Is it just me (transfers)


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clubsoda22
March 25, 2004, 05:12 PM
Is it just me, or do gun shops hate doing transferrs? I mean, i understand it if it's a new gun they can easily get...but a lot of these shops seem to want to discourage it even for guns they can't get.

When I got my HK from CDNN, the local shop charged me $25, then charged me another 25 to have one of their guys go to the post office to pick it up 1 block away (USPS doesn't deliver guns, you must pick them up). $50 says to me "and don't try it again." I personally would have bought it from him if he offered me a used HK USP for $370. But he didn't have any.

Now i'm buying an Arsenal SLR 101. And shops want to charge me massive sums of money to transfer it. when asked if they can get it, they cannot.

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Mgraff
March 25, 2004, 05:18 PM
Never had a problem, but I have used the same guy/ shop for years now. $10.00 flat fee for transfers, and he does it for most anyone. Great guy! Good luck finding a FFL who is as easy to get along with, once you do give them some buiness, other than transfers, goes along way towards happy relations.

Mark

Chipperman
March 25, 2004, 05:19 PM
A lot do, but some are very cool about it. Find one that will do transfers for a good fee. As a "thank you" to them, buy some ammo or accessories when the gun comes in.

clubsoda22
March 25, 2004, 05:20 PM
the guy who charged me $50 for the HK transfer i had bought a new gun from less than 2 months prior. Needless to say i haven't gone back.

DW
March 25, 2004, 05:20 PM
I agree...I think most don't want to do them. I mainly purchase from the local stores, but have recently started ordering via the Internet since my local dealers don't seem to stock what I want to buy. Based on my discussions with the local shops, I didn't even consider any of them for the transfers.

I found a local guy that works out of his home and only does transfers. He is easy to work with and charges a fair price for the transfer.

DW

QuarterBoreGunner
March 25, 2004, 05:25 PM
I know at my old shop we didn't hate them so much, but they were a real PITA on the paperwork side. Plus there's not a whole lot of money to be made doing FFL transfers.

gggman
March 25, 2004, 05:41 PM
The local dealers in my area want a fee plus 10%. The pawn shop near my office charges a flat $40 fee, and that's the best deal I've been able to find around here.(Bangor, Maine)
You can't really expect a stocking dealer to do transfers for ten bucks. He's got overhead, he couldn't stay in business long only making $10 on a transaction.

AJ Dual
March 25, 2004, 05:43 PM
Most around here seem to dislike transfers. The going rate is $50.There's a few kitchen table FFL's left around the Milwaukee metro if you can find them that are cheaper, but like kitchen table FFL's everywhere, they're a dying breed.

I enquired about multiple transfers from the shop closest to my home for recieving 12 inherited firearms from an estate, and the quoted rate was $50 for the first, and the "group discount" (Ha!) was $35 thereafter, which put the total at $435.

Now it gets better, I was already running out of cash just trying to ship the stuff home, and the handguns next-day-air, per UPS regs, and couldn't afford to part out the shipments into different boxes according to thier status. I explained what I wanted to send:

- One was a black powder Remington new Model cap and ball revolver. Not even a firearm by GCA '68 definitions or sec. 922.

- One was a Civil War era French pinfire revolver, again, not even a "firearm" because it was over 100 years old .

- Two "modern" cartrdige pieces, an Iver Jhonson .22 short revolver, and a Springfield Armory (the real one, run by Uncle Sam) 1875 trapdoor .45-70 rifle that were both well over 100 years old.

- A P-17 Enfield, M1 Carbine, and one non-functional .32 european cheap "bycicle/dog revolver" that would fall under my C&R license.

Four modern pieces that would normally require an 01 FFL to transfer, two Smith & Wesson revolvers from the 1970's, a Springfield Armory (the company) 1911, and a Browning .22 automatic rifle from the 1970s.

No dice. The price was still $435 to read seral numbers, and fill in seven freaking lines in thier bound book for the C&R and "modern" pieces. The manager insisted he had to enter even the black powder and the 100+ y.o. stuff. (It's strange that Sportsman's Guide and CIA can send +100 y.o. Mausers straight to my door, even without my C&R 03 FFL, when they have them.) And it wasn't even as though I was "undercutting" them because all the items were inheritance. He wasn't rude, but definitely not friendly either.

I have trouble buying the entire "Stocking distributor overhead" argument either.

