[JesusCow]

I need suggestions. Right now I have a 10/22 and a Saiga 20. My goal is too have a rifle I can 'punch paper' at somewhat long ranges.

I have a Saiga .223 on mind since the price is right and I already have a red dot that I can use on it. I can't readliy afford an AR-15 type rifle and don't exactly want one right now. I'd like a Mini-14/30 but can't justify the price (what would the going price for one be? wood stock, blued barrel).

Can I get some other suggestions? Under $600 please :) I'm on a budget so anything over $200 will have to be strongly desired, bringing the Saiga .223 into the picture.

Hell, gimmie some good choices for bolt-action .223 rifles.

[retiredsgt]

Pretty much, everybody and their brother makes a .223 bolt action. Keep in mind, with guns as with most other things, you get what you pay for. If funds are limited, how about a used gun? Ruger, Remington, Winchester, Cz, Howa, and a host of others make a .223 bolt action rifle. I picked up a used(but in great shape) Ruger No.1 in .223 at a gun show last year. Talk about a shooter.
Good Shooting!

[N3rday]

Model 1 Sales 16" CAR kit: $450
Eagle Arms stripped lower: $100
Building your own rifle: friggin priceless.

Also, might I reccomend an RRA upper (can be had for less than $400), whatever buttstock you want, an RRA lower parts kit (like $60ish) and an Eagle Arms lower? Lifetime warranty on all RRA parts, and instructions for assembling a lower (a pretty simple process) can be found right here (http://www.ar15.com/content/docs/assembly/lower/)

Both options are available in flattop for mounting that red dot of yours. A detachable carry handle will be another $70, or a good ARMS flip up rear sight will cost you $100 (a good investment I'm told).

Either way, you end up with a good AR for just below that $600 mark, or $700 if you want a sight instead of that red dot.

Or you could just get a Saiga in .223...you could modify it later if you want.

[Beetle Bailey]

For a bolt-action .223 rifle, check out the CZ 527 Lux. It comes with very good iron sights (you can scope it, but I wouldn't) and bolt-action rifles are great for shooting groups on paper since they tend to be more accurate than semiautos. CZ quality is worth the price IMHO.

[mountaindrew]

I would encourage you to try the Saiga 223. I love mine. I dont know why people spent so much more for so little more. Saiga never misses a beat.

[Dave R]

If you don't need a high-capacity magazine...

You can get an NEF Handi-Rifle for $250-$300. Its a single-shot, but has a great reputation for "out-of-the-box" accuracy.

I second the CZ as a good choice in a bolt-action rifle.

If you are planning on shooting at long distance, I recommend a barrel longer than 16". The .223 loses significant velocity in barrels that short. I would go at least 20" on the barrel, and 22-26" would be better.

Other good bolt-action choices:

Tikka T-3 for around $450-$500.
Remington 700, starts around $450
The Rem Model 7 is a little shorter, lighter and more expensive.
The Savage 110 is probably $400 or so.

Ruger, Winchester, Howa, all make a good boltgun in .223.

The Ruger No. 1 is a great single-shot, too. But double the price of the NEF (ro more). Most No. 1 owners would say its worth it, too.

[Hot brass]

Savage FV 12 .223. Most accurate. An affordable gun that shoots like a custom gun. Will shoot well under 3/4'' at 100 yds. Some report shooting better than 1/2" groups at 100 yds. Under $500.00 at your nearest gun shop.

Question. Whats the difference between a $3000.00 custom gun and a non custom gun.

Answer. Usually 1/2" or less at 100 yds.

[roscoe]

I will join the recommendation for the Saiga in .223. I love mine, and it is much more accurate than I have a right to expect.

[itgoesboom]

Roscoe,

What kind of accuracy are you getting? What ammo are you using?

Thanks.

I.G.B.

[roscoe]

I was getting around 2-3" (three shots) at 100 yards off a bench using the factory sights and Silver Bear hollowpoints. It was rainy and foggy, so even though I was under a canopy at the range, I felt like a commando.

[mountaindrew]

I got a 2" group my first outing with a scope, but there was very heavy wind so i could probably do better.

[GTKrockeTT]

Kel Tec SU-16...can be had for $400ish.

[Tropical Z]

Id get a Saiga over an AR anyday!

