Witness Hunter 10mm


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Peter M. Eick
August 24, 2013, 08:59 PM
I won a couple of guns a shooting tourney today and I decided that an AR and a XDM were not in my future so I picked up a Witness Hunter 10mm and a nice VX3 scope.

So I only have one mag for the witness hunter 10mm. Does it take standard Witness 10mm mags?

Any advice, tips or suggestions?

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Onmilo
August 24, 2013, 11:45 PM
Polygonal rifling so stick with jacketed bullets.
It will take the same 15 shot magazines as the standard Witless

Torian
August 25, 2013, 12:03 AM
My Elite Match does not have polygonal rifling. Is this type of rifling specific to the Hunter?

browningguy
August 25, 2013, 12:24 AM
My Elite Match does not have polygonal rifling. Is this type of rifling specific to the Hunter?

Most of the higher end Tanfoglio's have polygonal rifling, the Gold and Elite Limited models as examples.

MOUNTAIN WILLIAM
August 25, 2013, 12:28 AM
The Stock model does also.

Peter M. Eick
August 25, 2013, 07:24 AM
I had to pull the gun and look but yes you are right. It is poly rifling. My Elite Match 38 super is cut rifling.

As a reloader that is a big issue to me. I shoot lots of lead bullets so time to investigate if hard cast lead is ok in Poly rifling. I can deal with Jackated but I would prefer lead as it is just easier to work with.

I will get mags ordered today from CDNN. I noted that the follower is different than my older style mags. My older ones are red and this new one is a slippery black material. Is that something special?

What about the extra springs and front sight? Any comments on those?

Cryogaijin
August 25, 2013, 08:46 AM
Black followers are IIRC mactec mags (Probably misremembering the name.) They fixed the sticky magazine issue of the old orange follower mags, though mine only seat 14 rounds.

If you aren't familier, the "sticky magazine" issue was that the more rounds you put into an affected magazine, the worse it fed. You'd be fine with 5 rounds in a magazine, or possibly 7, but once you started filling the mag it wouldn't feed reliably. At least on some magazines this was traced back to the interior of the magazine being coated with the same grippy paint as the outside of the magazine. On others the spring was put in upside down. Or both. If the paint was the issue, you could get a reliable magazine by stripping the paint out of the interior of the magazine. If it was the spring, just flipping it worked.

I've had orange follower magazines with each variation of the above problems. :( But they all work well now. :)

Edarnold
August 25, 2013, 03:26 PM
Look up the website

Henningshootsguns.com

For a wide range of add-ons for the Tanfoglio pistols. The site owner has much experience shooting competition with the Witness guns.

All the Witness 10mm magazines I have came covered inside and out with preservative oil. The interior coating is downright sticky, can't expect rounds to feed properly until it's cleaned out. I also spray the interior with dry Moly disulfide, keeps things moving freely.

Hopefully by the time you start shooting this gun the shortage of ammunition from Underwood will have eased up, they have the line of loads that best show off the full potential of the cartridge. You can achieve just about any level of power with handloads, with the Hunter 6" barrel ballistics can be awesome.

I would be inclined to find out how your gun handles cast bullets by trying some rather than relying on the 'folk wisdom' about polygon rifling. Whitworth and Martini-Henry rifles used cast bullets and polygon rifling, and were noted for freedom from fouling and outstanding accuracy. Just because Glock doesn't recommend it doesn't make it so.

Torian
August 25, 2013, 04:01 PM
There can certainly be some variation in cast bullet performance based on the rifling type and the twist rate. Here's an interesting video from hickok45 on lone wolf vs regular polygonal rifling in a 10mm glock 20.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-m0satEkGjw

SDGlock23
August 25, 2013, 10:24 PM
I've shot quite a bit of lead through all my Glocks, even my 10mm. There are no issues with lead and polygonal rifling other than to make sure the load you're shooting isn't severely leading the barrel, just keep your eyes out for that and as always clean it good afterwards. I think a polygonal barrel leads a touch faster than traditional, but nothing to lose any sleep over.

ku4hx
August 26, 2013, 11:54 AM
Lots of cast boolit expertise here, including cast in Glock and other "verboten" bores:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/forumdisplay.php?8-Cast-Boolits

Peter M. Eick
August 26, 2013, 06:23 PM
I spent my time reading the castboolits threads. Seems that you can but there is an art to firing lead in polygon to get it to work right.

I love a good challenge!

ku4hx
August 26, 2013, 06:32 PM
I spent my time reading the castboolits threads. Seems that you can but there is an art to firing lead in polygon to get it to work right.

I love a good challenge!
Of course it's an art, but part science too ... both aspects are present. Regardless of rifling type, you have to have the right diameter boolit, the right lube, compatible alloy and a compatible powder. But then, that's true for all guns when getting the cast boolit loads "right with the gun".

