what's the best fullsize gun to carry


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gym
March 5, 2014, 01:42 AM
Sig, XDM, PPQ,CZ, Glock, Let's try to stick with 9,40 45. Unless you only carry a 10 . I find most in the 500-1200 dollar range, with 14-20 round mag. Starting to like the 32 oz. sig MK2, the 5 inch PPQ , XDM 19/13 round bitone carry, CZ P07 or larger 20 round 09. And of course the original Glock,17,19,21,19 etc. Also are we kidding ourselves when trying to find polymer guns, that have better performance that a Glock, I have tried hundreds and they are pretty much similar other than a DE- cocker or a safety, the pro series and higher end polymer guns are every but as a accurate as anything else out there.
We all seem to want that compact 20 round, under 20 oz, bulpup pistol that is under a inch thick has no recoil a 4 lb trigger. If we get it then we want it in 45. It's obvious we need 2 guns, "well a lot more than 2" but 2 to go. The little one that get's you to the bigger one that has laser/light, and capacity do hold off a catastrophic incident in time to clear your family and whoever else from harms way. I like to think my PM9 or Xds would help, but they have limited use, I would much rather have a CZ 09 with 3 mags nearby. Maybe an AR pistol in my trunk.

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BigBore44
March 5, 2014, 02:10 AM
So, is it a question? My full size carry gun is an XD-45. If I could find a way to shoot a 1911 I would carry that instead. But they are just to small for my hands. Heck I have to have a Hogue grip just to make the XD fit right. And Glocks are great guns. I personally think they are ugly. But it's just an opinion of what's personally aesthetically pleasing to me. A polymer framed 1911 with grip inserts would be the ultimate carry gun in my opinion.

barneyrw
March 5, 2014, 02:19 AM
That's like asking, what's the best car to drive.

Lj1941
March 5, 2014, 02:25 AM
Ask 25 people-get 25 different answers. My personal favorite is my fullsize 45 M&P.;)

Lucky Derby
March 5, 2014, 05:06 AM
M82A1 :D
Kidding aside, it is kind of an individual thing.

ritepath
March 5, 2014, 01:57 PM
Whatever full size is lightest and thinnest would be my answer.


If I were to buy a full sized poly it would be an M&P.

My next FS pistol will either be an M&P 45 or p227. Depends on how patient I am.

snooperman
March 5, 2014, 04:28 PM
Only you can make that decision. Any one of the guns you mentioned would do. Some people like Glocks and shoot them well. I am not one of them as I do not like how they feel in my hands. It is an individual thing.

armoredman
March 5, 2014, 04:46 PM
If you want to carry any sidearm, the method you use will determine the sidearm you can carry. Also, a good gun belt, (not a cheap belt from WalMart), and holster will make the carry system work. The gun belt is critical to keep the gun from shifting and printing. Even full size guns can be hidden with the right gear.

Case in point, my personal carry pistol, CZ SP-01 Phantom, standard magazine is 18 rounds, shown with optional 16 round "short" magazine.

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/armoredman/High%20noon%20Gear/DownUndertwomonthslater.jpg (http://s16.photobucket.com/user/armoredman/media/High%20noon%20Gear/DownUndertwomonthslater.jpg.html)

Pistol is being carried in a High Noon Down Under IWB holster, (and is also as I type this, ;) ), on a High Noon Rock Steady gun belt. I can hide this under a loose t-shirt. Winter months the standard 18 round magazine goes on for use with light covering garments - doesn't get very cold here in AZ. ;)

This set up for a CZ P-09 Duty, (19 round standard flush fit magazine), works well with a light covering garment,

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/armoredman/High%20noon%20Gear/Bisononthebelt1_zps4f5491e7.jpg (http://s16.photobucket.com/user/armoredman/media/High%20noon%20Gear/Bisononthebelt1_zps4f5491e7.jpg.html)

That is a High Noon Slide Guard, (a favorite of mine), in the new Bison Hide flavor, also on a High Noon Rock Steady gun belt.

http://www.highnoonholsters.com/

Top quality gear. Just so I can say I gave equal time, here is a Beretta Storm PX4 in a High Noon Down Under with the single C clip - actually a very easy to use clip on that actually stays where it's clipped.

