Kahr carry


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thomis
December 5, 2013, 11:49 AM
I sold my Ruger SR40C after I experienced the light strike issues. Ruger fixed it and sent it back, no complaints on their CS, I've always been a Ruger fan. I know the perfect gun does not exist but I was ready for a change. Kahr's line of ultra-thin carry guns has intrigued me for years now and I finally broke down and bought the PM40. It seems like people either love or hate Kahrs so I dove in head-first and decided to come up with my own conclusion.
My favorite carry gun is a Smith 340PD. I find this gun easy to carry and a hoot to shoot, so I'm using it in the pics for comparison.
The first thing I did with the Kahr out of the box was take it apart. I found the manual to be very user friendly and in no time I had the gun in pieces. I was surprised to find it very clean inside, no excess lube and oils from the manufacturing process, which seems to be common on new guns that aren't from a custom shop. Regardless, I wiped everything down and applied a thin lube on most surfaces. I read about some folks' suggestions to rack the slide a few hundred times and even keep it in the open battery position overnight. But I didn't do that. I loaded up the 5 round mag with some mild handloads and went right out back. I filled the mag up four more times, each time with a different load and different bullet. I ended up firing 25 rounds that evening in a light rain, at dusk and at 9 yards. Every round fed fine and ejected fine. There were no issues. Here are the results:

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/jtleamer/results_resize_zps1e0e3cbe.jpg (http://s211.photobucket.com/user/jtleamer/media/results_resize_zps1e0e3cbe.jpg.html)

True Blue is also a solid performer in my 340PD (in .357 mag), it did pretty well here in the Kahr in .40 S&W. Power Pistol had the best group, and Winchester white box factory loads did well, too. All bullets were 165 grain.

Here is a size comp with the 340PD:

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/jtleamer/twocompd_resize_zpsd0d448de.jpg (http://s211.photobucket.com/user/jtleamer/media/twocompd_resize_zpsd0d448de.jpg.html)

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/jtleamer/carryguncomps_zpscd14ae50.jpg (http://s211.photobucket.com/user/jtleamer/media/carryguncomps_zpscd14ae50.jpg.html)

A pic with a standard 5" bbl 1911 and Smitty SD40VE:

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/jtleamer/to1911_resize_zps1286b4ad.jpg (http://s211.photobucket.com/user/jtleamer/media/to1911_resize_zps1286b4ad.jpg.html)

This is my first time using the bar-dot combat style sights and I liked them a lot.

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/jtleamer/rearofkahr_resize_zps281293b0.jpg (http://s211.photobucket.com/user/jtleamer/media/rearofkahr_resize_zps281293b0.jpg.html)

A look at the 340PD and Kahr PM40 from behind:

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/jtleamer/twobehind_resize_zps295f5774.jpg (http://s211.photobucket.com/user/jtleamer/media/twobehind_resize_zps295f5774.jpg.html)

340PD from behind, the cylinder is the widest part of the gun and the only part that keeps it from being the perfect conceal carry gun in my opinion:

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/jtleamer/rearof340_resize_zpsdb757997.jpg (http://s211.photobucket.com/user/jtleamer/media/rearof340_resize_zpsdb757997.jpg.html)

Here is the PM40 in my hand, I have medium sized hands:

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/jtleamer/inhand_resize_zps73943e2e.jpg (http://s211.photobucket.com/user/jtleamer/media/inhand_resize_zps73943e2e.jpg.html)

Obviously I have a lot more shooting to do. Kahr recommends a minimum of 200 rounds for break-in. But so far, I'm pleased. If I could highlight one thing I like the most about the PM40, it's the trigger. It really stands out. Very smooth. Its a long pull but very, very smooth with a clean break. I can only imagine it will improve.

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HarcyPervin
December 5, 2013, 12:03 PM
Nice write-up. Glad you like it. The Kahr is the front-runner in my search for a carry gun.

Fishbed77
December 5, 2013, 12:32 PM
I carry a Kahr CM9 on a regular basis. It's a fantastic little pistol. 100% reliable so far, and a surprisingly soft-recoiling and easy to shoot pistol.

wally
December 5, 2013, 01:39 PM
My favorite carry gun is a Smith 340PD.

If coming to a small auto from a revolver, Kahr is right in your wheelhouse!

