AMTRAK...Any Concealed Carry on trains?


PDA

geegee
February 10, 2003, 12:29 AM
The wife has suggested a family trip on a train, within the state of Texas. I'm all in favor of it, having had some pretty good train trips when I was younger, and also because I don't how much longer the opportunity will be available for my own kids to ride one.

But what about carrying concealed on a train? Any of you ever done so, and specifically any Texas CHL'ers? Thanks, geegee

If you enjoyed reading about "AMTRAK...Any Concealed Carry on trains?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
10-Ring
February 10, 2003, 12:38 AM
I haven't been on AMTRAK in 10 years. Back then, it probably wouldn't hav been an issue. Since Sept 11th, I'd hope they screen their passengers for any possible weapons.

jmbg29
February 10, 2003, 12:40 AM
Since Sept 11th, I'd hope they screen their passengers for any possible weapons.Like shoelaces?:rolleyes:

geegee
February 10, 2003, 12:53 AM
Since Sept 11th, I'd hope they screen their passengers for any possible weapons
Oh, no doubt. I already feel safer when I get on an airplane, knowing that I can never carry a pocket knife again (after doing so for years, without ever thinking of trying to kill everyone on board). Maybe AMTRAK can borrow some of the TSA dim bulbs that now populate every airport to beef up security in our train stations....
or...maybe those people who have proven themselves to be law abiding, and responsible with firearms should just be allowed to travel wherever they want to (even on a train), having proven that they tend to be less of a security risk than most anti gun folks are lead to believe. :banghead: geegee

sm
February 10, 2003, 12:57 AM
http://www.amtrak.com/index.html

I did a quick search...no definitive answer. IIRC someone had a link somewhere that said NO. I can't recall if just part of the post 9/11 or not.

I traveled by train to Houston a bunch as a kid...before Amtrack. Neat memories. Be a neat experience for the kids...

These days I drive...hence the mulitlple CCW licenses.

WhoKnowsWho
February 10, 2003, 01:06 AM
jmbg29: Do you have no idea how many defenseless, unarmed people could be choked with a thin shoelace while they slept. The gall of you suggesting otherwise! :D

El Rojo
February 10, 2003, 01:07 AM
I wouldn't want to ride the train without my Glock. I would rather drive.

voilsb
February 10, 2003, 01:11 AM
I've been on amtrak a couple of times since sept 11, and have never been searched.

they probably have a policy against it, but if you just don't tell them about it then they won't know, because it's concealed, right?

Seawolf
February 10, 2003, 01:14 AM
I'd treat AMTRAK the way I'd treat a post office - federal property.

Diesle
February 10, 2003, 01:18 AM
I got $10 that says a simple call to Amtrak will get you the definative answer to your question....

How about you let us know after you call them.... If you call them....


Diesle

Kahr carrier
February 10, 2003, 03:15 AM
That would be the best answer call Amtrak and ask.:)

anchored
February 10, 2003, 01:56 PM
Several years ago, I rode Amtrak cross-country. Before I got my tix, I asked the travel agent to find out what the requirements were for taking my gun with me - whether it had to be cased and declared, etc. She called Amtrak, and told me they said "If you take your pistol, make sure you keep it with you." Apparently, stolen luggage was a bigger problem. I got an uncle mikes shoulder holster, and that was that. I don't know if it was right or not, but it worked for me.On their website, nothing in their policies or terms of transportation mention guns, but they may refuse to transport you if they think you're dangerous.

The funny part was, when I went to get the tickets, the agent was in the back of the office helping another person, so she just yelled the instructions across the office to me. Got some odd looks from everyone else there.

Pilgrim
February 10, 2003, 02:15 PM
The last time I rode on AMTRAK - last May to be exact - I read the small print on the ticket envelope. It said firearms are prohibited. However, since no laws were cited, I expect it is AMTRAK policy and if they discover you are armed they will make you get off the train.

I suppose they will station an unarmed guard to watch you to make sure you don't shoot up the train until the next scheduled stop. :p

Bruce

Ian
February 10, 2003, 02:33 PM
I've riden AmTrak cross-country several times in the last few years (IMO, it's the best way to go between home and school, as I don't own a car). Their policy is no guns on trains, but I've never been searched in any way. I'd suggest a recon trip to the station before you buy tickets - if they happen to be searching people, just board at the closest small (aka unmanned) station.

mjustice
February 10, 2003, 02:43 PM
I think it's their policy, and there is no corresponding federal law. I commute in and out of Penn Station in NYC. Based on what I see, I would imagine this is how most of the "screw the TSA" crowd travels these days :)

MJ

bogie
February 10, 2003, 02:53 PM
Well, IMHO, Amtrak is not a transportation entity - it's an amusement park for train buffs...

I'd treat it the same as Six Flags.

gun-fucious
February 10, 2003, 04:16 PM
i rode the Acela to NYC last spring from Wash DC
i carried a video camera, a digital camera, and a laptop in a backpack right on board

no searches
no metal detector

one dood had a acostic guitar hardcase

Blackhawk
February 10, 2003, 05:17 PM
Sorry to say, I don't know.

Don't know about buses operated by interstate bus companies either.

The problem is that when you plan a trip using a certain mode of public transportation, you might find yourself having to switch modes to one where carrying is prohibited.

Hope we'll end up on this thread or another one with some clues about where to get reliable and authoritative answers.