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/armoredman/High%20noon%20Gear/DownUnderBerettafrontlogo.jpg (http://s16.photobucket.com/user/armoredman/media/High%20noon%20Gear/DownUnderBerettafrontlogo.jpg.html)

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/armoredman/High%20noon%20Gear/DownUnderBerettasidelogo.jpg (http://s16.photobucket.com/user/armoredman/media/High%20noon%20Gear/DownUnderBerettasidelogo.jpg.html)

See the single thing that stays the same? Let me illustrate this in a picture...


http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/armoredman/closeride.jpg (http://s16.photobucket.com/user/armoredman/media/closeride.jpg.html)

That's a bad old picture of a High Noon Slide Guard with a CZ P-07...and a generic thick leather belt. One item is bending more than it should, and it isn't the holster. ;)

JohnBiltz
March 5, 2014, 06:06 PM
Weight matters if you are talking about a 24/7 carry gun. For me its going to be a Glock. Some people are sensitive to thickness for IWB carry. But I'm already carrying a G26 and a G17 is not any thicker. OWB well thickness does not matter there.

ExTank
March 5, 2014, 06:43 PM
Obligatory "Don't Forget Walther" Post. P99, P99AS, P99QC, PPQM1 or 2...

Like others have said, it'l boil down to your personal preference for grip, shootability, etc. Walther has excellent ergos (not including the box-with-a-grip-PPX), but some don't like the paddle-mag release; the PPQM2 addresses that with the more standard push-button mag release.

Standard mag. caps are 15 in 9mm, 12 in .40 S&W.

blakec3686
March 6, 2014, 01:33 AM
fwiw I carry a glock 22 and love it lol. 15 rds in the mag of .40 hollow point is good protection when bumming around the ol' homestead

tarosean
March 6, 2014, 01:48 AM
:confused::confused::confused:

1911 guy
March 6, 2014, 02:27 AM
The best gun for CCW is the one that fits these criteria:
1) Largest caliber you can manage
2) Largest frame you can conceal
3) Fits your hands well
4) You shoot it accurately

Wreck-n-Crew
March 6, 2014, 02:49 AM
Weight matters if you are talking about a 24/7 carry gun. Many people believe that carrying around an extra pound is a nightmare ( Really it's less). Other than the extra drag on the belt I have found it to be as forgotten as a light one. Just depends on how you wear it. Heck LE did it for years.

Weight has it's advantages. It adds steadiness and reduces recoil. Also faster follow up shots. Don't get me wrong I am not advocating a truth but dispelling an old myth. More used used to help sell the lighter is better idea. Really no different than the self defense triggers with no manual safety. If you don't give them a real chance you will never buy the reasoning. Steel is expensive, plastic isn't. Sig makes it work as well as Berretta and others (CZ).

I have carried many full sized guns. I currently switch out between the Glock 22 and the S&W 5906. Both have their pro's and con's. But I gave them a real try and nothing hard about them. The 5906 goes in the 5 o'clock position with a Fobus paddle holster. The Glock is in an Uncle Mike's IWB for the moment. I have a shoulder rig I sometimes use both in. but the Glock rides better in it.

I don't like Cross Drawing so not really fond of the Shoulder rig but I usually carry a backup compact 45 when I wear it. Going some of the places where I go, I am sometimes under dressed if you know what I mean.

I have to agree with the holster and carry position being your best friend. You might find the 5-6 o'clock position comfortable while sitting or standing. I like appendix carry if I am standing but not for sitting. 3 o'clock is fine for OWB but pocks and catches on things. It also gets covered up by a seatbelt for me making it hard to retrieve. Armoredman Pointed out some nice holsters that really help with printing and has some great advice.

Bellybands are nice for Smaller pistols IMO. Actually great for concealing them as well as decent comfort. I just don't recommend it for Full size.

I would recommend a few good guns that are reliable. Sig, H&K if you can afford them and M&P or Glock are more reasonable. Good used ones can be had. I will avoid caliber suggestions other than a 9mm minimum. Since you said up to 1200 I would suggest trying the H&K or the Sig if you only want one gun. For 1200 you can have two M&P's or Glock's however. Your choice.

fwiw I carry a glock 22 and love it lol. 15 rds in the mag of .40 hollow point is good protection when bumming around the ol' homestead Second that^^^>

Never hurts to go to the range and rent them if your range has rentals. See what fits you better. Good Luck and let us know what you end up with!

jjones45
March 6, 2014, 05:40 PM
Well lately I'm a big fan of the walther ppq and cz p09 duty pistols. With that said I can shoot my SR45 more accurately then anything else I own and for a fullsize pistol it doesn't really feel that big(slim and trim)

clance
March 6, 2014, 07:13 PM
The full size I generally carry is a CZ 75 BD Police in the waistband.

http://i785.photobucket.com/albums/yy135/stmichps/CZ75Pistols.jpg

Plan2Live
March 6, 2014, 09:47 PM
I shoot 1911s well but am not comfortable carrying cocked and locked. Plus I would prefer higher capacity in a full sized pistol.

I can acquire sight picture and sight alignment faster using Glock goal post sights than other sight configurations but strongly dislike their grip angle and trigger.

