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blarby
July 2, 2013, 10:33 AM
So, im finally expanding my scavaging to include hulls that aren't Remington for my use this winter when I'd rather be inside loading than outside shooting in the rain.

I'm having a little difficulty classifying some of the hulls im getting , in reference to the Lyman Shotshell Reloading handbook recipes.

Not many, but there are the hard ones :

1. Federal "Top Gun" - purple shell with paper basewad. 2.75" : would this be considered the generic " federal plastic with paper basewad " ? The one in the diagram shows high brass.........

2. Winchester Universal - This one looks closest to the "Winchester Polyformed Plastic with Plastic Baswed" although the basewad in the shell is white, not yellow per the diagram. 2.75"

3. Winchester Super X : This appears much as the winchester "universal" as listed above- are they in fact the same ? 2.75"


I'm not looking for a lot of use for these hulls- IE multiple firings in good condition....I'm just looking to load them for one use with either a slug or 12 30 cal pellets for the stash. Recipes I have, I just want to make sure I'm using the right ones !

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oneounceload
July 2, 2013, 12:21 PM
Not the best hulls, but of those three, the federals would get the nod from me. Otherwise, see if some of your buds can spare you some of the Remington hulls (any flavor) or Win AA

rsrocket1
July 2, 2013, 12:28 PM
Federal Top Gun Hulls: Same load data as normal Federal plastic hulls (Estate hulls load the same). Don't pick up hulls if you aren't sure they've ever gotten wet. The paper base could get loose and lodge in the barrel, next shot: barrel bulge. These cases also are less efficient in terms of needing more powder than Rem's for the same payload. Use straight walled hull wads for these or else your powder could sneak around the base.

Winchester Universal and Super X hulls: Winchester officially recommends not reloading them, but many people load and shoot them just fine. Load data is the same as the AA hulls, but the hull walls are quite a bit thinner than the Remington and Federal hulls. Don't compress the wad or you may get a top looking like a circus tent within a couple of hours/days/weeks. You also run the risk of buckling the hull wall with these. Also take a hull and cut about 90-180 degrees down to the base to see if you wad fits and does not get caught on the lip of the base. If it doesn't you're GTG.

I wanted to do the same, but where I shoot, I can pick up so many GC hulls that I'm getting to the point not wanting to pick up hulls, but I can't seem to stop!

blarby
July 2, 2013, 02:24 PM
Helpful stuff, thanks!

There are plenty of good GC hulls here too, but i went through almost 3k last year.

Granted, my powder supply is less thos year ATM.... but primers were the stopping point component last year, and thats not in the cards this time around !

Being in oregon, i get the wet paper basewad deal.... but we're in the short dry season right now, so i cam get em while the getting is good ! I got almost a 5 gallon pail of those federals yesterday alone !

They look like theyd make a great one shot buckshot hull....and i'll take the free pressure bump from the wad !

morcey2
July 2, 2013, 04:19 PM
I use lots of the top gun/estate hulls. I use them in medium-ish practice loads. I reload them once and toss them. Same with the Winchester universals. They're not my preferred hull, but they work. I use gun club hulls when I can get them and AA or Nitro/STS hulls when someone else buys the loaded ammo first. :)

Matt

rbernie
July 2, 2013, 05:57 PM
The Winchester SuperX and SuperSpeed and Universal hulls are the same. They also won't hold a crimp worth a hoot and I'd not waste the time trying to make them work. Goodness knows that I've tried and regret the effort.

Fed hulls, BTW, are straight walled inside and need different wads than you'd use for STS and AA hulls.

MSgtEgress
July 2, 2013, 07:12 PM
In my 30+ years of reloading, the WW AA are the best. I have 15+ loadings on most of my red and silver hulls and the newest dark gray hulls are damn near indestructible. I have over 20+ reloads in most of them before the crimp folds split. I have also had good luck with the old Peters "Blue Magic" hulls but they aren't in production any more. I've never liked Federal hulls due to the reasons given previously My 2 cents

oneounceload
July 2, 2013, 08:17 PM
But he doesn't have AA hulls, ( he needs to get them or Remington) but of the ones he has...............

rcmodel
July 2, 2013, 08:49 PM
A long time ago, I used to section every different hull I came across, compared internal construction to known hulls, then wrote the Wad & powder charge it took to load them.

And hung it behind my shotshell loaders.

A quick glance at the hull & head-stamp and I knew instantly what load combination would work in them.

Might be worthwhile today for a hull scrounger to start doing?

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j219/rcmodel/KTOG/ShotShellCut-Aways_zps2ec24634.jpg

rc

oneounceload
July 2, 2013, 09:04 PM
Possibly, RC, except many hulls have been reformatted like the current powders - paper has given way to plastic in some; one piece are now two piece in others, and on and on we go.........................................

rcmodel
July 2, 2013, 09:11 PM
I know that.

You might have noticed compression formed hulls, and plastic base wad hulls, and so forth in the photo.

All I was saying is that, if you insist on picking up everything you find?

Section one of each and find out how they are made, and what other brands compare to them in internal construction.

rc

FROGO207
July 2, 2013, 09:35 PM
^^^^ I agree with RC. I tried to read the info and figure out what was what as to how the hulls were made. I even tried inserting a dowel and marking it. Well sectioning them and actually seeing the construction HAS helped me immensely. There are two basic types, straight walled, and tapered that I have found so far. I see that a lot of those hulls that are foreign and/or promo are usually Reo style or Cheddite. I have found some that will not take a crimp but will respond to an overshot card and roll crimp for a single use. I still am experimenting with the various hulls as I am basically a cheap reloader and cannot pass up free stuff.:D

gamestalker
July 3, 2013, 12:03 AM
I wouldn't personally consider the Win. Universal. I've messed with them a few times, and they always give me problems with extraction in every single one of my 870's.

And I've never been very fond of any of the Federal's.

Can't go wrong with AA, Blue Magic, STS, and a few others that I just can't seem to recall at the moment. I still have giant trash bags stuffed full of those Blue Magics from back in the early 80's. I used to stock pile hulls every chance I got, as would my boys while working at the trap and skeet clubs.

But I know what your getting at, my Son will stuff a load in just about any hull he scrounges, and he also blows some up now and then too, I don't play like that.

GS

blarby
July 3, 2013, 12:38 AM
I really like RC's idea.

I think that is goingto be mandatory now that im grabbingmore than remmy hulls.

To clarify : these arent going to be trophy reloads, or hulls I expect to fire overand over again. At most. they will be loaded one last time with either a bulk buckshot load, ora cheap slug and trapwad combo for training new shooters on shotgun asics with cheap ammo, plinking, or general stash use.

thanks for your continuing help !

Once i find loads that function well with cheap components, i will post em all for everyones use.

oldreloader
July 3, 2013, 02:10 AM
I use AA data for Universals and Claybusters has a 1oz (CB6100) and a 1 1/8 oz (CB6118) wads that work with all straight walled Federals and Euro (Rio, Estate, Etc.) that work well for me.

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