If you aren't making money by charging $20-30 for the labor of an employee to: 1. Grab a box from the incoming UPS pile. 2. Cut the box open to verify the serial number. 3. Log it in the bound book. 4. Have the customer fill out a 4473. 5. Call NICS. And finally, 6. Log it out in the bound book; you've got some serious problems. Either that, or the FFL's dedication to the "Americans With Disabilities Act" is certainly commendable, but probably not necessary since few gun stores have enough employees to fall under that portion of the law...

Now I suppose if it's at your stereotypical "Roll your eyes and sigh heavily because you have to stop telling your best bud the Navy SEEL stories about how you were unofficially attached to the Selous Scouts in Rodesia, and go help a paying customer" pace of gunstore work, then perhaps you really are losing money at only $20-30 per transfer.

As a capitalist, and someone who floats somewhere on the Libertarian/Right end of the political and personal philosophy map, I'm not "mad" about it, or insulted per-se. I was lucky to figure out how I was within the law to not use an FFL in my particular circumstance, Antiques and inheritance.

I re-read the GCA '68 portions of sec. 922 and decided that between the blackpowder and 100+ yo items, the C&R items I could ship on my 03 FFL, and the clear exception made for interstate inheritance in sec. 922, and that I took posession, i.e. was "transfered ownership" entirely within Nevada, I was legal to self-ship. So screw them. I have my inheritance home with me, safe and sound.

I guess my point is: The Internet is a reality. It's not going away. Gun List and Shotgun News is a reality, they're not going away either. One of the primary rules of business is "Adapt or Die". Unfortunately, when the gunstore dies, and there's no FFL's to perform transfers left, RKBA will die a de-facto death as well.

clubsoda22
March 25, 2004, 06:02 PM
Note to anyone in SE PA. I just got off the phone with a guy in Aston. $25, no BS and he was glad to do it. Very polite. PM me for a name and phone number. Kitchen table type, doesn't care if it's new used or what.

spacemanspiff
March 25, 2004, 06:12 PM
he actually told you "dont try it again"????

i'd have told him to 'go pound sand'. if i am spending my own money, i'll do it any way i please. i've been to some gun stores that think they are doing some huge massive favor and it takes them far out of their way to recieve a package and write up some paperwork.
thats why i stopped going to gun stores and found a pawn shop that has a ffl. i pay $10 total per transfer, as many guns as i wish.

Bob R
March 25, 2004, 06:26 PM
I use a guy that is very courteous, takes time to talk about the gun, will meet just about any price on a new gun (so you don't have to do a transfer), and charges a flat fee of only 20 dollars. Of course, I have also bought an AR10 from him that he had in there during one transfer pickup. I have also bought a few odds and ends. For me it is a win-win situation. If only there were more like him around these threads would vanish.

bob

BlkHawk73
March 25, 2004, 06:46 PM
I got charged $50 once for a transfer even after seeing thier rate posted on an on-line auction site as $25. Told them, but they didn't seem to care. I WILL NOT return no matter how good the deal @ Howell's. Told them that too. Besides, I pay $5 now.

Zundfolge
March 25, 2004, 06:59 PM
The guy I use is actually a gunsmith. He doesn't mind doing transfers.


If you go on the "find an FFL" thing on Gunbroker I'd think you'd find guys who don't mind doing transfers (if they didn't I wouldn't think they would advertise on GB)

http://www.gunbroker.com/user/DealerNetwork.asp

azrael
March 25, 2004, 07:00 PM
well chucks...wait till you have to pay $10.00 for a transfer on a pistol that isnt going to be yours for very long...Granted I get to play with the latest toys but after awhile it gets annoying...

Although I cant wait for the new CZ Rami and CZ P-01 to get here...WHOOHOOOO!!!:D

But if you do about 2 guns month this way it is livable...I just wish I could get around the permit crap...

dwkennedy
March 25, 2004, 07:01 PM
I pay $10 for each yellow sheet (3 firearms) which is a screamin' deal.

If $50 was the best I could do I'd get my own license and go into the transfer business.

Stocking Dealers hate mail order. They also hate Wal-Mart and other discounters selling guns but haven't figured out what to do about it yet. Domestic manufacturers hate imported guns (unless they're doing the importing, of course.) With "friends" like these whispering in the ear of Congress, no wonder we ended up with such a fouled up system. Meanwhile the gun haters laugh down their sleeve about the $50 "tax" you're paying on a simple firearm puchase.

dwkennedy
March 25, 2004, 07:06 PM
when asked if they can get it, they cannot.