I shoot my XDm Compact well and love the trigger but it doesn’t meet your criteria for a full sized gun. Assuming the full sized XDm shoots as well, I could say that would be best, for ME, but I don’t like carrying a striker fired pistol with a round chambered unless I know for certain I will be in an environment that allows me to keep the gun holstered until needed. That’s not the field I get to play in.

The S&W M&P offers ambidextrous slide lock which might come in handy if I had to clear a double feed while my right hand was disabled. However, I don’t like M&P’s hinged trigger.

I have no experience with HK but hear the triggers are lousy.

I personally prefer a DA/SA hammer fired configuration and carry one often. So for me it would be a Sig 226. I like the idea of the Sig 227 (.45acp) but having only 10 rounds in a full sized go to war gun seems insufficient so the 226 in 9mm wins for me, based on your parameters.

WestKentucky
March 6, 2014, 10:09 PM
Pmr30. Because everybody wants 30rds of 22 mag with the reliability and accuracy of keltec on their hip.

mgmorden
March 6, 2014, 10:58 PM
I like striker fired guns. Glock or M&P would be fine - M&P would be my preference but there's not a lot of difference one way or another. SR9 isn't a bad choice either but I don't like the thumb safety (even if you don't use it there's a chance it could get flipped on accidentally).

I'm sure the XD is probably fine too but I've never actually shot one so I can't vouch for it.

horsemen61
March 6, 2014, 10:59 PM
Glock 17

David E
March 7, 2014, 03:36 AM
The best full size gun to carry is the one you WILL carry.

bannockburn
March 7, 2014, 07:37 AM
Love my Colt Lightweight Government. In a 9mm. I would go with my Browning Hi-Power.

Ankeny
March 7, 2014, 10:38 AM
I can acquire sight picture and sight alignment faster using Glock goal post sights than other sight configurations but strongly dislike their grip angle and trigger. That's confusing to me. I always thought the better the ergonomics the faster the sight aquisition?

gym
March 7, 2014, 12:44 PM
David I know al the cliché's too. I carry a gun everyday 24/7 for 44 years, I am asking a legitimate question, as I am looking at some new models, like the C, 07,09, sig Mk2,XDM, etc. I already know what I already carry.

David E
March 7, 2014, 12:56 PM
David I know al the cliché's too. I carry a gun everyday 24/7 for 44 years, I am asking a legitimate question, as I am looking at some new models, like the C, 07,09, sig Mk2,XDM, etc. I already know what I already carry.
24/7, eh? Bet taking showers is tough on blued guns....

Look, not trying to be flippant as it's a legitimate response. A Glock 17 or 19 weighs less an than an all steel full size gun and will be easier for most to carry. But some prefer the thinner 1911 over the fatter Glock, regardless of the weight/capacity difference. What one person prefers another will quickly dismiss.

I'm a little confused why, after carrying a gun "24/7 for 44 years" you're asking this question now. It seems logical that you'd go with what you "already know and already carry."

Do you want to change " just because," or has your current carry gun raised a concern?

Of the guns you list, the Glock 19 is the very best melding of size, power and capacity. It's small enough to make carrying easier, yet big enough to shoot like a full size.

Plan2Live
March 7, 2014, 08:23 PM
I said:I can acquire sight picture and sight alignment faster using Glock goal post sights than other sight configurations but strongly dislike their grip angle and trigger
Ankeny Asked:That's confusing to me. I always thought the better the ergonomics the faster the sight aquisition?
My Answer: Visually speaking I acquire sight picture and sight alignment faster using the goal post style sights. That has nothing to do with ergonomics it has everything to do with how my eyes focus.

David E
March 7, 2014, 08:57 PM
I said:
Ankeny Asked:
My Answer: Visually speaking I acquire sight picture and sight alignment faster using the goal post style sights. That has nothing to do with ergonomics it has everything to do with how my eyes focus.
Then it begs the question: how fast, exactly, are you talking?

C0untZer0
March 8, 2014, 03:37 AM
HK Mark 23 stoked with +P ammo

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=195857&stc=1&d=1394264196

hartcreek
March 8, 2014, 08:46 AM
$1200 range well my Automag cost me that when I bought it. A second choice is a S&W 629 or even 624. Yes they are heavy but men can carry some weight in a quality holster and with a quality heavy gun you have control.

Chocolate Bayou
March 8, 2014, 12:03 PM
With right belt and holster, my 1911 is no problem

sgray
March 8, 2014, 02:07 PM
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the "new" HK45 (not the H&K .45 USP) given the fact that it's been so thoroughly torture tested for military use.
-Is it the cost or other issues?
The #1 feature in a "carry" sidearm is reliability. Has anyone had problems with this sidearm?

tarosean
March 8, 2014, 05:53 PM
Dang COUNTZERO, he asked for fullsize not supersized...