I'd hate to end up being a felon due to ignorance.... :what:

Country Boy
February 10, 2003, 05:21 PM
I haven't traveled Amtrak post-9/11, but I seriously doubt that they would have screenings at every little station along the way. I had a similar post at TFL (http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=29498) in Oct 2000, and EOD Guy stated the following.
It is a felony to carry a firearm on an Amtrac train. The same section of the law applies on trains that applies on commercial aircraft (27CFR178.31). Firearms may be transported, but they must be declared and be in checked baggage. Even if you don't cross a state line, Amtrac is an interstate carrier. Compliance is up to your acceptance of the risks.

Another TFL Amtrak thread. (http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=8011)

Some threads from Packing.com which I would suggest reading. Hope this helps.
http://www.packing.org/news/article.jsp/4610/
http://www.packing.org/news/article.jsp/4683/
http://www.packing.org/news/article.jsp/4777/
http://www.packing.org/news/article.jsp/4060/

geegee
February 10, 2003, 05:36 PM
Thanks for the responses. I tried calling the local AMTRAK number and after 20-25 rings with no answer, I figured it was being run like most government enterprises and hung up.

It looks like I'll plan on a car trip. geegee

Ian
February 10, 2003, 05:44 PM
Their main number is 1-800-USA-RAIL, though I'm not sure if you can get a human being through it.

KMKeller
February 10, 2003, 05:47 PM
This is getting interesting. Their current website says nothing whatsoever about firearms or weapons or guns. A search of the website returns 0 hits. This is almost conspicuous by it's absence considering the earlier website had numerous references.

Blackhawk
February 10, 2003, 10:35 PM
Thanks for the links, Country Boy. :)

Still not inclined to ride the train or bus....

Country Boy
February 11, 2003, 09:02 AM
I had a friend that carried regularily while riding Amtrak. He never once had a problem. Was he legal? Questionable. Did he feel better by having the option of using what he carried? Definitely.

Ol' Badger
February 11, 2003, 09:24 AM
I've carried while on a trip to S.C. in my poke bag. I was never searched. At Union Station they had a little boy (9) raped in the bathroom there. I am willing to bet that thats next. Yo'll see TSA dumb bunny's there too. Protecting us from Highjacked trains! I amost think its their plan! Make it so un-fun to travel that people just stay home. Just eat,sleep, go to work and repeat. Baah. Baah!

geegee
February 11, 2003, 10:29 AM
KMKeller: Their current website says nothing whatsoever about firearms or weapons or guns. A search of the website returns 0 hits. This is almost conspicuous by it's absence considering the earlier website had numerous references.
The exact same thing that struck me. If it's not allowed, why not include it with all the other "forbidden items"?
geegee

KMKeller
February 11, 2003, 10:30 AM
Geegee

Kinda makes one wonder doesn't it?

another okie
February 11, 2003, 08:42 PM
Bureaucrats can put all kinds of stuff in the CFR. That doesn't make it the law. You can't make something a felony by regulation. It takes a law. Now I suppose Congress could say "felony to carry dangerous item" and leave the definition up to the CFR, but I think you could fight that for vagueness.

Uncle Ethan
February 12, 2003, 12:29 AM
My family and I just took Amtrak from Oceanside, Ca to Portland, Ore over Christmas- the train was FULL both ways- we got stuck in steerage with the Irish immigrants dancing on the tables as all the family compartments were full. We didn't hit an iceberg, but lots of snow. They didn't search any luggage and I could have had my 1911 right with me. I was worried about it so I only carried a cheap folding knife in case that was confiscated too. No searches, and the nicest, most professional crew imaginable. There were some rowdy College kids getting drunk with some questionable people in the observation car, and even that wasn't questioned. We all carried our own luggage, so I could have had my M1A and no-one would have been any wiser.

Yohan
February 12, 2003, 12:33 AM
I wouldn't want to ride the train without my Glock. I would rather drive.
I hope you've got that gun concealed and keep it concealed- for a long long time. :D :evil: :evil: :neener:

Leatherneck
February 12, 2003, 01:50 PM
another okieBureaucrats can put all kinds of stuff in the CFR. That doesn't make it the law.
If I'm not mistaken, the Code of Federal Regulations does have the force of law on Federal property. (I don't agree that AMTRAK is Federal property, though.) The same CFR you'd get busted for if you brought a firearm onto a military base or the Pentagon. CFR violations do get tried in Federal Court, but I don't think every violation equates to an mautomatic felony just because it's a Federal rap.Blackhawk? Anybody?

TC
TFL Survivor

EOD Guy
February 12, 2003, 11:04 PM
The Code of Federal Regulations is the law. When Congress passes a law and it is signed by the President, the Executive Branch publishes proposed rules and asks for public comment. After a period of time, a final rule is published in the Federal Register with an effective date of the rule. Congress has authorized the appropriate Secretary to promulgate regulations codifying the law. The Code of Federal Regulations is nothing more than a special edition of the Federal Register that brings all the parts together. In most cases, if you compare the US Code with the Code of Federal Regulations, they will be identical, word for word.

An enforcement agency may cite you for a violation of the Code of Federal Regulations and the US Attorney will cite the portion of the US Code that authorizes the regulation when he files charges.

Arguing that the CFR is not law might get you a cell mate that says the income tax is unconstitutional.

Mike Irwin
February 12, 2003, 11:33 PM
"Well, IMHO, Amtrak is not a transportation entity - it's an amusement park for train buffs..."

And not a very good one, at that.

More like riding a marginally cleaner cattle car with broken seats and cattle wearing bad suits.

I used to take Amcrash to Philly from Harrisburg fairly frequently. Normally had a loaded .38 on my ankle.

If you enjoyed reading about "AMTRAK...Any Concealed Carry on trains?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!