600 yard shooting and trouble understanding how to use a mildot scope


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Sentryau2
June 27, 2013, 12:25 AM
Ok so I want to start shooting around 100-600 yards and am looking to buy a scope. However before I buy a scope I want to get familiar with how to use the scope. Today I spent around 15-30mins with a friends rifle and scope system. I did not even attempt to dial in using the turrets, instead I simply used the mil dot reticle for windage and hold over for drop. I would really like some help understanding the mil dot reticle with moa turrets. I have read up alot and I just cannot for the life of me understand it. I tried to use this http://www.shooterready.com/lrsdemo.html to get an understanding but it did not help. My range estimations were off the wind chart is wrong and it just led to alot of frustration. At this point I'm ready to just drop the idea of even buying a scope. HOW in the WORLD do you figure out the windage while using a scope with moa turrets? I thought I could simply use shooter solution free to get the drop and the wind drift but no it does not work what so ever at least with the simulation

At 500 yards a 69gr SMK has a drop of -11.09moa and a drift of 3.05 in 5mph blowing from 9:00 to 300 SO if I zeroed my scope at 100 yards all I would have to do is adjust the turrets to those measurements right? :confused: I had NO problem hitting targets with shooter soultion when I was useing mils and doing hold over. I was on target 75% of the time from 200 yards to around 6-700 and this is sitting in a modified cross legged position (my friend was generous enough to show me)

I was thinking of buying this scope http://www.opticsplanet.com/leapers-utg-3-12x44mm-swat-ie-ao-mildot-ez-tap-water-proof-riflescope.html and If I enjoy shooting at distance (I did for the few minutes I was able to) I would upgrade to a better quality scope.

I think I am slowly beginning to understand but it is still a bit fuzzy and I refuse to even look at "shooterready demo" again. It caused me nothing but pain :mad:

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back40
June 27, 2013, 12:32 AM
how, exactly did you dial the dope?

if it were me, i'd save myself the headache and the money and steer way clear of that leapers scope.

Sentryau2
June 27, 2013, 12:40 AM
I plan to go shooting in a few weeks I got a buddy coming from AZ with this scope on a .223 rem with a 24inch barrel. I'll post what I've learned but I would still really like some help and info on moa vs mill 1mil=3.375moa correct? If I sight it in at 100 yards should I use hold over or dial in with the turrets? What is more accurate we will be shooting at clay disks on a range (with marked distances) 100-200-300-400 and 500 marked lines.

Can someone recoment a mil/mil scope thats under 500$?

back40
June 27, 2013, 12:46 AM
1 mil = 3.43 moa.

if your drop is 11.09 moa @ 500... what are you dialing with the turret?

Sentryau2
June 27, 2013, 12:54 AM
I would dial 11 correct? But I did research and found out why I was having so much difficulty with said simulator, the ranges/bullet drop are know to be off by a decent bit (so I'm not completely clueless)

splithoof
June 27, 2013, 01:10 AM
Get a copy of Plaster's book about sniping, and it will make the mil-dot understanding much easier. While Mil dots can be used for hold-over, they were designed to help the sniper determine range.
A good Mil dot optic for under $500? "letmethinkaboutitno" Don't waste your $$ ;you will get exactly what you pay for.

The_Armed_Therapist
June 27, 2013, 10:47 AM
The Bushnell Elite Tactical 10X Mil-Dot is good. I know because I have and use one.

www.sniperflashcards.com is a helpful place.

Even if you find a "guide" for a particular caliber, numerous other factors make different loads for that caliber sometimes dramatically different. I shoot .30-06 with my Mil-Dot... 150-grain stuff. To use 180-grain past 300 yards sees dramatic differences.

Also keep in mind that I don't think the Mil-Dot system was meant to hit bullseyes or prairie dogs at 600 yards. Like mentioned, it's more of a ranging tool. When practiced, you can range quickly for "good estimate" shots. In other words, "Minute-of-badguy" type accuracy... center of mass. It can work for precision shooting, don't get me wrong. But if that's the goal, then there are better scope systems.

I don't consider myself extremely knowledgeable on this; I'm just sharing what I understand to be the case.

Sentryau2
June 27, 2013, 10:51 AM
I have pretty much figured everything out. thanks for all of your help.

Ar180shooter
June 27, 2013, 05:01 PM
I would dial 11 correct? But I did research and found out why I was having so much difficulty with said simulator, the ranges/bullet drop are know to be off by a decent bit (so I'm not completely clueless)
Most scopes adjust by 1/4 or 1/2 MOA per click. Some are a little odd like the M3 turrets on the Leupold Mark 4 LR/T, where elevation adjusts in 1 minute/click, and windage is in 1/2 minutes.

beatledog7
June 27, 2013, 07:08 PM
Check out the NSSF videos on shooting with a scope (3 or 4, including on milrads). Great info!

Sentryau2
June 27, 2013, 11:19 PM
@Ar180shooter I know 1 click = .25 moa 4 clicks = 1 moa and it has each moa numbered with the click lines between the numbers

back40
June 28, 2013, 07:09 AM
1 click = .25 moa 4 clicks = 1 moa

this is what i was getting at. i've seen guys struggle with sighting in due to not understanding their scope being 1/4 moa, 1/8 moa etc.

also, depending how far off your shots were, most will tell you that any ballistics program or calculator is a fairly rough guideline, and that you must shoot at each of your intended ranges to confirm dope for that range. all rifle/load combos behave differently.

Ar180shooter
June 28, 2013, 09:59 PM
@Ar180shooter I know 1 click = .25 moa 4 clicks = 1 moa and it has each moa numbered with the click lines between the numbers
So you're dialing 44 clicks or 11 MOA? Just making sure. Like back40, I've seen guys struggle with this.

I also agree that a ballistics program is a very rough guide. When shooting .223 at 500 yards, I find that they can sometimes be off as much as 2 MOA as compared to what the calculator says, which can mean you're not even on target. This is likely due to things like variances in atmospheric pressure, temperature, etc.

vaeevictiss
June 28, 2013, 10:43 PM
If you have an android download the app Shooter. It's a couple bucks but well worth it.

You need to know everything about the rifle and round but it is amazing what the app can do. It's spot on.

I think iphones can get it too

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

taliv
June 29, 2013, 01:26 PM
Shooter WILL put you on the target if you set it up correctly.

Yesterday I took 4 shots on four targets Two on ipsc heads (6x6" and 4x4") at 591 yards and two on a 6" and 4" circles at 670 yards. All hits first round using dope from shooter.

Days before I got first round hit on 1087 yard 12" circle

It really is garbage in garbage out though.

BigG
June 29, 2013, 03:37 PM
I would get a Leupold scope rather than any other brand if I wanted accuracy especially with something you're trying to get results at long range by dialing the knobs. You got to pay for the stuff that works. Most of the other brands won't have repeatable adjustments or accuracy.

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