ChCx2744
March 8, 2014, 07:36 PM
Glock 34, CZ 75 SP-01 Tactical, HK USP .45 Tactical, Glock 21 SF, Ruger Redhawk .44mag, S&W 629 .44mag, Colt Anaconda, Beretta 92FS

Pyzon
March 9, 2014, 01:57 PM
Obviously in shorts and tee shirt season, (especially shorts without a belt) a big heavy gun is tough to cover and hold up.

Add a regular short sleeve shirt, maybe unbuttoned over the tee for social activities and my full sized 75B goes unnoticed even by my wife.

I promise you that if you try to hold up anything of any weight or size with a cheap and flimsy belt, you will be buying holsters constantly.

Do yourself a huge favor and buy a real gun belt, like what Jim The Beltman crafts in NC.

Plan2Live
March 9, 2014, 09:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plan2Live
I said:
Ankeny Asked:
My Answer: Visually speaking I acquire sight picture and sight alignment faster using the goal post style sights. That has nothing to do with ergonomics it has everything to do with how my eyes focus.

Then it begs the question: how fast, exactly, are you talking?
Less than 1/2 of a second, more than a 1/4th a second on average, depending on lighting. Why does it beg the question? Checking to see if I actually knew the answer or are we going to go down the "well then buy a Glock" road? Cause #2 ain't gonna happen. Every pistol has tradeoffs, I'll deal with a compromise in sight acquisition and retain the other features I prefer that Glock doesn't offer. I am already planning to see what my Ophthalmologist can do to help me next time I go in.

David E
March 9, 2014, 10:00 PM
Less than 1/2 of a second, more than a 1/4th a second on average, depending on lighting. Why does it beg the question? Checking to see if I actually knew the answer or are we going to go down the "well then buy a Glock" road? Cause #2 ain't gonna happen. Every pistol has tradeoffs, I'll deal with a compromise in sight acquisition and retain the other features I prefer that Glock doesn't offer. I am already planning to see what my Ophthalmologist can do to help me next time I go in.
I'll answer the second part first: I don't care if you buy a Glock or not. Don't know how you even thought I was implying you should. If you think a certain sight picture helps you see the sights faster, then you can put a pair of similar sights on nearly any gun.

I was asking to see if you knew how fast, exactly you were shooting. You do not. You said: "Less than a half second, more than 1/4 second," but that answer is not very precise, nor is the shooting very fast. (less than 1/4 second is approaching "fast")

Ankeny (former Grandmaster) knows that proper ergonomics are very beneficial when it comes to shooting fast accurately. But you totally dismiss ergos and state that it only has to do with how you can focus on the sights. Subconsciously you're fighting the ergos of the Glock, which takes time, but you still think you're shooting fast.

What gun(s) do you think fit you, yet shoot slower?

If you can duplicate the Glock sight picture (or find something better) on a gun that has good ergonomics for you, then you'll get those splits well under 1/4 second. Why in the world would you willingly compromise on speed of sight acquisition??

If all I had to do to cut my split time in 1/2 was to change sights, I'd do it yesterday!

claiborne
March 10, 2014, 12:38 AM
I would suggest the one that fits you best and you shoot the straightest with the most confidence. It may take years to figure it out and may get expensive!
If your wife loves you as much as mine does, she won't divorce you before you find the right one. :D My go to handgun is a no frills, Colt/Talo O1970A1MA. I was 40 years old when I bought it. Many full size handguns of various calibers and styles, came before and several have come after. This is the only pistol I own that my son will not get until I die.

Water-Man
March 10, 2014, 01:51 AM
M&P45 midsize 4".

Plan2Live
March 10, 2014, 02:34 PM
David said:I was asking to see if you knew how fast, exactly you were shooting. You do not. You said: "Less than a half second, more than 1/4 second," but that answer is not very precise, nor is the shooting very fast. (less than 1/4 second is approaching "fast")Actually I do know. Al Thompson (moderator here) was the first person to time me, ask him. I have repeated the test on at least two other occasions. Also, please go back and read where I said "on average" which means it varies from session to session, therefore on average is an accurate answer. I disagree with your opinion and believe I can get my "issue" worked out with vision correction not gun replacement.

460Kodiak
March 10, 2014, 04:17 PM
HK45 seems best FOR ME. Don't know about you.

mavracer
March 10, 2014, 04:45 PM
A CCW handgun even a full size one is a compromise and "best compromise" is a oxymoron.

jimbo555
March 10, 2014, 06:45 PM
Glock 19 or 30s will do what you want and are a lot easier to carry all year round!

