Anyone 700x ?


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Sweet Agony
December 7, 2013, 03:16 PM
I have been hunting forever for W231 but I just can't seem to find it locally. I did come across 1# 700x and it appears to meet my load needs of .45, 9mm and .38/357.

Does anyone use 700x and what do you think of it? I will loading on a D-650.

Thanks in advance

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Walkalong
December 7, 2013, 03:48 PM
It will work well in .45 ACP, and is good for light to medium loads in 9MM, is very good in .38 Spl, and will do light to medium loads in .357.

Meters decent. Shoots much better than it meters.

Dudedog
December 7, 2013, 03:54 PM
I can not find my favorite pistol powder Universal. I purcahsed some SR7625 and SR4756. The SR7625 seems harder to find but there still seems to be SR4756 around. I have used both in 9mm, light/medium .357 and .45 APC and they seem ok. Both are small grained and seem to meter well for me.
3rd Generation shooting supply and Recobs Target shop both had SR4756 in stock the other day.

Know this dosen't help with 700x but just an FYI if you have to order.

243winxb
December 7, 2013, 03:56 PM
700X Ok in 45acp & 38 special using cast bullets for me. Does not meter as well as Bullseye. Was using 700x mostly for 12ga shotgun loads for skeet and trap. Will produce more smoke than Red Dot in shotguns. http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n420/joe1944usa/FirearmsReloading102/aPowder1.jpg

sexybeast
December 7, 2013, 04:44 PM
I know a guy that loves it in his 45acp behind a 200 lswc. But it meters worse than Red Dot. I just won't go out of my way to use a powder that measures with a swing of .2gr above and below of what I'm looking for.
Some other member here once commented that 700x measures like corn flakes. Still makes me chuckle!

Offfhand
December 7, 2013, 04:55 PM
I've known a number of bullseye pistol shooters who use and prefer 700X, especially for their 50 yd .45 cast bullet loads. The best 50 yd 10 shot groups I've ever gotten with my .45 long slide in Ransom Rest was with .700X.

Dudedog
December 7, 2013, 05:59 PM
I thought it was 800x that = corn flakes.

Confused tried corn flakes, cheap available at the grocery store, don't meter well for me, low vels, don't burn clean, smokey, smell bad, squibs etc.:neener:
But can be eaten in a pinch!

Arkansas Paul
December 7, 2013, 06:42 PM
I bought some when powder was hard to find. I cursed it the whole time I was loading, but it sure shot good so what can I say. The .2 gr swing didn't seem to effect much. Just set the measure for a middle of the road load and go for it.

I was loading it in 9mm and .38 Spcl.

cfullgraf
December 7, 2013, 06:55 PM
I have been using 700-X in 45 ACP and 230 FMJ since 1980. I guess I like it.

Recently, I have been trying it in 44 Special and 45 Colt.

700-X meters about the same as Unique for me,which means you have to have a good consistent technique with your powder measure and use it religiously.

USSR
December 7, 2013, 09:13 PM
700X is a very versatile powder. Am presently using for: .380 ACP, 9mm, .38 Spl., .45 ACP, .45 Colt, and 12 gauge.

Don

RugerBob
December 7, 2013, 09:15 PM
700x is my go to powder for 45acp. I also use it for my 12ga. Works great in both.

sexybeast
December 7, 2013, 10:27 PM
Dudedog wrote:
I thought it was 800x that = corn flakes.

Confused tried corn flakes, cheap available at the grocery store, don't meter well for me, low vels, don't burn clean, smokey, smell bad, squibs etc.
But can be eaten in a pinch!
__________________


Just came home. Long and cold day. laughed my butt off reading this.
Thank you.

sauer1911
December 7, 2013, 10:35 PM
Im loading 4.8gn of IMR 700x behind a 230gn plated round nose from Precision Delta, 1.20" oal.

Loading on a Dillon xl650, I use it for both 9mm and .45acp. It is very easy to see when setting the bullet, and obvious when there is a double load, even though I have never seen that happen with my Dillon.

Ive never really had a problem with it metering really well.

be safe

ljnowell
December 7, 2013, 11:35 PM
I have loaded a bunch of it in 45acp. You will see some pretty big swings in drops through a powder measure but the loaded rounds dont show it. Its pretty forgiving in that manner. .2gr up or down seems to shoot the same. I have always just loaded it in my 45s until the low charges will function good and the high charges arent above max.

4.6gr under a 200gr lead bullet was my go-to standard when I used it.

bobinoregon
December 7, 2013, 11:45 PM
I use 700x in .45acp just because I have a lot of it and I like to shoot .45 It doesn't meter too well so I run it through the RCBS chargemaster which adds an extra step on my 550 but that's life. For my backyard purposes it seems to work as good as any other powder. I've used it in .380 also with pretty decent results.

ArchAngelCD
December 7, 2013, 11:49 PM
I am not a fan of 700x at all. All the above information is good info and it does work and produce accurate ammo, I just do not like it! It does meter great but it does however meter much better than 800x which I'm sure is a close cousin to corn flakes.