As one fellow has in his signature, "If it was easy, anybody could do it." Or words to that effect.

Dakotared
August 26, 2013, 07:12 PM
Ku4hx beat me to it but yes you can shoot lead with poly. In my experience fit is what you will need to know. .002 bigger and 90% of the challenge is over.

wally
August 27, 2013, 10:47 AM
I noted that the follower is different than my older style mags. My older ones are red and this new one is a slippery black material. Is that something special?


The magazines for EAA Witness pistols have always been "the problem" they keep messing around with followers and springs. Red, Black, Orange, and apparently now back to a different black is what I've seen so far :(

If you get mags that work you will love your EAA pistol, if not, try to get some Mec-Gar made mags for it and hope for the best.

ATLDave
August 27, 2013, 11:14 AM
The factory mags the last few years ARE Mec-Gar mags. I've had 6 of them in 10mm, and they've all worked fine.

wally
August 27, 2013, 11:49 AM
The factory mags the last few years ARE Mec-Gar mags.

Then he needs to be careful about getting mags from CDNN as they specialize in selling new, old stock and are thus unlikely to be the newest Mec-Gars.

Order by phone to verify what will be shipped.

ATLDave
August 27, 2013, 01:05 PM
Solid advice, wally.

Henning is the best source for new Tanfoglio/Witness parts.

Torian
August 27, 2013, 03:33 PM
As far as magazines are concerned, I've ordered those directly from EAA without issues. They even had a call list for new mags when they came in. Run from anything you see with a red follower.

Peter M. Eick
August 28, 2013, 08:45 PM
I ordered a few from Midway. I took the gamble that they would have cleared out their old stock during the rush period.

Thanks for the advice on CDNN.

Dakotared
August 29, 2013, 12:27 PM
With my 10mm witness I have had a few mags that are more squared in the front. They would go in OK but you would have to take the top off and push down on the mag to get it to come back out. I have found the ones that are more rounded off in the front fit and work well.

ATLDave
August 29, 2013, 03:26 PM
One other note. Henning sells base pads that increase the capacity of the mag by 2 or so.

Cryogaijin
August 31, 2013, 05:06 AM
As noone else has mentioned it yet, I HIGHLY recommend getting a Maglula to load your magazines with.

Doing normal thumb-loading, I thought my magazines were only 10 rounders at first. Using the Maglula I was able to load 15 in all the factory mags I have (and 14 into the mec-gars) HIGHLY recommended.

Peter M. Eick
September 2, 2013, 04:26 PM
http://eickpm.com/picts/witness_hunter_left.jpg
http://eickpm.com/picts/witness_hunter_right.jpg
http://eickpm.com/picts/witness_610.jpg
http://eickpm.com/picts/10mm_hunters.jpg

The bottom two are my 10mm hunter guns for hogs here in Texas. I like the 10mm and am very fond of my 610 as it has been exceptionally accurate.

Peter M. Eick
September 7, 2013, 06:02 PM
If you are following this thread, you are probably interested in 10mm Witness Hunters.

FYI Midway is shipping black follower mags for it which match the gun. I ordered 5 of them and they showed up on friday.

Tomorrow I will finally get a chance to try it out.

Dr.Rob
September 9, 2013, 04:08 AM
That is a really neat purpose built pistol.. look at that aggressive checkering!

Is that a strangely applied finish or oil and cosmoline on the lower?

And lastly.. are those threaded holes on both sides for the scope mount?

stressed
September 9, 2013, 04:22 AM
Do you gain considerable FPS out of a polygonal barrel vs. a standard rifled bore of the same length?

Torian
September 9, 2013, 08:18 AM
Nope.

Peter M. Eick
September 9, 2013, 09:20 PM
Question to me on the oil on the frame.

The first thing I do with a new gun is oil it heavily. I want the oil to soak into the metal (as best it can) and then blot the excess off in the case to sort of protect it from rust here in Houston. I work for an oil company, so my motto is "oil is cheap, guns are expensive, use proportionally".

Yes the holes are on both sides and have been tapped. They allow a U shaped over the slide type scope mount. I will probably get one and scope the gun. It is probably worth doing.

tommy.duncan
September 10, 2013, 02:03 PM
I still can't get replacement mags for the 9mm witness. She has been with 1 mag for almost a year. Good Luck

Peter M. Eick
October 1, 2013, 08:41 PM
I just got on midway and order 5 more. I had them in 3 days. Interesting that 9mm's are not available.

PabloJ
October 1, 2013, 09:55 PM
It looks like nice target style pistol. If you don't kill what you hunt with the bullet you will be able to club it to death with the pistol itself. Very manly gun I like it a lot.

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