David E
March 11, 2014, 03:34 PM
David said:Actually I do know. Al Thompson (moderator here) was the first person to time me, ask him. I have repeated the test on at least two other occasions. Also, please go back and read where I said "on average" which means it varies from session to session, therefore on average is an accurate answer. I disagree with your opinion and believe I can get my "issue" worked out with vision correction not gun replacement.
Ok, "less than 1/2 second, more than 1/4 second," right?

Let's assign an average of .37 split time (time between shots)

That is not fast, which means your technique isn't optimal.

Disagree with my "opinion" if you wish. (It's not "opinion," it is observed experience. Mine and countless others)

Hopefully, you'll keep at it and eventually the light bulb I'm trying to turn on will illuminate for you.

Plan2Live
March 11, 2014, 10:00 PM
Ok, "less than 1/2 second, more than 1/4 second," right?

Let's assign an average of .37 split time (time between shots)

That is not fast, which means your technique isn't optimal.

Disagree with my "opinion" if you wish. (It's not "opinion," it is observed experience. Mine and countless others)

Hopefully, you'll keep at it and eventually the light bulb I'm trying to turn on will illuminate for you.
Wow, this one should have ended a long time ago. Unless we can find goal post type sights for my prefered carry gun and run side by side times with one pistol set up with three dots and the other set up with goal post sights, then repeat that test with a one Glock set up with goal post sights and the other set up with three dots similar to my carry gun and compare all of the results then we will never truly know the difference. And if in the end the Glock turned out to be faster, and I doubt it would, but I prefered all of the other features of my current pistol then it still wouldn't make a difference to me. I'm comfortable with my current speed. That's a light bulb moment too. I guess I'll just go on hoping I dont' run up against a former competition shooter turned bad guy that I can't avoid, evade or de-escalate.

jjones45
March 12, 2014, 12:00 AM
I'm really loving this combo as of late

PabloJ
March 12, 2014, 01:25 AM
That's like asking, what's the best car to drive.
Easy to answer question chauffeur driven Rolls-Royce/Bentley would be the way to go. Full size pistols for carry are best left to law enforcement, military and personal body guards.....so blue collar!

David E
March 12, 2014, 03:58 AM
Wow, this one should have ended a long time ago. Unless we can find goal post type sights for my prefered carry gun and run side by side times with one pistol set up with three dots and the other set up with goal post sights, then repeat that test with a one Glock set up with goal post sights and the other set up with three dots similar to my carry gun and compare all of the results then we will never truly know the difference. And if in the end the Glock turned out to be faster, and I doubt it would, but I prefered all of the other features of my current pistol then it still wouldn't make a difference to me. I'm comfortable with my current speed. That's a light bulb moment too. I guess I'll just go on hoping I dont' run up against a former competition shooter turned bad guy that I can't avoid, evade or de-escalate.
You're totally missing my point.

YOU said you shot a Glock faster simply because of the "goal post sights." This is significant because you do not like the Glock, it doesn't fit you, whatever your reasons are. Bottom line is that you prefer other gun(s), presumably because of better ergonomics, features, etc.

Yet....by your own assessment, you shoot Glocks faster, despite not liking them, strictly due to the sight picture.

Soooooo, why not find sights for your preferred gun that give a similar Glock sight picture? Get the sight picture you like put on the gun you like. Why wouldn't you do that?

Seems like an obvious thing to do.

Inebriated
March 12, 2014, 04:32 AM
So this thread is basically about finding a gun that's not a Glock? :scrutiny:

PabloJ
March 12, 2014, 06:35 AM
I would say G21 plus Samopal 58 with folding stock would make very good response to catastrophic incident combo.

MDI_Weapon
March 12, 2014, 06:49 AM
I usually carry a 5" 1911 or Combat Commander (Novak sights, Brown tactical thumb safety, 4lb trigger, blah blah blah) in an IWB holster. With the right belt and holster both pistols are easy to conceal. More often than not with a 3913 or LC9 as backup.

In the past I have carried (and occasionally still carry):
Beretta 92FS (a hockey stick is probably easier to conceal)
Beretta PX4 Storm (very nice polymer pistol - amazing accuracy)
Glock 21 - nice chunk of weight when fully loaded and you add a spare mag but entirely do-able in a good IWB holster...I may have to try a Glock 41 at some point just to take hockey stick status away from the 92FS).
Glock 23 - Easy to conceal under any type of coat or jacket. I don't really care for it in an IWB. It is as small as my hands will let me go with Glocks as their subcompacts just feel way too funky to me.
CZ 75 - great pistol all around. Maybe a little heavy to some but that pays off in double tap (or quadruple tap if you are so inclined) times.
Para Ordnance P14 or P16 - both very customized (talk about some weight on the belt when fully loaded and you add a spare mag or two...)

