normal straightness and case neck tension, unless you crimp.rc

I get a little copper shaving off the bullets when seating them, Is this normal?
Do I need to chamfer the inside a little more? I am using the RCBS inside chamfer and a Lyman outside Chamfer tool on the RCBS trim mate and I seem to be getting a good bevel inside while I just knock off the excess outside.

The only rounds I crimp are 30/30 and AR 223, all the rest of my rifle rounds go uncrimped.

jwrowland77
June 27, 2013, 09:44 AM
Get a VLD tool. Should be good to go without belling.

I load V-Max for my .223, has flat bottom, use VLD tool, no issues.

Certaindeaf
June 27, 2013, 09:45 AM
I'd not crimp the .223.. most people don't.

Muddydogs
June 27, 2013, 10:00 AM
I'd not crimp the .223.. most people don't.
I have read most of the pros and cons on crimping AR 223 rounds and I decided that crimping them was a good idea. My 100 yard groups are great with my load so for me I don't see any reason not to crimp for the AR. I don't want this to turn into a debate about crimping 223 for the AR as there's already a ton of posts covering this subject.

rbernie
June 27, 2013, 10:29 AM
I get a little copper shaving off the bullets when seating them, Is this normal?No.

Do I need to chamfer the inside a little more? Sounds like it.

gamestalker
June 27, 2013, 03:35 PM
I wouldn't want to bell a case when it's not necessary, it over works the brass, which in turn shortens it's life span. Ream and chamfering after trimming is all that's needed to seat without shaving with jacketed bullets. But as for crimping, that's fine for a tubular magazine fed weapon, though I've never had problems with set back with the one's I've loaded.

GS

Certaindeaf
June 27, 2013, 03:42 PM
I have read most of the pros and cons on crimping AR 223 rounds and I decided that crimping them was a good idea. My 100 yard groups are great with my load so for me I don't see any reason not to crimp for the AR. I don't want this to turn into a debate about crimping 223 for the AR as there's already a ton of posts covering this subject.
I understand that you're a big boy. I quadruple knot my shoelaces though I trip on them with every step.

GLOOB
June 27, 2013, 04:13 PM
If you use a Lyman M die, you do not have to crimp to remove the flare. You also do not need any inside chamfer. You also do not need any neck lube.

I use one for all my rifle calibers, whether I'm loading jacketed or cast, crimped or not.

Walkalong
June 27, 2013, 04:19 PM
Chamfer the case mouths slightly, and there is no need or good reason to bell a rifle case when seating flat base jacketed bullets.Exactly right.

You do not need to chamfer very much, just enough to remove burrs and knock the 90 degree edge off. If you do this and are getting shavings you did not chamfer quite enough or are starting the bullets crooked.

788Ham
June 27, 2013, 11:57 PM
My reason for saying to crimp, : I've read a crimp should be used on a tubular magazine, like a Win. 94, or Marlin 336, to keep the bullets tight in the case. My only reason for stating as such. Flaring the mouth isn't the same as belling, I didn't state that though.

243winxb
June 28, 2013, 12:00 AM
Belling rifle case mouths? Only for cast rifle bullet , using a Lyman "M" die.

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