[Thumper]

I see Walther P-99 Hi caps for sale all the time.

IIRC, the P-99 and (and the joint S&W version) came out WAY after '94. Seems like 1997 or something.

Can anyone explain to me how these mags were legally in the country before the "Crime Bill?" I hope I'm missing something obvious.

Thanks.

[JimC]

I have a somewhat detailed explanation on this on my web site if your interested. :rolleyes:

[Thumper]

Nice site, and I appreciate the info.

I'm not too sure why you felt you had to put the rolleyes smiley in your post.

Also, I'm still confused. You make a lot of mention of pre-ban vs. post ban mags. This gets to the crux of my question. Was the P-99 introduced in this country prior to 94?

I'm not referring to the Walther HLP, but the actual P-99.

[JimC]

Was the P-99 introduced in this country prior to 94?

No.

I first saw the P99 at the 1997 Shot Show in Vegas but Kurt Hindle of Walther-USA now Walther America told me in January of 2002 that it was "first sold into commerce in 1998".

I hope this helps you.

I'm not too sure why you felt you had to put the rolleyes smiley in your post.

Because I like him. ;)

[Thumper]

Understood.

I was also at SHOT in Vegas in '97.

What I'm missing is how there are pre-ban mags for this gun if the gun didn't exist 'til after the ban?

Are the pre-ban mags ALL actually HLP mags?

[JimC]

Are the pre-ban mags ALL actually HLP mags?

That's what they say. ;) Walther/Mec-Gar must have made a whole lot of 'em.

The only ones that differ are the "Turkish" 15 round ones that are floating around.

[cslinger]

Whether this means anything or not I have a detailed letter sent to the ATF regarding these magazines and have not heard back. In that letter I gave pictures of the magazines detailing all markings inside and out and I did a search on the patent number that is on the magazines which yielded a pre-September 1994 date.

I have also contacted Walther with the same info and received a written reply that the mags were indeed pre-ban.

I have also talked to my local ATF dudes and they told me not to sweat it as long as the seller claimed they were pre-ban and there are no markings to make me believe otherwise, like a date code or LEO / Military markings.

I have notorized copies of the correspondence showing that I did indeed mail a whole bucketful of info to the BATF, copies of my Walther Correspondence, copies of my correspondence with the seller etc.

If the BATF ever tells me I have to get rid of them, so be it, but I feel that I have sufficiently researched and attempted to make all parties aware of the situation. I have taken all reasonable and prudent measures as a law abiding citizen to follow the law and can prove this in court if need be. Based on all of this until I here from the ATF saying no I am going to assume I have legal pre-bans.

I sent the letter back in December saying that if I did not hear back from them I would have to assume that they felt these magazines were totally legal for me as a citizen of the United States to posess.

If I ever get a letter back telling me otherwise I will let everybody know.

The only thing that I have found in my research is that there are no legal pre-ban .40 caliber magazines that exist, AFAIK.

If the BATF kick my door in and throw me in jail for my 4 magazines I will be happy to tell my one phone call recipient to let everybody know.

:D

FWIW all the ATF folks I have talked to kind of chuckled at all the effort I was taking to make sure all was legal. All of them told me flat out that they thought it was a meaningless law and not to worry about it. They made mention to it being a good law to add charges to somebody being convicted of another felony but that is about it.

I am not advocating that anybody break the law and I myself will not break the law, but I find it funny that even the people who are supposed to enforce these laws feel many of them are ridiculous.

[cslinger]

By the way, what is a HLP magazine?

[JimC]

By the way, what is a HLP magazine?

The "HLP" stands for Hammer Less Pistol [mfg. 1994]. This is what the prototype P99's were called. Walther apparently decided to go with a numerical name for it instead.

[cslinger]

Waddaya know. Learn something new everyday. I tell you you can use acronyms to make anything sound cool.

[Thumper]

Just using it as an abbreviation for the HammerLess Pistol prototype of around '94.

Did Mec-Gar really make THAT MANY mags for that gun before 1994?

[Thumper]

Ooops...started the above post then got a phone call...little late with the info.

Again, does anyone else find it a little shady that someone says they made thousands of mags for a prototype pistol?

Not that I'm upset...if we can get away with it, great. I'm just wondering why the discrepancy isn't noted more often.

[denfoote]

My opinion is that around that time, all the magazine makers saw the writing on the wall and kept production lines going for everything they made right up to the deadline!!! No facts to support this, just my uneducated humble opinion based on what I would do in the same situation!!! :D

[GLOCKT]

Up to the 94 dead line many of the arms makers retooled and made mags just for that single purpouse.
Glock for some unknown reason stayed with the pistol side and thats why Glock high cap mags are few and far between and very over priced.Generally $85-$100 for a 15 rounder.

[JimC]

Try $130-$135 for new pre-ban FS P88 mags! :eek:

I have three 15 round mags for my P88, one still in the Interarms packaging that I haven't opened. I don't need any more at those prices.

I paid $90 + each for two P88 Compact 14 round mags just to make the pistol original. Haven't found any since.

Again, does anyone else find it a little shady that someone says they made thousands of mags for a prototype pistol?

ABSOLUTELY but as long as it flies with BATF, keep on buying as long as they last. ;)