[m14nut]

Ok, so let's just say you are like me, a frustrated woodworker, who sometimes looks at the stock of a surplus rifle and just doesn't see old varnished wood, but sees age old BEAUTIFUL walnut sitting under the ancient finish just waiting to get out. [wow, that was a mouthful:rolleyes: ]
Now being somewhat able, you have enough confidance in yourself to know that with a bit of elbow grease and sandpaper, and sparing cartouches, you can refinish the wood to look as if it just rolled out of the armory.
Do you do it, because you want a looker of a rifle that you can enjoy and take pride in, or......
Do you leave the existing finish, and lament that if in fact you do refinish the wwod you just destroyed the collectable value of said rifle????

Such was my quandry with my Spanish FR-8. The parkerizing on the rifle was excellent, a handsome grey, the metal clean, free of rust. Bolt, tight and crisp, as was the trigger, but....
there sat this muddy colored finish on a piece of what I will judge as one of the finest examples of European Walnut I've ever seen. It has gorgeous heartwood striping just by where the receiver mounts, and clean long grain on the rest of the stock and handguard.

So what do you do???

I'm leaning towards a "recovery" of a great piece of walnut.....but will it Bubba the gun???

your thoughts please

[W Turner]

As long as you refinish the wood in a "correct" finish, I don't see a problem with refinishing the stock. Think of it as a revitalization...


Mino

[MuzzleBlast]

Since an FR8 doesn't carry much historical value, I'd go ahead and refinish it.

[Baba Louie]

Sandpaper? Go lightly there

Clean it out/off... fer sure. BLO or tung, OK.

I say go for it.

Check out the link at Parallax Bill's milsurp board...

http://p077.ezboard.com/fparallaxscurioandrelicfirearmsforumsfrm34

might give ya some other thoughts worth ponderin'

[dakotasin]

your rifle. it should make you happy. refinish it if that'll make you happy.

[Zeke Menuar]

My 91/30 has a beautiful coat of red shellac. Really good finish. I left it alone. My Hungarian M44 has excellent metal. The stock was literally dripping primordial gun ooze. Worst case of Cosmo poisoning I have ever seen. That gun got refinished.

I like my guns to be good looking. If the original stock looks like crap. I'll refinish it to hopefully look like the original.

I make my decision one gun at a time. I have no hard and fast rule.

ZM

[Blackcloud6]

Many of us milsurp collectors refinish the wood. Just be carful not to sand off any markings or Cartouches. It might be neat to find out how the particular army that had rifle cared for the wood and do it that way as if you were performing an arsenal refurbishment.

[shoobe01]

Steam, scrape, etc. Sanding is a last resort. Steaming and scraping will smooth it faster, with less material removed.

I would also, however, like a solid answer on this. I hear all kinds of detailed guidelines for refinishing metal and how it destroys or does not destroy value. But it never talks about wood (unless its replacing pistol stocks, which seem not to count).

[MiniZ]

Unless you have a truely collectable, go for it.

[444]

First of all the madatory disclaimer before someone gets all emotional about this (as usually happens).
This is your rifle. You are free to do with it as you please. My opinion doesn't matter, the only opinion that matters is yours. If it makes you happy to refinish it, then by all means make yourself happy.
But, you asked for my opinion. And my opinion is that I wouldn't "refinish" the stock. I would clean the stock. I would rub numerous coats of BLO into the stock. But I wouldn't sand anything and I wouldn't use any kind of finish that wasn't authentic.
I buy old military surplus rifles for one reason: because they are old military rifles. I realize that some people see them as a source of a cheap centerfire rifle. That doesn't mean a thing to me as I have numerous other modern centerfire rifles. The charm is because they are what they are and for some reason that pulls my chain. I want to leave the in issued condition and enjoy them for what they are. And I really enjoy them. I own about 15 WWII era battle rifles. I shoot them all, handload for them, compete with them, etc. If I want to shoot a rifle with a nicely finished stock complete with checkering and a recoil pad, scope, real nice trigger etc. I will take out one of my Winchesters, Remingtons, Rugers, Tikkas or whatever.
One other point I like to bring up much to the dismay of others. These rifles are readily available and cheap right now. However, history tells us that this situation won't last. At one time you could buy M1 Carbines a dime a dozen. I have been told that hardware stores had barrels of them-your pick. Now, a nice one brings well over $500. At one time 03 Springfield rifles were readily available cheap. Not anymore. I recently stole one for $400. I am sure that after the civil war, those weapons were common as hens teeth, but you don't see many around now do you ? Point being, just because they are cheap now, readily available now, and there is no significant colllector interest in them now doesn't mean that 30 years from now there wont' be. Of course bubbaizing them is what makes the remaining originals valuable.

