Lee Perfect Powder Measure problem.


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ironworkerwill
August 12, 2013, 09:38 AM
Got to the range early Saturday morning and I shot an array of loads for my 7mm-08. I had some good groups and finally got to see how my new seater die was grouping.

I was shooting the last of the "tried and true" loads my rifle likes with H380 and 139gr Hornady sp. With the whole lot shooting just as I suspected, I had put the last 3 rounds in the mag. When the first round was fired it had a bit more recoil than the others. The brass flowed into the ejector hole and was barley visible and the primer was flat as a pancake. I used 46.1 grains of H380 and the bullet was at 2.853 OAL and was off the lands a good bit.
The second round fired caused smoke to come out the vent ports and was a bit sticky to remove. Upon removal the primer fell out of its pocket. This once fired Hornady 308 match brass had a good bit of brass flowing into the ejector hole. I stoped shooting, packed my gear, and left for home!

All my H380 loads were thrown using the Lee powder measure. These loads where also not weighed as H380 meters very good.

After I'd made it home I inspected the powder measure and noticed the fine spherical powder stuck in the hub area. I took the measure apart and got a good bit of powder from around the hub. I put it back together and threw a few charges and noticed powder leaking out of the side after about 5 cycles. I took it apart again and laid the hub flat on the table and noticed it was racked. I guess I have stuck a granule of stick powder for so long that it will be warped for good. I suppose after 8 or so years it's time for an upgrade!

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Blackrock
August 12, 2013, 09:42 AM
Had the same problem metering H335 through mine. Handles Varget and IMR4198 just fine.

ironworkerwill
August 12, 2013, 10:47 AM
Yes, it has always worked fine for Varget and RL17 but not as accurate. The H308 is usually spot on every time.

joecil
August 12, 2013, 12:19 PM
The perfect powder measure doesn't work real well with fine powders but great for flake and stick powders. I use one mounted on the die with my 45-70 however for the pistol loads I just used the Lee Pro Powder Measure.

stubbicatt
August 12, 2013, 12:29 PM
You might be able to salvage it by lapping the two halves of the measure body with some valve grinding compound.

ironworkerwill
August 12, 2013, 01:07 PM
I got my eye on a Lyman double nickel, if I fix the Lee I can't buy a new 55:evil:

Wheeljack
August 12, 2013, 01:31 PM
I found that I had to put a shim in place to put pressure on the opposite side of the Rotor to stop the leaking.
http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd493/WaltStanley/Measurefix_zps360a2e50.jpg (http://s1222.photobucket.com/user/WaltStanley/media/Measurefix_zps360a2e50.jpg.html)

ironworkerwill
August 12, 2013, 01:40 PM
Thats pretty slick Jack!

PJSprog
August 12, 2013, 01:59 PM
These loads where also not weighed ...
Wow. Really? If that's a common practice of yours, you may want to question any and all of your existing handloads.

ArchAngelCD
August 12, 2013, 02:01 PM
I haven't had a problem with my Lee PPM yet but then again it's only about 6 years old. I also have a Lyman #55 which is probably the best powder measure on the market in it's price range.

Very good first post Wheeljack, welcome to the forum...

Potatohead
August 12, 2013, 02:04 PM
How do you guys post pics with arrows and labeling on them and such?

ArchAngelCD
August 12, 2013, 02:08 PM
How do you guys post pics with arrows and labeling on them and such?
Edit the picture with software like Photoshop or even the free Microsoft Photo Editor that comes with the newer versions of Windows and then post the picture.

*EDIT*
I just looked at Photo Editor and I don't think you can add text with that one but there are free editors on the Internet that will.

Potatohead
August 12, 2013, 02:09 PM
thx..

ironworkerwill
August 12, 2013, 02:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ironworkerwill
These loads where also not weighed ...

Wow. Really? If that's a common practice of yours, you may want to question any and all of your existing handloads.

Yea, really! I usually weigh every so often: the first, every five, and the last. I've thrown H380 so precise with the PPM I really didn't need to. This time I only weighed a few of the first throws to make sure, like I always do, and no I didn't measure the 5th or the last. There was only 10 rnds in the whole batch.

