Picture youself in a post-appocolypic world, think of the movie "the Postman"
You are alone, a wonderer and you have an unlimited choice of weaponry, except that you must be able to pack everything and still beable to survive. In the movie, he had a .30 carbine, good choice I thought, in the book though, he only had a .38 revolver, not so good choice. What would you pick and why?
Me, I wold have a sawed off shotgun, a good side arm in a man-stopping caliber and a .22 rifle. The shotgun for it's close quaters combat abilities (I think I would not want to engage a person too far off and avoidance would be my rule of thumb, besides, if I got sniped, well, not much you can do about that anyway) The sidearm for the same reason, and the 22 for food harvest, no where to store a deer or larger game so my diet would be rabbits, squirrels and the such and the 22 can be very quiet and you can packs lots of ammo.
What say you?
If you enjoyed reading about "arm yourself!" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
March 20, 2004, 11:13 AM
i would have an M1A and a 9para of some sort. only because i would probly be able to get hold of more rounds if i needed them and besides the M1A is a bad mother. a 22 pistol couldn't hurt either
March 20, 2004, 11:33 AM
my M1 Garand and my gov't .45 (If they're good enough to stop the Nazis they're good enough for me) and probably my .22 rifle, because it is great for small game hunting and I can carry a lot of ammo for it.
March 20, 2004, 11:41 AM
Ruger Blackhawk with dual 357/9mm cylinders. Times two.
Marlin 357Mag levergun, 16" or 18" carbine version.
One of those 410/22 over/under "survival guns". Hoard 410s for emergency hunting; do most small-game hunting with the 22. Carried folded in the pack most of the time.
Also a 22 minirevolver, pref. the reasonably accurate 4" barrel "MiniMaster" with both 22LR/22Magnum cylinders. Two if possible, as they're small. This is a small-game "sneak up on a squirrel" gun and last-ditch defense backup. Hoard 22Magnums for defense; I'm assuming 22LR will be easier to come by, at least for a while. One is carried up your sleeve for that "surprise!" effect.
Reasoning: you need to travel light. 125grain 357 ammo is compact and lightweight for the delivered punch, and is widely available as is 38Spl. You can also use whatever 9mm you can scrounge up.
Another thing I'd want, BAD, and I'd make one out of a couple spools of 20 - 30lb test fishing line and some lead weights: a Polynesian-style throwing net for fishing. About a 14ft spread would allow river or larger water body use. *Nothing* else can reliably scoop up as much food faster under a variety of circumstances. I'd walk up to the nearest large settlement and when they shout down from the gate "why should we let YOU in?", demonstrate throwing that thing. Then wait 30 seconds for the gate to open. (And yes, I know how to use and make one.)
March 20, 2004, 03:14 PM
Geez, I gotta go along with Declaration Day - iffen I can't handle it with those three, (Garand, 1911 and a 22 rifle), I'm not going to be able to handle it with anything else.
March 20, 2004, 04:01 PM
I was thinking of a .45 Colt pistol and 45-70 rifle.
My idea is that since they are black powder cartridges I could reload in the field as long as I had the brass. They use lead bullets so I could mold my own over a fire. If things were REALLY bad I could even make my own black powder if I had the ingredients available. What I can't quite get around is what to do about primers if things are that bad.
March 20, 2004, 04:35 PM
Assuming ammo would eventually run out, the best bet would be a tricked out 10/22 with 10,000+ rounds. Two guns are useless if you can't carry it and they run dry.
March 20, 2004, 07:03 PM
Dude, check all my posts about my guns - they'll all be there!
Gotta buy more ammo...
March 20, 2004, 08:30 PM
I'm a Sci-Fi reader & recommend David Brin's book to anyone. I've read & re-read the book & thought about the situation off & on for years.
The main consideration that I haven't seen raised here is; post-apocalyptic. That means that the common ammo is going to be available for at least two complete lifetimes after the event. I have always regarded that figure as a minimum. Then again, I'm working off my own situation where my minimum personal .22 lr stockpile runs to about two cases.
Given that travel, as per Postman, is required, there is nothing that precludes caching as long as a regular route is followed. That allows setting up dumps along the way. Not only of ammo, but spare weapons as well. Remember, something like 90% of the present population is dead.
Therefore, as the territory traveled & seasons change, so can the armament carried. If you couldn't find a least 6 serviceable .30-06's on your route, along with ammo, you aren't smart enough to survive long anyway.
