Would a "Drilling" be a SBS or SBR? Or what else?


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Mp7
October 14, 2013, 03:30 AM
Just wondering.

Let`s day one had a cheapo Drilling, you come across
those here in Europe, as they are more common.

Let`s say it was SxS 12ga. with a single 8mm57IS riflebarrell
under it. Could you get a stamp for it in the US to cut down
the barrels and add a side-folding stock? :evil:

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Arizona_Mike
October 14, 2013, 01:40 PM
As long as the barrels are longer than 12" and it is break-open type it falls under the definition of an AOW. Not sure if it would be an SBS or SBR if under 12"
3) A firearm with combinations smooth bore and rifle barrels 12 inches or more but less than 18 inches in length from which only a single shot can be made from either barrel.

As far as the stock, it is likely less strict than you are thinking.
From a April 2, 2008 technical determination letter:
. . . to measure a firearm with a retractable or collapsible stock to determine whether it falls under NFA provisions, you obtain the measurement with the shoulder stock extended.

You could cut a combination gun to 18" barrel length and put on a side folding stock and have a package more compact than many NFA weapons and not be NFA.

There are a lot of reasons the NFA makes little sense. Bullpup shotguns are another.

Mike

MasterSergeantA
October 15, 2013, 01:01 PM
The fact that it has a stock at all to start would probably preclude it being made into an AOW. It would wind up being a SBS before becoming a SBR if you cut it to <18" but >16" and stopped at that point. Cutting it back below 16" on ALL barrels would only require one stamp...much like the short M6 survival guns. As AM said, cutting it to 18" and mounting a folding stock would keep it in the Title I category (allowing for variations in state/municipal laws which might not).

Arizona_Mike
October 15, 2013, 02:15 PM
The fact that it has a stock at all to start would probably preclude it being made into an AOW. It would wind up being a SBS before becoming a SBR if you cut it to <18" but >16" and stopped at that point. Cutting it back below 16" on ALL barrels would only require one stamp...much like the short M6 survival guns. As AM said, cutting it to 18" and mounting a folding stock would keep it in the Title I category (allowing for variations in state/municipal laws which might not).
The ATF says right in their own manual that the Marble Game Getter with a stock is an AOW.
It may be an SBX depending on how they try to apply the statute, but it is not clear to me what "x" is. There is no primacy of the SBR definition over that of an SBS like there is for machine guns.

Mike

MasterSergeantA
October 16, 2013, 11:03 AM
You are correct about the Marble Game Getter. But that particular item is called out specifically. Typically, a shotgun that comes from the factory with a stock cannot be made into an AOW, but only a SBS.

The only distinction I make with the drilling is that the shotgun portion of it becomes a SBS as soon as you shorten the barrel to less than 18" while the rifle portion is still not NFA until you reach 16". That's all.

Mp7
October 16, 2013, 11:42 AM
:-) Thx for the answers.


Sooo, who is doing one? (at least in photoshop?)

Arizona_Mike
October 16, 2013, 06:31 PM
You are correct about the Marble Game Getter. But that particular item is called out specifically. Typically, a shotgun that comes from the factory with a stock cannot be made into an AOW, but only a SBS.

The only distinction I make with the drilling is that the shotgun portion of it becomes a SBS as soon as you shorten the barrel to less than 18" while the rifle portion is still not NFA until you reach 16". That's all.
But is a combination gun a "shotgun"? I thought it would be a "firearm".

I disagree that the Game Getter is "called out" although it is given as an example in their guidebook. Here is the statute:
26 U.S.C. 5845(E)

For the purposes of the National Firearms Act, the term “Any Other Weapon” means:

Any weapon or device capable of being concealed on the person from which a shot can be discharged through the energy of an explosive;

A pistol or revolver having a barrel with a smooth bore designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell;

Weapons with combination shotgun and rifle barrels 12 inches or more, less than 18 inches in length, from which only a single discharge can be made from either barrel without manual reloading; and

Any such weapon which may be readily restored to fire


Mike

MasterSergeantA
October 17, 2013, 12:06 PM
I honestly don't know and won't offer an opinion without something to reference. I have no idea if combination guns fall into a different category come to think of it; hadn't really considered that. I have a Springfield Armory M6 that I wanted to shorten and discovered that it only requires one tax stamp. But I was going to shorten both barrels at once and go down to 14", so the sequence is unimportant.

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