PJSprog
August 12, 2013, 05:54 PM
Yea, really! I usually weigh every so often: the first, every five, and the last. I've thrown H380 so precise with the PPM I really didn't need to. This time I only weighed a few of the first throws to make sure, like I always do, and no I didn't measure the 5th or the last. There was only 10 rnds in the whole batch.
Ah, my bad. I got the (incorrect) impression from your original post that you simply trusted your measure set up and started throwing charges.
Fortunately, there was no damage. Glad that part worked out for you.

GLOOB
August 12, 2013, 07:39 PM
You might be able to salvage it by lapping the two halves of the measure body with some valve grinding compound.
+1. I've fixed two of them, that way.

Some take more work than others. This one was giving me grief, so I whipped up an adaptor to do the lapping with a cordless drill.

http://i688.photobucket.com/albums/vv241/gloob27x/SAM_aa.jpg

H335 is the main powder I use in my PPMs, and that's finer than H380. I don't have any leaks, at all. H110, OTOH....

ironworkerwill
August 12, 2013, 07:55 PM
Stubby and Gloob are going to make my frugality kick in.... Ok, I'll try to lap it.

@ PJSprog: it dinged up my ejector, ejector retainer pin, and spring. It's all fixed up now.

gonoles_1980
August 12, 2013, 08:18 PM
but I just use the Lee Perfect Powder Measure to put the powder into the tray on my scale, I weight every single time I dispense the power, then I pour into the brass. I have a single stage loader, so I'm not going for speed.

hostjunkies
August 12, 2013, 09:04 PM
Mine does the same thing with Bullseye, leaks. I refuse to buy another lee powder measure and i don't want to spend $80-$100 on a good one. So instead i stuck $100 into a coffee can and labeled the can "Dillon 550 Savings Fund".

jcwit
August 12, 2013, 09:05 PM
I know it slows me down...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

but I just use the Lee Perfect Powder Measure to put the powder into the tray on my scale, I weight every single time I dispense the power, then I pour into the brass. I have a single stage loader, so I'm not going for speed.

You got way more patience than I have.

Even benchrest shooters seldom weigh each and every charge. And they are about as precise as one can get.

Jcinnb
August 12, 2013, 09:13 PM
I keep hoping to make the leap to periodic measurement, but so far, I still measure every one.

-Gadsden-
August 12, 2013, 10:36 PM
weighing the charge more often would probably help prevent this. I like to measure every 10th (I only load 9mm at the moment) just because I'm a worry wart and like to know my material is accurate. My PPM is never off more than + or - .1 of a grain - I think that's accuracy I can live with.

jcwit
August 12, 2013, 10:54 PM
I use a dipper to load 30-30 plinking loads, and never ever weigh the charges. That's why I made a dipper to measure out 12 grains of trail Boss. The dipper does not change volume from one session to the other.

32_d3gr33s
August 13, 2013, 01:02 AM
but I just use the Lee Perfect Powder Measure to put the powder into the tray on my scale, I weight every single time I dispense the power, then I pour into the brass. I have a single stage loader, so I'm not going for speed.
I do exactly the same thing. Started loading 223 not too long ago and want make sure I have no issues. That is until I get the second set of discs for my lee pro auto disc...

ironworkerwill
August 13, 2013, 10:49 AM
I did not find my lapping compound, so I fit lapped it with fine grit sandpaper. It worked a LOT better! I saw some small voids where the drum was not making contact with the rotor. Oddly, one void was between the feed and discharge areas. After the lapping H380 didn't leak a single granule. Thanks guys!

As a side note: Anything mechanical is will fail eventually. Complacency and overconfidence caused the most danger. I did not follow through on my S.O.P.

gacajun
August 13, 2013, 01:13 PM
I do exactly the same thing. Started loading 223 not too long ago and want make sure I have no issues. That is until I get the second set of discs for my lee pro auto disc...
I bought the second set of Lee disks and the "doubler" clamp. I use Varget and I did not get good accuracy loading .223 through the Lee disk charging die with a double disk set installed. It threw "about" the right amount of powder but it would not throw one amount constantly. I even went really slow when working the handle on the charging die and also tapped the die at the bottom of the stroke to make sure that all of the powder was dropping. It just was not constant for me.