[mini14jac]

I ordered a standard, blue Mini 14 for $449 +tax about 2 months ago.
If you keep your eyes open, you can probably find used ones for $400 or less.

If I was going to get another AR, it would be a Bushmaster.
My last one was flawless, even with Wolf ammo.
$700+tax around here.

The last time I did the math on building my own AR, after shipping, (maybe tax), and paying an FFL for the lower, I was within $50 of a new Bushmaster locally.
And, if you build your own, the warranty situation gets sticky.

It really depends on what you want to do with it, how much you want to spend, how much work you want to do,etc.

With my Mini 14, I've put an additional $175 or so into modifying it, plus some of my own time, to make it the gun I want.
Right now, good quality 20 and 30 round mags are easier to find for the AR, but not a whole lot cheaper.

If you just want to have fun slinging lead, the Siaga may be the way to go.

[Shane333]

Here's one more for a Saiga .223. Love mine. I'm amazed at how accurately it shoots for an AK variant.

[MrMurphy]

Mini-14 and accuracy are not usually heard in the same sentence..... :) Especially at longer ranges.

And they run $500 new, sometimes that much used!


The Saiga or a nice bolt gun would do. The NEF single shots are amazingly accurate for very little money if the single-shot thing doesn't bother you.

[WhiteKnight]

The NEF single shots are amazingly accurate


'xactly how accurate is that?

[MrMurphy]

I've seen one in .243 with a tiny amount of trigger work but otherwise stock, scoped that shot 0.75" off the bench, five shot group at 100 yards. Not bad for a $100 gun.

[mini14jac]

And they run $500 new, sometimes that much used!

Well, as I said in my post, my Mini 14 was $449, but you can certainly pay more if you're not careful. I'm sure price varies by area, but I'm betting there are some reasonable shops in Texas.
You want to shop around. You know, you don't have to be a resident of a state to buy a long.
The same shop where I got mine sells Bushmasters for ~$700.
You can drive to a big shop, 1/2 hour away and pay $900 for the same gun. :uhoh: :confused:

A little reading on www.perfectunion.com will help with the accuracy issue.
As I said, with a little work and a few dollars, you can get 2" at 100 yards with open sights.
(Bedding kit: $18. Muzzle brake: $20. Outshooting your friend's AR: priceless!)
It just depends on what you want.

And really, who buys an AR, and doesn't spend "a few" extra dollars on it? :rolleyes:
I thought I was going to keep mine stock, then I sold the AK upper and got a M4 upper. Made it a lot lighter.
Oh, and I really needed a Duckbill pistol grip. Got rid of that irritating bump, and the little gap that rubs your finger.
Then there was the A1 stock. Made it just the right length. :rolleyes:

[Browns Fan]

That's amazing, because at the last gun show, I was looking at the Saiga in .223 and was wondering if it shot as good as it looks. The price is right, too! I'd like an AR, but they are out of my price range.

[Leaky Waders]

I have bushmaster and a browning .223.

AR-15 style .223's have a much different rate of twist than most factory bolt action .223's.

The bolt action favors light varmint like bullets....the bushmaster favors heavier nato rounds.

I posted pic's and a group of my bolt action earlier...it's here (if the cut and past works...)

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=32361

If not, then just try cutting and pasting that to your browsers address and see if it comes up or search for .223 bolt action. There's a good discussion on the merits of .223 ammo and accuracy there too.

Later,

L.W.

[Art Eatman]

I picked up a nearly-new Rugilator 77 Mk II in .223. It definitely benefitted from a Timney trigger.

It doesn't seem to care what it's fed, from 50-grain to 70-grain. Any old brand. Mostly one-half MOA for three-shot groups.

Excellent pond-turtle gun. :D

Art

[The Silver Bullet 1719]

Armalite AR-180B?

Costs just about 600, takes AR magazines, 5.56 chamber, 1/9 twist rate, no chromed barrel (if that matters).

[russlate]

Saw a Ruger 77 MK 2 Friday for $495 new, but the interesting thing was it was built to handle like the CZ 527(?) 223/7.62x39 carbines. 18" or 20" light barrel, and stock balanced for it. I know it wasn't a youth model cause I thought it might be and looked.