Oh, they can get it all right. But they know that you know how much it will cost them, and they believe the only way to stay in business is to mark up their stock more than a reasonable transfer fee.

Shop around for another dealer!

Standing Wolf
March 25, 2004, 07:10 PM
Gun shops that give me mouth about transfers don't sell me new guns, accessories, ammunition, reloading components, more accessories, more new guns, used guns, more ammunition, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

WhoKnowsWho
March 25, 2004, 07:19 PM
$20 for a transfer... so far only one place in town like that. I know one place was really mad at me when I asked why they charge $50 plus a percentage of the gun's cost...

clubsoda22
March 25, 2004, 07:36 PM
he actually told you "dont try it again"????

No, read what i said. charging $50 says to me "don't try it again".

Today, the highest quote i got was 20%. For the rifle i'm buying that would come to $105.

The level of cheapness some dealers display allways amazes me. one guy at a show was charging an extra $10 to do a background check. I asked him "you mean if i bought a $700 gun you'd charge me an extra $10 for a background check?" He responded affirmatively. How incredebly petty.

ken w.
March 25, 2004, 07:50 PM
The amount of paperwork issue with a transfer is a bunch of bull$h!!.You log it into your book-writing the name of where it came from-and loging it out-writing the name of where it's going- and calling in a NICS check ( about 3 minutes).I feel that being charged $25.00 is reasonable to pay for a transfer.A shop owner has to pay for the shop to be open and should welcome any kind of buisness into his shop.I buy guns from all over the country and shipping on a long gun is less than $12.00 no matter where it goes.Insurance is $1.00 per.$100.00 of value thru UPS.One thing that really ticks me off is that some shops charge to call in a NICS check.It's toll free and tahes about 3 minutes.

gulogulo1970
March 25, 2004, 08:09 PM
You know, all they are doing is filling a form out and signing it. Paper is pretty cheap and the time it takes is very short, what maybe 5-10 minutes for $10 or $20 or more. All profit! Yes, they could probably make more if they sold you the gun. But there is no overhead on a form to fill out. And they can do it when the store isn't busy.

If I could fill out a form and mail it off for 10 or 20 bucks a pop(and five or ten minutes of my time) I wouldn't bitch about it. It would make me happy to do that all day.

I think the hostile nature of most gun shop owners is they wish people didn't know they can buy guns for themselves over the internet. They just wish it would go away. If they are smart they will make some money off the transaction and not stick it to a would be customer.

clubsoda22
March 25, 2004, 08:14 PM
I think i got a decent deal. $510 for the rifle, $25 for shipping from colorado, $25 transfer. So, $560 total for a brand new Arsenal SLR101. Now add $40 for a quick release scope mount, $180 for a holosight, $60 for 4 bulgarian waffle mags, $75 for 1000 rounds of wolf ammo...ok, i don't wanna think about it....at least it's over and done with and now i can have fun.

MacPelto
March 25, 2004, 08:39 PM
Well, it seems to me that if you pay it (however much it is), then it must be worth that much to you, so you're not getting ripped off...and if you won't pay that much, then you're not paying anything, so you're not getting ripped off.

Either way, you win!;)

tcsd1236
March 25, 2004, 08:45 PM
The amount of paperwork issue with a transfer is a bunch of bull$h!!.You log it into your book-writing the name of where it came from-and loging it out-writing the name of where it's going- and calling in a NICS check ( about 3 minutes).I feel that being charged $25.00 is reasonable to pay for a transfer.A shop owner has to pay for the shop to be open and should welcome any kind of buisness into his shop.I buy guns from all over the country and shipping on a long gun is less than $12.00 no matter where it goes.Insurance is $1.00 per.$100.00 of value thru UPS.One thing that really ticks me off is that some shops charge to call in a NICS check.It's toll free and tahes about 3 minutes.

You are a New Yorker , as I am, so don't forget the costs associated with a new handgun and the shell casing collection by CoBis. For me as an FFL, thats a 3 hour round trip. If the gun comes WITH the casings ( as they are more and more, recently ), I have to ship those casings certified mail, return receipt requested. Thats the only way NYSP allows the casings to be shipped to them.
I currently charge $15/ long gun, $ 20 per handgun, and if I have to do the shell casing shipment or drive, thats an additional $15.