I know powders are hard to find but there are better choices to replace W231. HP-38 is the exact same powder under the Hodgdon label. Zip is also a very close powder to W231. Not quite as close but still a very good choice you can give AA#2 a try. Alliant Green Dot is another powder that's similar to W231.

So, the list is:
W231/HP-38
ZIP
AA#2
Green Dot
N320
Maybe even IMR PB

Louca
December 7, 2013, 11:55 PM
I prefer to use 700X for 12 ga 1 oz loads. But I cannot find it anywhere near me and am thinking of changing powders. I use W231 and Power Pistol for my .45 ACP. Power Pistol mainly for higher energy IDPA loading.

You said you used W231 for .45 ACP but could not find any. You may already know this, but I have heard Hodgdon HP-38 is equivalent to W231. I have heard a few guys say 700X burns a lot dirtier than W231/HP-38 in their 45s.

Lou

cfullgraf
December 8, 2013, 12:02 AM
You said you used W231 for .45 ACP but could not find any. You may already know this, but I have heard Hodgdon HP-38 is equivalent to W231. I have heard a few guys say 700X burns a lot dirtier than W231/HP-38 in their 45s.

Lou

Yes, HP-38 is the same as W231.

700-X probably burns a little dirtier than W231, but it is easy to clean up.

The muzzle area of my M1911s will have some soot on them after a shooting session with 700-X, but it wipes off easily. No extraordinary efforts are needed to clean the pistol after shooting.

I find my 357 Magnum revolvers are harder to clean after shooting powders that are supposed to be clean burning.

FROGO207
December 8, 2013, 08:25 AM
I have several kegs of 700-X and am slowlly working my way through it using 230 grain bullets in all my 45 ACP loadings with both lead and jacketed. They shoot well and burn clean. I found no reason to try another propellant hope this helps.:D

gamestalker
December 8, 2013, 01:39 PM
I haven't used it in a good two and a half decades, when it was Hi Skor. From what I understand that powder was different than the current 700x. But I did use the Hi Skor in 9mm, as well as various other cartridges.

GS

GBExpat
December 8, 2013, 02:07 PM
I rolled my first 700x .357mag rounds in the late '60s. Currently I use it for loading 9mm, .45ACP and .44mag/spc. If I were shooting .38spc/.357mag, I would be using it for them, also.

I am also using up a relatively fresh bottle of Unique and two ancient cans of 800x for developing some 9/45/44 loads ... like everyone else, using what I have until other flavors become available. ;)

... but I like 700x.

Potatohead
December 8, 2013, 02:47 PM
I know powders are hard to find but there are better choices to replace W231. HP-38 is the exact same powder under the Hodgdon label.

I'm not doubting that they are the same but I think Ive seen them listed with different data. Like if your looking at 9mm recipes it will say 4.2-4.8 gr of HP38 but then 4.4-5.0 gr of w231. (example numbers)

I think I recall someone told me this was a recent change and older data may have them listed as different powders? If so, when was the changeover?

sexybeast
December 8, 2013, 04:01 PM
Potatohead wrote:
I'm not doubting that they are the same but I think Ive seen them listed with different data. Like if your looking at 9mm recipes it will say 4.2-4.8 gr of HP38 but then 4.4-5.0 gr of w231. (example numbers)



Where? I use Hodgdon's data from their site. I never have seen this there. If another does what you describe I would be dubious of all of their data and not use it.

Tony k
December 8, 2013, 04:18 PM
I load 45 auto with 700x. 230grain plated lead over 5 grains of 700x. OAL 1.26. Velocity: 800fps +/- 40fps.

My experience is about the same as everyone else. Meters like crap, but shoots accurate and pretty clean.

I'd like to add that 700x is ECONOMICAL. I've paid between 13 and 15 dollars/pound. Compare that to the $27 I spend on a pound of Powerpistol.

cfullgraf
December 8, 2013, 04:22 PM
I'd like to add that 700x is ECONOMICAL. I've paid between 13 and 15 dollars/pound. Compare that to the $27 I spend on a pound of Powerpistol.

You do realize that a "pound" of 700-X only contains 14 ounces these days?

Back in the IMR powders metal can days, a tin of 700-X only contained 1/2 pound.

700-X can still be economical.

Potatohead
December 8, 2013, 08:37 PM
Potatohead wrote:


Where? I use Hodgdon's data from their site. I never have seen this there. If another does what you describe I would be dubious of all of their data and not use it.
I swear I'd thought I'd seen it somewhere. I will find it over the next day or two and post it when I get a chance. You are right about the hodgdon site, I checked it before I posted that.

sauer1911
December 8, 2013, 09:48 PM
You do realize that a "pound" of 700-X only contains 14 ounces these days?

Back in the IMR powders metal can days, a tin of 700-X on contained 1/2 pound.

700-X can still be economical.
I bought an 8# "keg" of IMR 700X and I got 8# of IMR 700X. I have gone thru about 2 lbs of it, and have been shooting alot in the past year. 9mm, and .45acp. Lets see, 8 lbs x 7000 grains. Divide that by oh lets say 6grains per shot, (thats being generous)

Thats over 9000 rounds of fun!

be safe.