Four main weapon groups. Shotgun, .22 rifle, heavy rifle such as the .30-06, and personal pistol. Stick to the dirt common ammo & you should be good to go. So, for me: 12 gauge, .22 rimfire, .30-06 or .308, and .357.
Bring a whole new meaning to 'packin' the mail, now doesn't it?
March 20, 2004, 08:35 PM
A Russian or Romanian SKS and a CZ-97 sidearm in an enclosed holster. Second choices would be a 5.56x39 AK and a full size H&K USP in 45ACP.
Although I considered a 30-30 lever action, I think a semi-auto rifle would be best for defending against multiple maruaders. I wouldn't be very comfortable with a pistol caliber or M1 carbine and wouldn't want to hump a lot of full power load such as 308 or 30.06. That left something in the midrange like 7.62x39 or 5.56x45. Since cleaning and shelter may not be so common, I thought it had better be something very reliable. The AK came to mind first, but I just like shooting the SKS a lot better and it feels more robust, plus that bayonette might come in handy.
I'd go with the CZ and H&K because they are large, stable for quick follow up shots, and have slightly more capacity than a 1911.
March 20, 2004, 08:42 PM
AH 1 Huey Cobra with rocket pods and chain gun. I mean, it is a fantasy, right?
March 20, 2004, 09:12 PM
8 wheeled APC with a 20mm cannon. Why walk?
Carrying around guns? 22 magnum. Same weight as a lr, twice the reach.
22 magnum revolver , probably a single six in stainless.
Both are suitable for food gathering and defence.
Travelling around where I'm not welcome? AUG and Glock 17. Simpler to avoid those areas anyway. .223 will take out most Australian game animals, hot loaded 9mm will do the same.
March 20, 2004, 11:54 PM
AAFV7A with a .50 cuopla mounted, unlike your LAV, it is completely amphibious, can take most man portable fire, (short of AT-4's LRAC's, etc.)and is very roomy inside!;)
M1A with 300 rds carried on person, thousands more cached.
Rem. 870 with 100 rds. on person, 1000 cached.
HK USP or Mk23 with supressor, (post-apocalyptic, no ATF:D ), 200 rd's on person, 2000 cached.
M79 cut down to just pistol grip and 10" bbl, 5 rds. HE, 10 rds. buck/flechette, 5 rds. CS on person, 100 each type cached.
Oh, and a gas mask!
Realistically (yeah, I know, I've seen the movie, too....), I would think that if you were all by yourself, you would be further off with one rifle (I picked a scoped .30-06) and a pistol (easy to find caliber- feel sorry for you .357 SIG and 10mm fans out there:p ). A few critical spare parts (firing pins and extractors) could be carried easily, and as much ammo as you could pack in a bandolier/pouch/haversack. THIS would be your trapline/scouting/local area kit- enough to last you about three days to a week, depending on the size of your AO.
Depending on your AO (I know I wouldn't be wandering around....)find a stronghold with a backup hideout, that's where you could stash all your extra goodies (ammo, guns, flamethrowers, claymores, etc.).
Fantasy? That would depend on me linking up with John Connor and his group....or flipping out my communictor and getting beamed up.:neener:
March 21, 2004, 08:31 AM
I really dig these senarios becuase they can be plausible, I think The Postman was very believable. I dont think heavy vehicles will be likley because of fuel/maint issues, but I would give you an M1 in a hull down definsive position only becuase I know that they can still be operated in manual mode.
I too would choose common ammo types, in fact, during Y2K I has set aside a few cases and gun matching nato calibers, .308, .223, and 9mm. I work at HP and we did have a few systems go down but nothing critical and what did go down was repaired or taken offline immediatly.
Now for the second half of the story, would you remain alone, find a small group to join, or would you try to re-enter society as it was slowly rebuilding?
On a side note, If you liked The Postamn, try reading On The Beach, dang good book, one of the few that seriously made me tear up.
March 21, 2004, 09:04 AM
1. 22 cal takedown pneumatic air rifle. No worries about gunpowder. Light and compact.
2. Ruger GP100. Common ammunition, lasts forever. Concealable.
3. Scoped FAL (M1a will do also). Nato standard ammo. Versatile.
That's it for me. I might stash more somewhere, but this is all I can carry.
March 21, 2004, 01:54 PM
Hmm... Let's see....