You also forget that even guys like me..that dying kitchen table breed someone mentioned..have to maintain the paperwork, pay taxes on the fees we charge, make enough monry to pay for the license renewals......plus, you would be surprised how many people have me calling all over the country to find THEM a better deal. One guy a while back had me calling all over so he could save five bucks....five BUCKS...over what my regular wholesaler could have sent the pistols for. Then he complained about every aspect of the order. So its not just a matter of some guy walking in with the information in hand, doing the transfers and maintaining the paperwork. I try to accomodate folks because I want the repeat business, but guys like that ruin it for everyone else.

Zundfolge
March 25, 2004, 11:29 PM
...and calling in a NICS check ( about 3 minutes)

3 Minutes!?

Must be nice. Around here NICS check calls take only 3 minutes, but thats after you've waited on hold for 30-60 minutes!

My FFL just clips his cell phone to his belt, puts he ear piece in and does other stuff while he waits ... and still only charges $20

Majic
March 26, 2004, 03:22 AM
One thing that really ticks me off is that some shops charge to call in a NICS check.It's toll free and tahes about 3 minutes.
Here in Va. it's the law to charge $2.00 for the insta-check, but our calls are to the Va. State Police.

RepublicanMan
March 26, 2004, 07:11 AM
We too are charged for the NICS check.......we charge $10 for the transfer / NICS on all of our sells and $40 for an internet transfer / NICS. Nobody around here has complained that I know of, and our AMMO and Gun prices more than make up for the charges........I can honestly say, without feeling guilty, that we have the lowest firearms prices and ammo prices (barring Wally World of course) in the area that I've seen. I always encourage our new customers to shop around first and then come back and get what they want. :D

thumbody
March 26, 2004, 08:33 AM
try this sight http://www.shotgunnews.com/fflguide/
I just checked for PA and several places quoted $5-25 for transfer

Sisco
March 26, 2004, 08:39 AM
Only did it once so far, $10 and they were glad to do it. Told them I was watching another auction and they said to just give 'em a call if I won.

I've never had an Instant check take over 5 minutes total, and I get delayed every time.

Mulliga
March 26, 2004, 09:02 AM
I found one semi-local guy who charges $20 for three rifles. Quite fair IMHO.

Gunshops hate it because they don't make as much money off of you. :)

SapperLeader
March 26, 2004, 09:12 AM
Ive dont two transfers at two different shops, and had totally different reactions. First, I transfered in a 9mm 1911 to one shop, and was hassled, insulted, forced to wait, and then when I turned around to talk to the owner, one of his emplpyess started fiddling and dryfiring my gun. They then charged me 40 dollars for the privellege. Then last month, I had a totalyl different reaction. Virginia Arms, in manassas, charged me 20 dollars per transfer, for two milsurps I had transfered in. They were polite and courteous, offered me some gloves so i could inspect the cosmoline rifles, and we had some actual conversations, not insults about why didnt I buy a "real gun". Therefore, Virginia Arms has won some business from me on accessories and ammo, and when Im ready to buy one, I will buy a kahr pm 9mm from them, even if it costs me a little bit more, just as a thankyou for thier attituted as a gun shop.

clubsoda22
March 26, 2004, 09:41 AM
If a gun shop has the gun i want and has it for a resonable price, i'm not gonna go ordering online to save $20. I'd rather pay the 20 and have it today.

I don't like the idea of charging for nics. It just seems petty if someone just dished out hundreds of dollars for a new gun.

Lennyjoe
March 26, 2004, 10:23 AM
I use two guys here for FFL transfers.

One works at Raytheon and will meet you anywhere to do the transfer. $20 is the cost. Rincon Concepts.

Other one is AJC but he is up near the Mt Lemmon highway and he charges $15 for the transfer at his house.

Both guys are very professional.

I even asked the Marksman how much they wanted and they quoted me at $50 bucks and I laughed at them. Last time they did one for me it was $25 back in 2001.

Eskimo Jim
March 26, 2004, 11:05 AM
THe going rate around here is $25. Some shops charge $30 or more. I've rarely done transfers like that though. I think that I have done two out of state transfers for a revolver and a pistol.

I believe that $25 for at most, a half hour worth of paperwork is plenty.