I've been carrying my PM40 since they first came out, I quickly got a CW9 when they came out for cheaper practice with the trigger and it has quickly paid for itself some 12,000 rounds later :) I pretty much only take it down to replace the recoil and striker springs, otherwise its just a wipedown, couple of passes with a bore snake and five drops of oil on the bearing surfaces.

The PM40 is carried a lot, shot a little.

In your table, the Kahr sights are only adjustable for windage.

Dframe
December 5, 2013, 02:00 PM
After noting the 200 round suggestion in the Kahr manual I deceided that for the first time ever, I would keep a round count. My CW-40 so far has digested 2,500 rounds without a single failure of ANY kind. This includes everything from "Surplus" full power duty ammo to lead bullet handloads, in 4 different magazines. The little Kahr just keeps on ticking. I agree with your feelings on the trigger, very smooth if a bit long. I wouldn't be without my Kahr!

gym
December 5, 2013, 02:00 PM
Greatest carry gun I have carried. And I am as hard to please as possible. It just works all the time with any ammo and all 5 mags I have. Mine is the PM9 with Night sights, 40 is to hard on these over 60+ hands now, maybe 10 years ago, I would have opted for it, but now it's usually my PM9 or an XDS, 45 caliber, does not twist like 40 does.
I was actually thinking of trying the Kahr 45?

silicosys4
December 5, 2013, 03:53 PM
Make sure it doesn't have any of the notorious Kahr issues, become familiar with how the slide stop spring aligns upon reassembly, and you should be good to go.
Wish my Kahrs were some of the reliable ones, but they aren't. Too bad, I wish I could love them. The trigger is top notch and they carry like a dream.

orionengnr
December 6, 2013, 04:20 PM
I've had my PM9 for about eight years, my P45 for almost seven. I had a PM45 for a short time, and am looking forward to owning a CW380 whenever my LGS can get her hands on one.

Great concealable, thin, light, reliable, accurate semi-auto pistols.

Nomad
December 6, 2013, 04:30 PM
I have had a number of Kahrs starting with the MK40 way back when they first came out. I carry a CM9 most of the time. I have always found them to be reliable and very well made. I too like the trigger although a 1911 trigger is hard to beat. So many folks dislike the Kahrs becuase of the trigger.

gym
December 6, 2013, 08:00 PM
I would like to see the Pico, from Beretta, but the Kahr 380 is hitting the shelves again from what I have heard, and it has stellar reviews from everyone I have seen test it.
I had given up carrying a 380, but as a backup gun it may be worth looking at.

chris in va
December 7, 2013, 05:48 PM
I really wish Kahr would make a K45. The P45 just has too much recoil for my liking. Doing away with the polygonal barrel would be nice so I can shoot lead.

saltydog452
December 7, 2013, 07:35 PM
Thank you for the post.

Kinda curious 'tho, why and when would striker springs need replacement?

Thanks,

salty

hardluk1
December 8, 2013, 05:59 PM
Try loading HI-TECH coated bullets from Bayou and or SNS bullets . They run real well in the polygonal barrels of kahr and glock. And don't over look the TP kahr. 1/2" bigger in length ain't much but that and the longer grip sure make for a nice shooter. Now mine is a 40 version not a 45 but my CC ammo is 155gr at 1302fps and is more controllable than my 1911. I also load 200gr for my 45 and 155gr bayous at 1100fps for plinking. I have been carry'n my tp at a 2:10 position and able to sit and drive with it. It is set well above the belt line both iwb and owb.

Not sure with the striker spring as all my kahrs have a wolff rp striker spring in them to lower the pull weight 1 lb. Highest count is only 1600 rounds fired . I shoot them a lot when new and then just enough to stay in tune with them. But I do track trigger pull and have only seen a max drop of 5oz drop from 5.4 to 4.9 with the most fired and that was with in a few hundred rounds being fired. been steady for the last 1000+ rounds.

usp9
December 9, 2013, 09:02 AM
And don't over look the TP kahr.

My TP9 is my favorite of 8 Kahrs.

wally247
December 10, 2013, 06:46 PM
I like my CW9, the CM9 was just too small for my taste. I have pretty big hands though...

JERRY
December 10, 2013, 07:24 PM
my PM45 is on the for sale block, but im starting to appreciate it more and more....