During the insanely hot and humid southern summer months: 1911, Combat Commander, Glock 23, S&W 3913, Ruger LC9. Out of those, the Glock 23 gives me the most trouble due to its thickness or balance when trying to conceal it...maybe it is a combination of the two. Thin is always relatively easy to conceal even if it is thin and heavy.

Occasionally, just a 1911, LC9 or 3913 with a couple spare mags - and an M4 profile AR in the trunk.

1911 guy
March 12, 2014, 09:24 AM
Well, since we're going to give specific recommendations instead of advice on choosing his own, here's mine: fullsize 1911 with two reloads on opposite side, along with a couple knives (at least one fixed blade) and a flashlight.

That's my "compromise" EDC. What would I like to carry? Something crew served, but I'd get funny looks when I go to walmart.

powder
March 12, 2014, 09:56 AM
Zastava M92 O PAP, single point sling mount by Echo-93, Night Brake by Manticore, and go to town. Ammo is cheaper than .45 right now, and 30 rd mags are just around $20.

cfoodeat
March 13, 2014, 09:46 PM
My hands are on the small side and a Ruger SR40 works well.

JDR
March 14, 2014, 04:14 AM
The gun you train with properly and most often is the one you should carry.

gym
March 14, 2014, 08:33 PM
The problem with that is in Fl where I reside now. It's too hot to carry the guns normally would choose. I have carried dozens of guns in 40+ years of carrying, I just really wanted to see what other people would suggest, in order to possibly come up with a solution I haven't thought of.
At the present I carry 2 most times, but they are both small, a PM9 and an XDS. One in a pocket and one in a Fanny. Since they are both lightweight they offset each other, but I always look for a better solution, just haven't found one. Been thinking about a Sig 238 again but the weight comes to bear on anything with more than 6 or 7 rounds. Bullets are what are heavy, not so much guns, you throw 20 rounds in that CZp09 and it suddenly becomes a barbell. One solution is "liberty ammo" the 50 grain bullet that travels at 2000fps. I put them in my Kahr and it now weighs half of what it did, "or at least feels that way". I would like to load them in all my 9's if had more statistics on ballistics with them.
The CX 07 and 09 are lightweight but neither are small enough for the weather, it looks like nothing is actually better than what I already have, just a waste of money.
Maybe a titanium revolver again, or the 238 SIG. thanks for those who actually came up with possibility's, sometimes you miss one. It's really more to do with practicality than choice down here. Try hiding a 1911 in a pair of shorts and a tee shirt.

jjones45
March 15, 2014, 12:08 AM
The problem with that is in Fl where I reside now. It's too hot to carry the guns normally would choose. I have carried dozens of guns in 40+ years of carrying, I just really wanted to see what other people would suggest, in order to possibly come up with a solution I haven't thought of.
At the present I carry 2 most times, but they are both small, a PM9 and an XDS. One in a pocket and one in a Fanny. Since they are both lightweight they offset each other, but I always look for a better solution, just haven't found one. Been thinking about a Sig 238 again but the weight comes to bear on anything with more than 6 or 7 rounds. Bullets are what are heavy, not so much guns, you throw 20 rounds in that CZp09 and it suddenly becomes a barbell. One solution is "liberty ammo" the 50 grain bullet that travels at 2000fps. I put them in my Kahr and it now weighs half of what it did, "or at least feels that way". I would like to load them in all my 9's if had more statistics on ballistics with them.
The CX 07 and 09 are lightweight but neither are small enough for the weather, it looks like nothing is actually better than what I already have, just a waste of money.
Maybe a titanium revolver again, or the 238 SIG. thanks for those who actually came up with possibility's, sometimes you miss one. It's really more to do with practicality than choice down here. Try hiding a 1911 in a pair of shorts and a tee shirt.
The p09 suddenly becomes a barbell, lol. That's funny but true. I just got the image in my head of a guy with two fully loaded p09 duty pistols doing alternating bicep curls

Hurryin' Hoosier
March 15, 2014, 09:52 PM
For my money, a full-size new handgun would be a CZ 75B. My personal favorite in the 75 family, though, is the CZ 75 Compact.

I usually pocket-carry and my all-around favorite for that purpose - old or new, though - would be a tie between my CZ vz.70 and my CZ vz.82 (the vz.82 when I'm wearing cargo pants or shorts).

xXxplosive
March 15, 2014, 10:47 PM
Although I love my 1911's......IMO the best full size gun to carry would be the Glock 21sf hands down.