If you're going to need the service on a regular basis, could you negotiate something with the owner? If he stings you for $50 each time, you'll go someplace else. If he could drop the price to $25 you'd gaurantee him three transfers or something.

Is there an FFL holder here that can educate me on the transfer process? I sure looked easy to me twice and it didn't take much time. Is $25 or less a fair cost for some of your time without tying up any of your capital?

-Jim

Highland Ranger
March 26, 2004, 11:15 AM
Depends on where you live.

Here in NJ, Davidson's prices are competitive and for some of the S&W PC gun's, they are actually cheap.

Bought a S&W PC light hunter thru Davidson's after I called every shop in the area. Most said they couldn't get it (every one asked me if I had a purchase permit so that may give you a clue as to the idiots they deal with), the one or two that said they could get it quoted me S&W list price or more.

Bottom line is they want to sell what is in their case, transfers and special orders don't interest them especially in a gun unfreindly state like NJ.

I think I have finally found one guy, not anywhere near me but he knows his guns, his prices aren't an affront to my intelligence and if I develop a relationship with him over time I expect he will help with transfers.

Bought a Lew Horton S&W thru him and he was a pleasure to deal with.

RepublicanMan
March 26, 2004, 12:53 PM
Club it's called overhead. The shop has to pay the employee that is making the call, the shop has to pay for the employees insurance that is making the call, the shop has to pay the phone bill for the phone that the employee is using to make the call. The shop has to pay the employee that takes the information down, files the 4473, makes the appropriate notations in the log book. The shop has to pay the electric bill. The shop has to pay either rent or property taxes on the building. I'm sorry you don't feel as though a shop should be paid for the time it spends on servicing its customers. I don't see it as being petty and I don't have a problem with paying for services rendered provided it's done in a professional and courteous manner.

Eskimo Jim
March 26, 2004, 01:00 PM
RepublicanMan,
You're right about overhead etc.

what's a fair price for this service, transferring a firearm and doing the paperwork? The work doesn't appear to take that much time.

I generally look for at a gun shop:

1)service, do they know what they are selling and willing to answer my questions regardless of how mundane they might be to an 'expert'. Are the courteous, friendly and knowledgable.
2) do they sell what I want
3) do they treat my wife well. If they treat her like an idiot or suggest 'how about a nice little 22 for you that doesn't kick at all", I walk out
4) convenient hours/location
5) will they do a little extra service for me like handle transfers or special orders.

If they do that for a reasonable price then I go back. THere is a difference between reasonable and lowest price.

-Jim

Majic
March 26, 2004, 01:57 PM
True the overhead must be paid, but the same overhead is paid even when time is spent just showing a customer a firearm even though they declared they are not buying. There's no reason for some of the prices that some shops charge. It is a income and it don't tie up inventory making it a potential lost. The time spent with a customer wanting a transfer is a guaranteed income, not a potential sale. Service is a big part of any sucessful business.

dwkennedy
March 26, 2004, 02:30 PM
I'm sure it costs a bike shop money to pump up kid's tires "for free".

Consider shop A and shop B. Both shops have to buy an air compressor and hire a mechanic. Shop A tries to recover this cost from the customer by charging $1 for a tire full of air. Shop B gives their air away for free.

Which shop gets more traffic? Which shop sells more bikes, tubes, and other accessories?

Gun shops asking a high price for their guns in stock, a high price for a transfer, and doing it with a surly "we don't like to do transfers because you aren't buying what we care to stock" will get what they deserve, as their potential customers will likely find a competitor who offers a better deal.

Every specialty retailer deals with these kinds of issues. Competition from big box retail, category killer stores, mail order and the Internet (mail order on steroids). Little gun shops actually have it pretty good, due to GCA'68 mail ordering guns is a pain in the butt compared to most other products. I'm not required to get a bike shop involved when I mail order a new bike. The gun store can at least collect a few bucks for doing the transfer, then do some "suggestive salesmanship" when I'm in the store to sign the forms. "Would you like some ammo with that? Would you be needing a holster to put that in? How about a sling or a scope?"

Zundfolge
March 26, 2004, 04:06 PM
I've never had an Instant check take over 5 minutes total, and I get delayed every time.
That was my experience when I lived in Kansas.

Here in Colorado, however, they use NICS for CCW apps too. Thats why my FFL says you have to wait on hold for up to an hour because NICS is overloaded here.