DAdams
December 10, 2013, 08:59 PM
About five years ago I started with the PM9 as a pocket carry. Too heavy for me at almost 17 oz loaded, but I still like the form factor. I tried a J frame 642 but it too was too heavy.
I was evaluating the 340PD when the 340 M&P was introduced. A bit heavier, 14 oz, but the SS cylinder dealt with some of the issues of the PD. I liked the XS night sights better than the FO or blade.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m22/dadams111/Handguns/P3040042.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/dadams111/media/Handguns/P3040042.jpg.html)

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m22/dadams111/P9240010-2.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/dadams111/media/P9240010-2.jpg.html)

The J frame will handle anything from standard .38 spl, plus P or .357.
Typically Speer Gold Dot for short barrel 135 grain.

The PM9 after a return to Kahr will handle most JHP or ball particularly 124 grain Plus P.

thomis
December 20, 2013, 08:54 AM
thanks for the post dadams. i was going for the lightest gun possible thats why i chose the 340 PD over the M&P. My PD has been steller!

thomis
February 19, 2014, 09:26 AM
I've had my PM40 for 3 months now. Here is what I've done, followed by some questions:
1- Initial trip out back. I shot 5 magazines without fail. All handloads. The new gun functioned great. Less than 30 rounds altogether. More accurate than I am and I love the trigger.
2- At home, I took it apart and gave it a good cleaning.
3- Couple weeks later, out back to shoot again. I had more time this day so I put 135 rounds through it, a mixture of my reloads and factory ammo (Winchester white box 165 grain). I had one failure to feed while a rapid fire test. Also when I went to load one of the 5 round mags I couldn't push the follower down and noticed the plastic was chipped. I think this is what is causing the slide to not stay open on an empty magazine. I contacted Kahr and immediately was sent a follower.
4- Back at the bench for a complete disassemble and cleaning. I noticed I had another mag with a chipped follower. I figured out how to load the mags with the chipped followers.
5- Next day, back outside to test the two mags with the chipped followers. The gun functioned perfectly using the mags with chipped followers. They are just difficult to load. I fired about 50 rounds of handloads again, this trip finally reaching and surpassing the 200 round break-in. Not hiccups or malfunctions at all. But every mag has a chipped follower. That's 4 mags I have, all with chipped followers. The gun is still more accurate than I am and it has gotten smoother. The slide doesn't stay open on an empty mag though.

I have an email to Kahr and waiting to hear back.
My questions are:

Should I continue using the mags with chipped followers? Am I in any danger doing so?

Will Kahr most likely want to see my gun?

If I have my gunsmith look it over will I forfeit my warranty with Kahr?

bhk
February 19, 2014, 09:47 AM
The Kahr PM40 is hard on followers. I had one magazine that actually had the follower seperate into two pieces, yet the gun continued to function fine. I called Kahr and they sent two new followers free and with no questions asked.

stogiegila
February 19, 2014, 12:57 PM
I love everything about my CM9 except the long trigger travel. I'm still trying to get used to it. Double taps seem a bit difficult for me. But everything else about the gun is great and mine has been 100% reliable through the first 500 rounds.

heeler
February 19, 2014, 03:17 PM
I wonder if Kahr made a change on the magazines or maybe the company that makes them for Kahr??
I say this because my three year old PM9 has not experienced any follower problems with either of it's six round magazines.
Mine has been 100 per cent.

hardluk1
February 19, 2014, 04:54 PM
thomis Don't ask for just a follower. If one ever breaks the feed ramp needs to be short'n a few th's. Tell them to fix the feed ramp so it will not hit the follower again. Then no more problems

I have 3 kahrs that are 4, 3 and 1 years old with 8 mags maybe 5 thousand rounds fired between them and no broken followers.

jigglyjames29
February 19, 2014, 08:49 PM
Where'd you get those fancy gun holder up things that stick in the trigger guard?

Oh, and it'll keep happening. I remember reading quite a few threads about the barrel ramp making contact with the followers. I think the solution was Kahr grinding it down a little. Don't quote me on that though.

Tony k
February 20, 2014, 12:05 AM
I've got a new cw45, and I wish I could say its been as smooth as your 40. I was having failure to go in to battery problems, but that was caused by my oal being too long (1.265" is too long).

I'm still having issues with rounds nose diving down in to the mag. I've done all the standard fixes recommended on kahrtalk.com, but the problem persists. I'm going to try even shorter reloads (1.230"), and I've also got a couple more mags on the way.