Primary Rifle: HK M4A1 Variant with HK AG-C 40mm Grenade System. (HK M4 (http://www.hk-usa.com/pages/Military-LE/rifles-carbines/m4.html)) (HK AG-C (http://www.hk-usa.com/pages/military-le/special%20applications/ag-c.html))
Shotgun: HK Fabarm Tactical .12 (info (http://www.hk-usa.com/pages/fabarm/semi/tacticalsa.html))
Main Defensive Sidearm: HK MP7 in .45 acp (MP7A1 (http://www.hk-usa.com/pages/military-le/smg/mp7/mp7.html))
Backup Defensive Sidearm: Kimber 1911 Ten II Hi-Cap with Tritium Sights & Suppressor
Knife: Bainite Tactical 12" Tanto by Howard Clark (www.mvforge.com)
Hunting Weapon: 70lb Draw Compound Bow (Silent, efficient, Adaptable and has Recyclable ammo)
Transportation: Armored Hardtop Humvee with mounted M2HB system.
March 21, 2004, 02:00 PM
SKS, Beretta 92f, and 12 guage shotgun, carry SKS slung, beretta holstered, and 12 ga in hand.
My reasoning is ammo availability, reliability, and what I have on hand.
March 21, 2004, 02:17 PM
An 18" Fal in .308
A Sig P228 in 9mm.
And the trusty Ruger 10-22.
March 21, 2004, 02:40 PM
I think that I would definately have some sort of supressed subsonic rifle round like a 300 whisper or similar for hunting. You could pull 308 bullets and powder to load. No use letting everyone know you are there. A supressed rifle in a standard pistol caliber would also work. That along with a some standard pistold chambered in 9mm/45/40 and battle rifle like a M-16 of M1a. Of course a 50 sniper rifle would also be very nice for hunting and protection. If you are going to act like the postman and hide out by yourself, quiet would be the key.
March 21, 2004, 06:10 PM
There would be a LOT of AR type rifles laying around and mountains of ammo.
March 21, 2004, 07:04 PM
You got to go with guns in these cals, 7.62x39mm, .223, .308, 12ga, 22lr, 9mm, .38/.357. Those are going to be the cals that will be easy to find. The 30.06, .45, .30 carbine, and 30-30 are not really all that common anymore. Don't believe me? Just check prices, those cals are far more expensive than the above because not as many people are making them. When was the last time you saw 30.06 surplus ammo at dirt cheap prices? You can get .308 for almost nothing but 30.06 is expensive.
I would go with a Ruger Speed Six or Security Six in SS .357mag 4" bbl for my handgun.
A sawed off 12ga with a 14" bbl and a folding stock. This would be the most useful of all the guns because I could take birds on the wing with it. Birds are going to be easier to hunt than anything else and I don't think I want to eat squrells. I would probably eat doves more than anything else so I need a shotgun.
For my rifle, I guess I would go with either a AR-15 or a bolt action in .223. A SS and fiberglass bolt action with a good rugged peep sight should last a while without too much trouble. I would like a scope but I am sure it would get damaged.
March 21, 2004, 07:27 PM
March 21, 2004, 08:22 PM
my pack gun 20 gauge with a .22 chamber insert, a .45ACP chamber insert, birdshot, buckshot, and slug.
my enfield number4mk2, or m-1A
my model 37, mostly because i'm not leaving it behind.
A red Crowbar.
March 21, 2004, 09:49 PM
And The Postman!
We'll mostly be stuck with what we have, and staying put in out local is normally far superior than trying to live off a post apocolyptic land like a scaving gypsy(see Richard Harris...The Scavenger's. somewhere around 1979).
With that said, my handgun would have to be a Colt .45 auto, simply because I have four(and have to pick one or two). I have ammo and mags available. Might improvise a suppressor for quiet scavenging. the better to acquire an AR !!
The mid framed .357 is an excellant choice too, but I wpould rather have a Colt 1911 on my hip.
Next choice, a .22....pistol for me(maybe the conversion unit on my Officer's frame). But a Ruger 22/45 is also very cool(and can be suppressed...again no Fed's to annoy us).
Though a 10/22 is also a dandy choice.
Rifle: Whatever you got that uses commonly available ammo. If you are foot loose and fancy free, you may not have a choice. If you are sitting at home...you know what you have in your house. Buy more ammo!