It really must depend on where you live.



dwkennedy, you make a good point, but I've noticed over the years that a LARGE percentage of gun shop owners are NOT businessmen ... they are hobbyists who have found a way for their hobby to pay for itself (although many fail).

On many issues, gun shop owners tend to be their own worst enemy :p

RepublicanMan
March 26, 2004, 08:24 PM
For every customer that comes into a gun shop and actually makes a purchase there are 10 to 15 that come in and require 15 - 30 minutes worth of time (assuming you're in a quality shop that will spend time just showing guns and answering questions) and don't buy a thing. That lost time has to be made up somewhere........there's not a thing wrong with charging a reasonable fee for a transfer OR an Instant Check and all the complaining in the world isn't going to make that fact any different.

NapAttack
March 26, 2004, 11:38 PM
there's not a thing wrong with charging a reasonable fee for a transfer OR an Instant Check and all the complaining in the world isn't going to make that fact any different. I think that's the question here. What is a reasonable fee? Do you as the shop owner get to decide what is a reasonable fee? Nope. Sorry. Keep thinking that way and you won't be in business long.

I'm not slamming you or flaming you personally but I believe this is a problem many small business men have. I've seen it stated many times before. I'm afraid that customers complaining is going to make that fact different. When customers complain they are dissatisfied and when customers are dissatisfied they look for alternatives. Places that will satisfy them. ie, they take their money and business elsewhere.

You do not get to decide what is a reasonable fee. Your customers do. Only the government can decide what a reasonable fee for services is and make it stick because they have the power to use force to make you pay their fees.

Look at how many people here have stated that they took their business elsewhere when they felt they were being overcharged.

ken w.
March 27, 2004, 01:10 AM
This is a response to a post from a dealer in N.Y.I wasn't refering to our royal pain in the a$$ handgun laws.Thats a whole diffrent thing.Yeah,we in New York have to send NEW guns to have them fired and the empty shell casings sent to Albany to be put on file.We luck out that it's only 12 miles away,but the shop owner or whoever's name is on the FFL has to take it over there(3 hours).This doesn't apply to used guns and we try to stock a lot of used guns.We charge $20.00 per transaction,not per gun.You buy 5 guns or 1 gun $20.00 for transfer.I still feel thats reasonable.

LiquidTension
March 27, 2004, 01:21 AM
The guy I use for transfers used to charge $25 but he recently raised it to $35. When I asked him about it, he told me that after checking his records, he found that he did nearly 500 transfers the preceeding year - that extra $10 will make him nearly $5k more this year. He has no problem doing transfers, but he's a gunsmith and doesn't do retail sales. The way he sees it is the way I think most shops should look at it - a few minutes of paperwork = $25-$35. And since he usually doesn't have to order the gun himself, he really doesn't have any time invested in it other than logging it in.

Other shops either want waaaaay too much money (10% :what: ) or just flat out refuse. I can understand them not ordering something that they would normally sell for a much higher profit, but they're still making money off of the deal and not doing much work for it. And don't try to tell me how much work it is to transfer a gun for someone - I used to work at a sporting goods shop so I know exactly how much paperwork is involved. I have to say that I'd be happy making $25/transfer for the amount of time involved.

RepublicanMan
March 27, 2004, 08:09 AM
A Reasonable fee is the same as a good deal.....if the shop wants $20 and you are willing to pay $20 then it's reasonable.

As I said, the shop I work part time at charges $10 for a Nics / transfer on a firearm purchased through us and $25 for internet transfers etc....

Considering that we make nothing on the sale of the firearm yet have to handle the 4473 and logbook paperwork not to mention get drug into any investigation should the firearm not be on the up and up (not an issue when purchased from online retailers of course) I don't, nor do most people I know, consider that to be unreasonable. The shop owner almost always gives repeat customers discounts on these prices after he gets to know them. Given that (and I swear this is true) our firearms prices are the lowest I've seen in this area as is our ammunition prices.....I'd say it's very reasonable to charge what we charge. Just an example....Wolf 7.62 X 39 sells for $1.99 a box of 20 at our place........$2.29 to $3.79 everywhere else I've seen it.

only1asterisk
March 27, 2004, 08:41 AM
clubsoda22,

Don't take this wrong, but could your personality be a basis for a surcharge? Many of your post are fairly caustic. If you threw that attitude around around my shop I'd charge you the "VIP" rate. ;)

I don't shop at overpriced shops that don't do tranfers and I don't shoot at ranges that force you to buy their ammo.