MDI_Weapon
March 15, 2014, 11:07 PM
I have always wondered why people are so concerned about high capacity on a carry gun (outside of military or law enforcement use). According to most (if not all) statistics the average self defense gun fight is less than 5 rounds. I am not opposed to high-capacity pistols by any means as I own Glocks, Berettas, Paras, etc. which are double stack high caps but I also don't really expect to run into any situation where is it me vs. 10-20 bad guys on a trip to Kroger or the bank.

gym
March 15, 2014, 11:52 PM
MDi it's not 10 guys, it's the fact that you will mis 30-50 % of your shots when in a gunfight, plus it takes between 3 to 4 rounds per bad guy, to stop them unless you pull off head shots on moving targets. the math will prove the need for 10 or more rounds.
It's not like they are going to stand still and not shoot back at you while running.

KSDeputy
March 16, 2014, 02:01 PM
If I was going to carry a full size pistol, it would be my S&W 4506. This was my duty pistol, once to the range after issue (50 round course of fire). When we retire we get our duty gun. So the Sheriff's Office gave me this almost new one.

tarosean
March 16, 2014, 03:33 PM
the math will prove the need for 10 or more rounds.

So our fellow gun owners in capacity restricted states are just SOL?

jjones45
March 16, 2014, 08:11 PM
So our fellow gun owners in capacity restricted states are just SOL?
And revolvers are useless, lol

MDI_Weapon
March 17, 2014, 01:43 AM
MDi it's not 10 guys, it's the fact that you will mis 30-50 % of your shots when in a gunfight, plus it takes between 3 to 4 rounds per bad guy, to stop them unless you pull off head shots on moving targets. the math will prove the need for 10 or more rounds.

It's not like they are going to stand still and not shoot back at you while running.


I don't miss. Not with a tuned 1911 anyway, moving target or not. :)

Apparently, most involved in gunfights do not miss much either - see the above statistic - 5 rounds or less.

1John1:9
March 17, 2014, 09:49 AM
My all time favorite carry guns are the 4" barrel semi-autos that are between 4.5 and 5.3 inches in height. They tend to have:


10 to 15 round capacity
Just enough grip to get your full hand on, but no extra to print
Good barrel length for accurate shots
Conceals well with most wardrobes
Good selection of guns
Most important: tend to be more reliable than the "skinny" guns


And here are the ones I've tried and liked:

CZ75 P-01 (or other 75 compacts)
Walther P99AS
Glock 19
Glock 30S

rocksolid
March 17, 2014, 06:51 PM
"but I also don't really expect to run into any situation where is it me vs. 10-20 bad guys on a trip to Kroger or the bank."
If I were to find myself in a situation like that:eek:I'd be longing for one of my Toks with surplus steel core ammo. 8 rnds prolly might be nuff', dependin' on how ya line em up.:D

MDI_Weapon
March 18, 2014, 01:48 AM
"but I also don't really expect to run into any situation where is it me vs. 10-20 bad guys on a trip to Kroger or the bank."

If I were to find myself in a situation like that:eek:I'd be longing for one of my Toks with surplus steel core ammo. 8 rnds prolly might be nuff', dependin' on how ya line em up.:D


I was thinking M4 or AKM for that situation as I usually have one or the other in the trunk - sometimes both.

Bobson
March 18, 2014, 02:05 AM
The best full size gun to carry is the one you WILL carry.
Wise words.

Make my full size carry gun a G17, though I prefer the G19. Close enough to full size capacity, close enough to compact for comfort.

krupparms
March 18, 2014, 04:13 AM
I like a 1911A1 for that job. But the Glock 30 also works well also. Lately I have been useing a S&W., SD9VE. It is accurate &reliable & holds 18 rd.s of 9×19mm. I put nite sights on my carry guns. But only you can pick what's best for you! Good luck!

MDI_Weapon
March 30, 2014, 12:13 AM
MDi it's not 10 guys, it's the fact that you will mis 30-50 % of your shots when in a gunfight...


I have given this some thought and I have to ask where you get those percentages. If you are hitting with only 30-50% of your shots under stress that is quite simply an issue with very poor training and lack of range/trigger time. PD in my area (granted, it is one of the patron states of shootin' stuff) has managed significantly higher -- in fact, almost all have managed hit rates under stress of over 90% and they average less than half my weekly training time. Talk nonsense on forums less and train more would be my suggestion for anyone who can only manage to hit 30%-50% of the time under stress.