But my preference would lean more toward a light, short.308, which would be used VERY sparingly.
Hunting game for survival is its primary role. And game WILL be very scarce. Fending off hordes of well armed unit's...well, that might be a case for breaking contact and making like a Ghost. Unless you have a well oiled, and armed defense scenerio of your own set up.
The best way to survive an onslaught of is to not be there, or stick around!
March 22, 2004, 03:21 AM
Backpack Nuke with a deadman's trigger!! :evil:
March 22, 2004, 05:11 AM
You win. :)
March 22, 2004, 07:58 AM
I didn't see the movie. Before I play, I need to understand why I have to wander? Seems like anything that requires me to keep moving would prevent me from returning to any cache I might have.
March 22, 2004, 08:31 AM
What gets me whenever I read a SHTF thread is how sporting everyone is in reguards to hunting. Everyone is still wing shooting, why? I would only take a shotgun for close range self defense. Everything else would be shot over bait or on the ground. I would more likely do much of the small animal taking with snares or traps. I would take a S&W 13 and my Marlin 1894c they both take 357's or 38's. I have a complete reloading set and bullet molding kit made up and could keep my self in ammo for a long time. I would not be able to plink like I enjoy.
March 22, 2004, 04:20 PM
A good knife (Cold Steel Trailmaster comes to mind), lots of braided fishing line and lots of parachute cord.
March 23, 2004, 01:02 AM
Skip the movie. Get the book. David Brin, author.
March 23, 2004, 07:18 AM
Skip the movie. Get the book.
Not to hijack the thread but that sounds like good overall advice.
March 24, 2004, 08:40 AM
"I didn't see the movie. Before I play, I need to understand why I have to wander?"
It has been a while since I read it but is goes something like this:
There was a war in the U.S., our hero, Gordon, used to be a teacher but was drafted. The U.S. lost the war to a militant-survivalist group. There was some nuke usage and may places became inhabitable. The story takes place severl years after the war and civilisation on the east coast is very rough and dangerous, however, on the west coast, people are banding together in peacefull colonies but there is still a rather large group of militants called "Holnists" that pick on these little communities. Gordon is trying to work his way west to avoid the riots, gangs and general misery of the east, hence his wondering. I don't think that one has to wonder to survive, but I got the feeling that it was beffer to do so anywhere east of Idaho.
To those that have read it more recent than I have, does that about cover it without giving the story away? Anything to add?
"I have a complete reloading set and bullet molding kit made up and could keep my self in ammo for a long time."
Only one issue with this, Where do you propose to get powder and primers?
At first there sill be plenty of supplies/ammo, however, in the long run, the flintlock will be king. At least IMHO.
March 24, 2004, 10:19 AM
In the movie, he had a .30 carbine, good choice I thought,
I would have sworn he was carrying a CAR-15 ?:scrutiny:
March 24, 2004, 11:42 AM
He did after he was conscripted and he became the postman, In the opening when he was still wondering, he had a .30 carbine.
March 24, 2004, 11:50 AM
Remington PSS in .308 for long shots (the only kind I want to take if I'm alone). The bolt action because it's easier to maintain.
H&K MP5K for anything closer. The full-auto feature is what I want when I'm alone and surprised by a larger force. Semi-auto is just fine for what I might use a pistol for and the K version isn't much larger than a pistol.
Together they're both light and powerful.
March 24, 2004, 01:32 PM
I started to write about my 308 bolt action versus 22 LR thoughts, but I think I'll wait until I read the book.
March 24, 2004, 01:51 PM
Very interesting thread.
My tastes would be simple.
A Bolt action 30-06 rifle, a .45acp pistol(prefer Sig 220) a a 12ga shotgun with a 26" barrel. It could be used for defense, as well as hunting.
March 24, 2004, 10:15 PM
My Saiga M3EXP01 with a suppressor and a PSO-1. Any high-capacity 9mm, like a Beretta or Taurus, maybe CZ. A .12ga well oiled in a stash with a variety of ammo. All of these would be serviceable and maintenable where I'd find myself after the flood...
March 25, 2004, 12:50 AM
Light weight, light weight, light weight!
.22lr bolt action (CZ) or break action (NEF) for hunting
9mm carbine (for bad guys) just shot a Storm today and loved it!!!
pump shotgun (Rem 870) hunting and bad guys
If you enjoyed reading about "arm yourself!" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!