David

JohnBT
March 27, 2004, 09:35 AM
The closest shop is the indoor range and they charged me $25. They display and sell a few guns.

The next closest, not counting Dick's and Galyan's, is 12 miles or so and they charged $40 the last time I asked. They are a monster-sized store with 3 computerized registers on just the gun counter, 6 or 8 friendly knowledgeable salesguys working(or more depending on the day and the season) and usually have people standing in line to see guns or give them money. I can understand why they'd rather have the employees showing and selling guns 7 days a week morning noon and night than being tied up doing endless $25 transfers. They must pay the employees fairly well because some of them have been working there about as long as I've been buying from them - 32 years.

John

only1asterisk
March 27, 2004, 10:32 AM
John,

I can see a place like Greentops not wanting to do transfers! It's hard enough just to push your way to the counter most days. They have lots of money tied up in inventory and would like to sell you something from stock. Has Mitch at Southern Police Equipment/Southern Gun World stopped doing transfers? He sells a few guns too, but he only makes $25-50 off the average new gun. It is worth most shops time to do a transfer for a customer. They are making the same money as if sold a gun without having anything invested but a little time.

I can see a person wanting a transfer having to wait until customers buying inventory are helped, but I can't understand anyone not talking advantage of this business.

David

clubsoda22
March 27, 2004, 10:54 AM
Clubsoda22, Don't take this wrong, but could your personality be a basis for a surcharge? Many of your post are fairly caustic. If you threw that attitude around around my shop I'd charge you the "VIP" rate.

It may supprise you, but disprite my pension for sarcastic humor, i'm actually a nice guy in real life. Only time i've ever got an attitude with a gun shop employee was after being kicked off a shooting range for a rather BS reason that i've definately posted about before.

Only time i ever get an attitude is when something irritates me. the reason you may think it is prevalent is probably due to this online communities constant liberal bashing. Occasionally, excessively stupid mall ninja/gunshop commando remarks also get the dry wit, and those lacking sences of humor, or at least don't understand my sence of humor often interpret my remarks as harsh.

I think after tomorrows PA shoot there will be plent of people who can attest to my good nature.

joab
March 27, 2004, 11:11 AM
Club it's called overhead. The shop has to pay the employee that is making the call, the shop has to pay for the employees insurance that is making the call, the shop has to pay the phone bill for the phone that the employee is using to make the call. The shop has to pay the employee that takes the information down, files the 4473, makes the appropriate notations in the log book. The shop has to pay the electric bill. The shop has to pay either rent or property taxes on the building. I'm sorry you don't feel as though a shop should be paid for the time it spends on servicing its customers. I don't see it as being petty and I don't have a problem with paying for services rendered provided it's done in a professional and courteous manner.
The NICS fee as I understand it does not go towards the shops profit or overhead, but to the state to help maintain the NICS sysytem as required by law. I may be wrong but that is what was explained to me by a long term non-Rambo-smarter-than-you-type shop employee in a casual conversation outside of his work enviroment. He usually tells me when he thinks his shop is full of BS and actually makes fun of me for shopping there.

And by the way I kinda get Club's smartass humor.
Reminds me of me. Now I really hate him.

joab
March 27, 2004, 11:14 AM
Thanks for the advice and the link. I found a new and eager shop (their description) 10 miles closer to my house and $30 cheaper than where I was gonna go

BarnsBeware
March 27, 2004, 11:16 AM
Now I suppose if it's at your stereotypical "Roll your eyes and sigh heavily because you have to stop telling your best bud the Navy SEEL stories about how you were unofficially attached to the Selous Scouts in Rodesia, and go help a paying customer" pace of gunstore work, then perhaps you really are losing money at only $20-30 per transfer.
Is there a list somewhere of good shops vs bad shops, by region? I guess so! (http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=73135&perpage=25&pagenumber=1) Perhaps if we put pressure on the "bad" shops, they'd rethink their customer service... I found a shop like the above right across the street from the one below, and I bet you can guess where my money goes.