Walkalong
December 8, 2013, 09:50 PM
I have part of a 5 Lb metal can of it left. $50 even. :)

ArchAngelCD
December 8, 2013, 10:10 PM
I'm not doubting that they are the same but I think Ive seen them listed with different data. Like if your looking at 9mm recipes it will say 4.2-4.8 gr of HP38 but then 4.4-5.0 gr of w231. (example numbers)

I think I recall someone told me this was a recent change and older data may have them listed as different powders? If so, when was the changeover?
I can not for the life of me understand why some reloaders refuse to believe the fact both powders are identical even though the powder distributor (Hodgdon) and the powder manufacturer (St. Marks) are both telling you so.

FACT
W231 = HP-38
W296 = H110
W540 = HS-6
W571 = HS-7 (both discontinued)
W760 = H414
WAP = Silhouette

Believe what you want but I will tell you one thing, this is the last time I will make this post because it's just too much now. "You can't fix some things" so I will now stop trying... (unbelievable!) :rolleyes:

Tony k
December 9, 2013, 08:57 AM
You do realize that a "pound" of 700-X only contains 14 ounces these days?

Back in the IMR powders metal can days, a tin of 700-X on contained 1/2 pound.

700-X can still be economical.

What the heck? I just checked and every one of my powders is 16oz EXCEPT 700x. Why is that?

FROGO207
December 9, 2013, 09:24 AM
Because of the bulk a pound of 700-X propellant would not FIT in the standard size size container.;) Trail Boss is the same way, pound container contains less. FWIW I also bought 3 of the 5 LB metal kegs years ago and love the stuff for 45 ACP.:cool:

cfullgraf
December 9, 2013, 10:28 AM
What the heck? I just checked and every one of my powders is 16oz EXCEPT 700x. Why is that?

It used to be in the 1/2 pound of 700-X per tin days, the price per pound of 700-X was comparable to the price per pound of any other powder.

I forget what I paid before the panic for a 14 ounce container of 700-X but I paid a small premium for it a few weeks ago as 700-X is almost non-existent in my area. Spread out over 1200 rounds, the premium was negligible.

It was back in the late 1980s when I discovered a "pound" of 700-X was not a pound of powder. I just happened to look closely at a tin one day. Surprise, Surprise.:)

Potatohead
December 9, 2013, 01:12 PM
I can not for the life of me understand why some reloaders refuse to believe the fact both powders are identical even though the powder distributor (Hodgdon) and the powder manufacturer (St. Marks) are both telling you so.

FACT
W231 = HP-38
W296 = H110
W540 = HS-6
W571 = HS-7 (both discontinued)
W760 = H414
WAP = Silhouette

Believe what you want but I will tell you one thing, this is the last time I will make this post because it's just too much now. "You can't fix some things" so I will now stop trying... (unbelievable!) :rolleyes:

If you'll read my post I said I wasn't doubting that they were the same....I guess looking for an opportunity to get a shot in was more important to you. Have a fine day sir.:)

Potatohead
December 9, 2013, 01:34 PM
Potatohead wrote:


Where? I use Hodgdon's data from their site. I never have seen this there. If another does what you describe I would be dubious of all of their data and not use it.
Steves Pages for one, and I've seen more. I'm not trying to claim his page as some kind of official data supplier though. Nor am I trying to say that hp38 and w231 are the same or different. Just saying that Ive seen different data and have wondered why.

Past couple posts of mine are off topic. Apologies OP and I will remove myself from your thread now.

http://stevespages.com/355p_4_115.html

sexybeast
December 9, 2013, 01:47 PM
Potatohead;
I've stopped using load data from anyone else than the powder manufacturers. I've decided to stop using Alliant powders because of this. The info on the website is just frustrating. They don't list much and it seems imcomplete.
I like Hogdon, I like their website, and their info is consistent. They also list loading for other powders too. Most Winchester powders and many IMR powders.
Five months ago I was not picky and I tried a couple powders. Some I loved {universal} and some I hate {Red Dot}

If you'll read my post I said I wasn't doubting that they were the same....I guess looking for an opportunity to get a shot in was more important. Have a fine day sir.

I understood your point with other sources of load data being suspect.

sexybeast
December 9, 2013, 01:50 PM
Past couple posts of mine are off topic. Apologies OP and I will remove myself from your thread now.



Why remove yourself? You made some good points and asked some very good questions.

ArchAngelCD
December 9, 2013, 02:22 PM
If you'll read my post I said I wasn't doubting that they were the same....I guess looking for an opportunity to get a shot in was more important to you. Have a fine day sir.:)
Potatohead,
If you really think I was only looking for a way to "get a shot in" you haven't read many of my posts.

Why is it we can't disagree these days without someone getting their feeling all hurt? Many would call that a discussion and not be so sensitive.

sexybeast
December 9, 2013, 03:00 PM
Potatohead,
If you really think I was only looking for a way to "get a shot in" you haven't read many of my posts.

Why is it we can't disagree these days without someone getting their feeling all hurt? Many would call that a discussion and not be so sensitive.
Today 10:50 AM


Because there are many "Senior" member with thousands of posts on several forums that "talk down" to others.

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