[Valkman]

I just ran into this when I bought my first 91/30. I would have preferred to just clean it, but when I hit it with Purple Power the finish just came off. There's nothing wrong with refinishing, but only if you have to and if you try to recreate the original finish. There's a wealth of info about this subject HERE (http://p077.ezboard.com/fparallaxscurioandrelicfirearmsforumsfrm34) - learn about cleaners, dyes, stains, spit coating and more! :)

[444]

That's a good point. Show off your skills by making the stock look clean, but authentic.
I have seen some of these home improvement shows on TV where they showed you how to take a piece of furniture and make it LOOK like an antique. Here we have an antique and are trying to make it look modern.

I guess I could use an analogy:
I love beautiful women. And I love it when beautiful women get dressed up. They look great in nice jewelry. I love long painted finger nails. I love high spiked heels. But, I don't want my girlfriend showing up to go deer hunting dressed like that. It doesn't fit the occasion. If she did show up looking like that she would still look good, but it is the wrong thing to wear. On the other hand, I still think she looks good when she dresses down in clothes appropriate for more rugged activities. She doesn't have to be dressed up all the time for me to think she looks good. She also doesn't need to have "improvements" made all the time with cosmetic surgery.
To me, a rifle can be beautiful with a dull finish that is practical but not flashy and I have no desire to make it into bling bling.

[cracked butt]

Do it, do it, do it!

You want to sand all of the dents and crazy marking out- I reccomend some sort of electric orbital sander for the job, use wood putty and stain if you need to. Finish it off with about 5 or 6 coats of polyurethane. If enough people do this, maybe someday my turks and MNs will be worth more than $45 a piece.:evil:

[m14nut]

Show off your skills by making the stock look clean, but authentic

That's exactly what I plan on doing. Yesterday I stripped the old "gunk" as someone put it with Acetone, down to bare wood. I then gently sanded only around a chip to smooth it and remove a burr. I then steamed only the largest dents, leaving most or the "history" of the rifle on it.

She'll get numerous coats of flat tung oil, rather than BLO, only because the tung dries, where the BLO will always be a tad oily until years after.

I'll post pics when I'm done.

[birdv]

It depends on the finish. But surplus guns take some work to make the finish nice.

Fine sandpaper.
And I always go with a lighter finish.

[Dionysusigma]

Not really a milsurp gun :o but I refinished the AWFUL looking wood on my SAR-1 with linseed oil. It actually looks nice now. :)

[RustyHammer]

Unless you have a truely collectable, go for it.

Ditto -- as long as you don't "Bubba" it!

[Valkman]

But surplus guns take some work to make the finish nice.

Very, very true. One thing I read was unless you skip the crap products like Minwax, Formby's and most of the other stuff available at Home Depot your stock won't turn out very well. You need to get good products like Behlen or Behr Tung Oil, and Behlen stains and dyes and experiment. Of course I didn't heed this advice and my stock looks like crap. Now I've ordered the good stuff and will experiment to get the right look. These dyes are so good that you can put them over Tung Oil, then put TO over the dye if you need to.

If your milsurp winds up looking like your 2 year old hinting rifle, that's NOT the right look! :D

[Destructo6]

Steel wool will probably do less damage than sandpaper. I recently refinished the stocks on my Yugo M48, Yugo M59/66, and Polish M44. Just a few quick passes with medium, then fine steel wool to smooth out the worst of irregularities, then some gel stain, and some spray-on satin spar varnish. The stocks look much nicer and they don't sweat grease when exposed to the sun.