I go to a shop thats absolutely wonderful, never had a problem, and puts customers so high on their list you'd be amazed. As a result, they stay in business and get lots of customers waiting outside before they open, as well as staying after they've closed. No question goes unanswered, and all the guys there are just great. When I asked them about transfers, even BEFORE I became a loyal customer, they charge state minimum, and go out of their way to inform you about the different features, history, etc of the gun they are supposedly losing money on. I don't know, they certainly didn't lose $$$ from my purchases thereafter. Just my unbiased opinion... :D

clubsoda22
March 27, 2004, 11:45 AM
The NICS fee as I understand it does not go towards the shops profit or overhead, but to the state to help maintain the NICS sysytem as required by law. I may be wrong but that is what was explained to me by a long term non-Rambo-smarter-than-you-type shop employee in a casual conversation outside of his work enviroment. He usually tells me when he thinks his shop is full of BS and actually makes fun of me for shopping there.

And by the way I kinda get Club's smartass humor. Reminds me of me. Now I really hate him.

You're on dude, pistols at dawn. :D

Anyway, yes, charging a nics fee makes people believe thatit's going to a nics fund. If you want to fix overhead, raise the price of all your guns $10 and stop charging a fee. Not blasting your business or anything, just a suggestion, because i know a lot of people who are turned off by shops charing extra paperwork fees.

See ya tomorrow at the PA meet.

JohnBT
March 27, 2004, 12:40 PM
"Has Mitch at Southern Police Equipment/Southern Gun World stopped doing transfers?"

They're police-only sales now. The indoor range down the hill(look out for the potholes) behind them did a transfer for me for $25.

John

Majic
March 27, 2004, 02:10 PM
Greentop is one of the high transfer price dealers in the area, but I have purchased many things from them over the years and just deal with very few of the salesmen. When I ask them to do a transfer for me they discount the transfer fee down to one of the lowest prices I can find. It's all in how you do your business. A good dealer will reconize his good customers and work with them. Both parties profit that way.

RepublicanMan
March 27, 2004, 07:40 PM
The NICS fee as I understand it does not go towards the shops profit or overhead, but to the state to help maintain the NICS sysytem as required by law.

Partially true in PA......we are charged a fee for each background check we call in....I am not at liberty to say the amount as I don't know if the shop owner would want me spreading his business about the web.

I worked today so I double checked our prices on NICS and transfers. For a firearm purchased from us, $10. If you are purchasing multiple firearms at the same time, $10 for the 1st and $5 for each subsequent. If you are buying a firearm from your buddy across the street, $20. If you are purchasing from SOG, Aim Surplus or Joe Snuffy in Idaho....$40.

macavada
March 28, 2004, 09:18 PM
I've found a kitchen table dealer who's real good about handling transfers for me - $15 plus sales tax per gun. Not bad. I've also got a gunsmith acquaintance who'll do it for $10 per gun, but he's a little less accessible because he has another business he runs full-time. I don't mind paying the $15 with a little more accessibility.

I approached a few gunshops about the subject of transfers, and you get the vibe right away. No biggie. One local shop prices the guns fairly decently, so I'll buy from them even though they're not too keen on handling transfers. The've got a good guy behind the counter that won't treat you like an idiot. That goes a long way.

I really can't blame a gunshop for not wanting to handle transfers. They are in a really tough business. At some point they'll go through the same kind of changes that other retail sectors have gone through, and we'll be left with less choice and variety.

Roadkill
March 28, 2004, 10:17 PM
Local Pawn Shop/gunstore doesn't/hasn't charged me anything for the last three I've had shipped in, just nice folks, but I always walk out with $25-$30 in ammo or something each time I come in.

rk

JohnBT
March 29, 2004, 11:15 AM
"When I ask them(Green Top) to do a transfer for me they discount the transfer fee down to one of the lowest prices I can find."

Not when it's a NIB Cooper Custom Classic from out of state and they're a Cooper dealer. :)

Anyway, the indoor range is closer to home.

John

Majic
March 29, 2004, 05:55 PM
Not when it's a NIB Cooper Custom Classic from out of state and they're a Cooper dealer.
You really don't expect anyone to give you a good transfer deal for a firearm that you could have bought from them now do you?

JohnBT
March 30, 2004, 10:44 AM
Nope, even though I would have bought it from them if they'd had one.
Travis called Cooper for me and ordering the gun would have taken an estimated 7 to 9 months.

My father is 82 and I decided not to make him wait until next winter when he'd be 83. :)

John

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