gym
March 30, 2014, 12:30 AM
That was taken from a statistical chart of actual gunfights, I will try to find it again, when I have some time. But it does seen realistic when people are shooting at you. When you read about shootings in the paper usually there are 10 fired for everyone that hits.
I shot combat with the FBI and Police, and have a much better than average when it comes to scoring points on targets, but people are a whole different deal, especially if you are trying to avoid being shot in the meantime.
They didn't have forums 44 years ago when I was shooting competition, they didn't have computers either.
Even training under realistic conditions are not realistic, if you know you aren't going to catch a round someware on your person, perhaps those who have been in actual gunfights would have a better perspective on the reality of this. I have been shot at, so I do have a realistic idea of what happens.
Out past 50 feet, I would not want two guys with hi capacity 9mm,handgus, shooting at me if all I had was a 5 shot revolver, "which I carried for 21 years". It was a different world back then. It's not like you are going to have time to set up a shot, they will be on the fly with a barrage of rounds coming back at you. The smart thing to do is get to cover ASAP while you still have rounds left. A 5 shot revolver is great if you are going up against 1 guy, but not 2 or more. All of your shots would have to be perfect which is not what really happens in a gunfight.
I didn't just start this shooting thing, been shooting all my life and have plenty of awards from competitions, but target and street shootings are not the same thing.
Quote:The PMA study also shows that the hit ratio per encounter was closer to 62 percent instead of the often-reported 18 percent. The history of gun fighting for more than a century has shown that the person that lands the first solid hit will usually win the confrontation. Hitting is hard to do without preparation and relying on luck is an invitation to disaster.

Read more: http://www.handgunsmag.com/2010/09/24/tactics_training_what_happens_gunfight/#ixzz2xPrmRZPv
Let's say it's the maximum in this case, that still means that only 6 out of 10 rounds hit the target. Cut that in half for a 5 shot gun, and you have 3 or 2 in the case of a 5 shot revolver, not very good odds.
http://www.theppsc.org/Staff_Views/Aveni/OIS.pdf
Here is another , 15 rounds fired, 3 were buckshot by Police, with 1 hit as the outcome.
This is more the outcome of forum nonsense, the idea that everyone who took a little training can hold their own in a real gunfight, it's self indulgent, and hopefully most will never have to find out. But this idea that the "new wave of internet shooters actually think that this is something that is easily accomplished", is truly disheartening, and could prove harmful.
The hit probabilitys in that chart show 9-19 percent hits, in Police documented gunfights.

MDI_Weapon
March 30, 2014, 01:11 AM
"From a statistical chart"

...

Water-Man
March 30, 2014, 01:33 AM
M&P45 Midsized 4" barrel.

PabloJ
March 30, 2014, 03:21 AM
Something with plastic frame with 12 cartridge or more capacity. Usual suspects are: Heckler & Koch, Walther, Glock, S&W, CZ, Ruger, Springfield XD, Steyr,...... There are just two types striker fired or hammer fired and perhaps something in rotating barrel category I can't think of right now. I would be satisfied with any of them and do not have favorite.

M1GarandDeerHunter
March 30, 2014, 05:06 AM
GYM you have carried for 44 years, What are you using NOW that you feel isnt working out? Mine is a plain Colt series 70 45auto that has been shot and carried extensively. Just wondering. Some really good gun choices out there suggested.

Deaf Smith
March 30, 2014, 06:06 PM
That's like asking, what's the best car to drive.
True.

And the answer to the best one? The one you have.

Deaf

ritepath
March 30, 2014, 10:36 PM
I'm really liking my new p220....it seems slim for a full sized pistol. Any of the ruger SR series would make pretty good fullsized carry pistols since they also seem to carry slim.

iMagUdspEllr
March 30, 2014, 11:46 PM
If the stipulation is that the gun is going to be carried... well then a full size gun might not work at all except in the cooler months when it is appropriate to wear jackets and hoodies.

So, with a winter coat on, choosing our line-up among the manufacturers you named in no particular order:


-P226/7
-XD(M) 9/40/45
-PPQ
-P-09
-G17,21

I prefer striker fired pistols so Sig and CZ are out for me.

Glock has the most firepower with their ridiculously long 33 round 9mm or 27 round .45 magazines.

XDM has a better magazine release than the Glock imo. The XDM also has a flat trigger face which makes it easier for me to push the trigger straight back.

The PPQ (M1) has the best magazine release (imo) and the best trigger but it loses in capacity.

I would take the PPQ. I will definitely have to change magazines more often but I will be more confident and capable of doing that with the long lever magazine releases and I will have the best accuracy with that gun.

So, for me it would be the PPQ. All that needs to happen is get extra long magazines made for the PPQ and it would win hands down (not to mention it is the only one that you could realistically carry all year round... well in places that get warm enough to wear a t-shirt and shorts).

I can see how someone comfortable with DA/SA or condition 1 carry would be best served by the CZ (but it still doesn't quite match the Glock's capacity).

ScarLata
April 1, 2014, 07:15 PM
My full sized poly. L9-A1http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/Cocoliso/Steyr-L9-A1.png (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Cocoliso/media/Steyr-L9-A1.png.html)

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