My $99 Enfield No4 Mk2 was done in a similar manner and I had a guy at a C&R shop insist it was a fine military oil finish. Well, until I told him the whole story.

[Jspy]

Valkman
What exactly are the dyes you are referring to? I remember reading about the Behr Tung Oil available at Home Depot, but I couldn't find any at the stores I went to. I am assuming of course that the stains are your everyday run of the mill, wood stains. But I can't ever recall seeing any dyes. I'm a painter by trade, and am always interested in different products avialable.

[m14nut]

Well she's finished....
Stripped and cleaned of all that nasty thick varnish, wood smoothed lightly, then 10 coats of a low gloss tung oil [Formby's]
Tell me what you think!!!!
FR-8 (http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?p=999&gid=4421587&uid=682422&members=1)

[macavada]

Well, I don't know anything about milsurp rifles and collector value. I don't own any myself. However, I think what you did looks tastefully done. I think it looks nice, and you cleaned it up without taking all the "character" out of it. Looks sharp to me.

[Destructo6]

Looks good to me.

[Okiecruffler]

AFWIW, I've refinished probably half of my peices, hardly ever use sanding, just steel wool. I've refinished with everything, including the dreaded Minwax, and have had reasonablely good success. Except with BLO, the smell absolutely nauseates me, hard to keep it even when you're retching.

[cool45auto]

I try to leave them as original as possible unless someone else has messed with them. In that case, I redo them.

[greyhound]

Looks great!

Learned a little something about 0000 steel wool this weekend. My 91/30 has some rough looking spots on the bolt top and handle where it looked like much contact with human hands had left some brown spots, but that steel wool polished it right up!

[ReadyontheRight]

It's your rifle, but I personally like a little personality and it's difficult to avoid messing up the cartouches.

[BamBam-31]

IIRC, steel wool leaves behind some of itself in the wood you're buffing. These little filaments can rust later on. I think it's better to use some sort of synthetic brillo-pad type of material to lightly sand out rough spots.

Looks darn purty, BTW. Nice job. ;)

[Joey2]

I have refinished all of the stocks on my M-1 Garands (5 of them). I could care less about the collector value nor the cartouche whatever.

My guns are all shooters, no safe queens waiting for the value to go up.

One of my Garands was made in 1942 with all original parts. The first thing I did when I got it was to put new rear sights on, new barrel, new stock and op rod.

Shoots great now. I use it for CMP matches.

All of my other guns I also refinish the furniture. I do not like it to shine like a mirror or have a very slick finish. I like to grab them without my hand slipping.

I have all wood satin finish using linseed oil and rubbing it in with my hand until I get the desired finish. Time comsuming yes, but very durable.

Oh, I also have a WWI M-1911 in original condition that I put a new barrel in, Pachmer grips and refinished it with GunKote.

The lack of a grip safety gives it away as not being a M-1911A1 etc.

So I say yes go ahead and refinish the stock, but please go carefully, because what you take off you can't put back on.

Work your way up on the sandpaper grit and you should be alright and stop when you like the feel.

[six 4 sure]

M14nut, when you were refinishing/cleaning you FR8 stock were you able to remove the sling latch/hoop/thingy mounted on the side of the butt? I just purchased a FR8 this past weekend and I’m in the process of refinishing/cleaning the stock. I’ve been able to remove all the hardware but that. I was lucky to find one with beautiful wood but a crappy finish. Now the hard part, having the patience to apply several coats of tung oil. Thanks.

OOPs forgot to add, for those that have one of these I’d like to make mine a little more pleasant to shoot. Is there a good slip on butt pad that will fit? I don’t want anything permanent because I want to keep it original.

six

[Beetle Bailey]

Looks great to me! :D

[m14nut]

The side mounted sling loop I was not able to remove:banghead: I had to work around it. When I removed the buttplate, it appeared that it is held in [on] with long nails that went down into the stock:cuss:

:neener: Yes, it does have sort of a stout recoil don't it:neener:

PAST makes a slip-over recoil pad made of neoprene, and there is another company that makes a leather one that slips over and fastens with velcro.