Between shortening the loads and trying new mags, I really hope to get this gun running reliably because I really love everything else about it. If not, I'll have to get over my stubbornness and contact Kahr. I was a little unsure of the trigger at first, but the more I shoot it the more I like it.

Even with all the hiccups I've had, I'd still consider another Kahr. Who knows...I might even get a handgun that ISN'T .45 auto (gasp!)

Enjoy!

340PD
February 20, 2014, 12:00 PM
I own, and alternately carry, the PM9 and 340pd. The triggers are very similar. I have found the revolver, in a good pocket holster will be a bit more comfortable when wearing dress slacks.
Both are great carry guns.

Beentown
February 20, 2014, 12:16 PM
Kahr CM9 is my 90% carry gun. IWB with a Crossbreed Supertuck Deluxe and pocket in a Desantis Nemesis.

Been through Many carry rigs and have stayed with this one for two years and I am not looking to change.

wally
February 20, 2014, 12:31 PM
My Kahr CW9 had been great, until this happened:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=194173&d=1390929171

Broken front right side frame rail. Their "warranty" is not worth much. They expect me to pay shipping to return it with no promise of fixing it :(

I never realized they have EAA class customer service for real problems, beware.

I jumped to the wrong conclusion, that they had good customer service, a few years ago because they sent me a free replacement mag catch (that fixed the problem) when I'd contacted them because the mag kept falling out.

hardluk1
February 20, 2014, 06:11 PM
UPLULA would be the mags loader helper and the first tools ever for range day.

Catshooter
February 21, 2014, 01:09 AM
With a Kahr, if it us eating mag followers it is usually that the follower is smacking into the bottom of the feed ramp on the barrel. If it's doing to all your followers, then it's the barrel at fault.

This can happen with Kahrs. They will fix it.


Cat

hardknocks!
February 21, 2014, 06:07 PM
after I broke just one I make the decision to shorten the feed ramp myself. it seems to be very common.
took a couple hours working slow. the bullet does not seem to even come close to the bottom of the feed ramp when you cycle the slide so I was not worried.
even with broken followers the PM9 worked perfectly.
the three kahrs I have has not one has had any type of failure to fire feed or eject.
kahr should fix your problem. check out car talk forum for some tips.
good luck
here is my favorite
http://i1325.photobucket.com/albums/u625/hardknocks2/IMAG0805_zpscdf9afd3.jpg (http://s1325.photobucket.com/user/hardknocks2/media/IMAG0805_zpscdf9afd3.jpg.html)

bikemutt
February 21, 2014, 08:56 PM
Every time I try to make a case for replacing my Kahr P9 I come up short, for me. It's not perfect by any means but it may just be the most perfect compromise.

I ask myself "what's the one thing you'd change to make it better?", well, I'm not falling for that old trick again. As soon as my pet peeve is "fixed", why there's a new one that's been created.

hardluk1
February 22, 2014, 10:26 AM
I would like a trigger that stacks a little bit. 3lbs to a wall of 5 1/2lbs like a double action revolver. But with a pile of handguns in the safe and all work so well with in there own design I have learned I can't have everything I want in just one handgun.

thomis
March 19, 2014, 10:16 AM
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb255/jtleamer/IMG_5326_zpscdf14792.jpg (http://s211.photobucket.com/user/jtleamer/media/IMG_5326_zpscdf14792.jpg.html)

I was under the impression that they were going to grind/polish on the feed ramp to shorten it but it appears they replaced the entire barrel. Now my questions are:
Is this just another PM40 barrel which has the potential to break followers?
and
Do I have to go through the 200 round break-in process again before it is considered 100% reliable in Kahr's eyes?

Catshooter
March 19, 2014, 11:13 PM
I can only answer your question by saying that it isn't Kahr's eyes that it needs to be reliable in, it's yours.

Some weapons you just trust right away, some the trust has to be built. Or re-built, sometimes. If it can't be re-established, well then . . .

But Kahr generally makes good weapons.


Cat

TarDevil
March 20, 2014, 02:15 AM
I can only answer your question by saying that it isn't Kahr's that it needs to be reliable in, it's yours.


Cat
^^This.
thomis, Ruger didn't do it for you, Kahr won't either. Neither will Smith & Wesson, Glock, Colt, Beretta, Kimber, H&K, or any of the rest.

NONE of the gun manufacturers will give you a written 100% performance guarantee after a repair. Most will stand behind their warranty, but they won't give you written guarantees that the guns will never fail again.

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