Do you get a constant accurate drop using the double disk set?

stubbicatt
August 13, 2013, 01:50 PM
With the double disc kit I was only able to obtain consistent throws using ball powders such as Ramshot Xterminator. Worked just fine. Varget on the other hand was sporadic at best.

32_d3gr33s
August 13, 2013, 03:46 PM
I bought the second set of Lee disks and the "doubler" clamp. I use Varget and I did not get good accuracy loading .223 through the Lee disk charging die with a double disk set installed. It threw "about" the right amount of powder but it would not throw one amount constantly. I even went really slow when working the handle on the charging die and also tapped the die at the bottom of the stroke to make sure that all of the powder was dropping. It just was not constant for me.

Do you get a constant accurate drop using the double disk set?
i havent bought it yet, but now after reading that thay arent as accurate, i might just pick up some dippers. I planned on using imr 4895 and varget... i may still get them just to try ;)

blarby
August 13, 2013, 04:01 PM
The brass flowed into the ejector hole and was barley visible and the primer was flat as a pancake. I used 46.1 grains of H380 and the bullet was at 2.853 OAL and was off the lands a good bit.
The second round fired caused smoke to come out the vent ports and was a bit sticky to remove. Upon removal the primer fell out of its pocket. This once fired Hornady 308 match brass had a good bit of brass flowing into the ejector hole. I stoped shooting, packed my gear, and left for home!

I would run too.

Jack ! My man- thats a really good first post !

I had no idea you could put a perfect measure in a die like that.! And that shim job is fantasic !

Good ones come outta the blue, I swear.

OP : Just my 2c, but the higher RL series have great luck in the 7m-08 for me. Same with H4895. Actually, most of the .308 powders worked well.... I wonder why.....

If none of these suggestions bear fruit, a less fine powder might be in order. My PPM leaks h110, I feel your pain........

Potatohead
August 13, 2013, 05:05 PM
Can you interchange powder measures between brands? Like use a Dillon with an LCT, etc?

gacajun
August 13, 2013, 06:29 PM
i havent bought it yet, but now after reading that thay arent as accurate, i might just pick up some dippers. I planned on using imr 4895 and varget... i may still get them just to try ;)
I use the Lee dippers for .223 after sketchy performance by the double disk set. Only thing about the dippers is that you will not get the same throw every time. I use a dipper to get close and then use a trickler to add what I need to get to the proper weight on the scales.

I've got one of those Frankford Arsenal plastic loading blocks and I'll process the brass all the way up to priming them and then charge them all at one time. It takes a little while but I get accurate and repeatable loads with Varget.

GLOOB
August 13, 2013, 06:32 PM
After the lapping H380 didn't leak a single granule. Thanks guys!
Glad it worked out for you. Of course, technically, this fix can't fail. The way the PPM halves fit together, the more you lap fit them, the better it gets. If you can't fix a PPM to work like a champ, you must be doing it wrong! Certainly, that's the reason Lee designed it like this, rather than putting a drum within a cylindrical housing. If that kind of design has slop, well... You just have to live with it.

If I was going to custom make my own powder measure with the most expensive machinery and materials, cost not a factor, I'd add some additional gizmos. But I would probably copy the basic mechanism from this $30.00 measure.

noylj
August 13, 2013, 08:56 PM
If bench-mounted, leaking is no big deal and the charge thrown is always correct (on mine).
Since I see no reason to load bottleneck rounds on progressive press, the need for press-mounting has never come up.

ironworkerwill
August 13, 2013, 09:11 PM
@Blarby: 44.5gr of RL17 and sgk's 160 do magical things in my savage. 2.8"Col don't seem long but it is with sierra's data @2.75. They produced really good 1/2"x3 groups. They shoot almost 1-1/2" directly below the 139gr sp and H380 combo.



@Gloob: If I put the vibrating apparatus out of a videogame controller I'd bet varget and rl17 would do great.

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