[The Scandinavian]

Hi

Has anyone tried making wax bullets, or 9mm or .40 shotshell, or some other low-powered, improvised, novelty* , fun ammo?

T.S.
* I mean specialty :)

[Vern Humphrey]

Yes -- Wax bullets used to be a fad. Nowadays, you can buy speer rubber or plastic bullets and cases for shooting indoors -- use a box stuffed with newspaper as a backstop.

For shotshells, you can get shot capsules in various handgun calibers. I also load a bit of bullseye in a .45 Colt case, a wad, a .44 gascheck, fill the case with shot, and finish off with an inverted .45 gas check.

[Ross]

I've not loaded wax in autoloaders, but for canning wax bullets in revolvers, it is needful to enlarge the vent to prevent the primer backing out and tyeing up the cylinder. You prime after cookie-cutting the wax bullet to avoid the pressure pushing the wax out. Be sure to mark cases that have been modified. Also wax residue in cases contaminates powder if you use the cases normally. Don't ask me how I know.
A wax bullet from a .38 is said to produce a severe bruise at 20', and will kill rats in the barn.
Cheers from Darkest California,
Ross

[The Scandinavian]

Hi

Thanks for your replies!

I'm not sure where I'd get canning wax here; we tend to use jars with glass lids and rubber sealing rings for preserving stuff. It might be possible to find hard candle wax for hobby use but that could be expensive.

I've just found those X-ring bullets though:
http://www.midwayusa.com/rewriteaproduct/713633

but look at the price difference from Midway Finland!!!
http://www.midwaysuomi.com/suomi/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?SaleItemID=713633

They look like rubber feet or end caps for furniture tubing don't they?!

There is an industrial plastics shop nearby, I think I'll visit them today :D

[444]

I am not sure where you find wax there either. Here it is sold in pretty much every grocery store although I don't really know why.
Where ever you get the wax, you can melt it in a container to the depth that corresponds to the length of bullet you want. Then use the mouth of the case to cut the wax bullet as you press the case down through the wax. Cut as many as you want and next time you can just remelt the wax in the pan.
Wax bullets are quite accurate at close ranges. I have never tried to see how far they were accurate, I pretty much only shot them in the house.

[Ross]

T.S.,
You might search specialty kitchen shops. Here we use it still for sealing jams and jellies and sometimes it is used for certain exotic candies.
The 1 pound brick is in four layers which are about right for revolver bullets. The fired "bullets" are remelted for re-use. The cost for paraffin wax is under two dollars.
Cheers from Darkest California,
Ross

[The Scandinavian]

Heh heh I've just remembered something...

When I was a kid, I used to have a toy derringer that fired tiny pieces of potato.
The propellant was a cap-gun cap (the sort that came on a paper roll) and the potato was loaded by pressing the end of the 'cartridge' into a potato in the 'cookie cutter' fashion that you describe for wax bullets.

So, if I can't find the proper wax, perhaps I can use potato insted, and be the first with a .40 caliber Glock spud-gun?

:cool:

[The Scandinavian]

Today I tried some wax bullets - I melted down a few candles and poured the wax out about 1/4" deep in a small tray. I filled about 30 9mm cases "cookie cutter' fashion, put them in the freezer for a bit and then primed them.

Well, they went bang (or rather 'pop') but I have to say that accuracy was abysmal even at ten feet.

It was very disconcerting to maintain a good sight picture right the way through the shot, on the centre of a cardboard box, only to just clip the edge of the box...

The rounds would penetrate at least one side of the box at ranges up to about 20'. Those that hit it that is...

Still it was fun. Now for some more 'research and development'

Regards

T.S.

[444]

I have only fired them out of revolvers. They were always just as accurate as ball ammo as far as I could tell. :confused:

[The Scandinavian]

Hi 444

Did you leave them in the case mouths or did you push them back to the bottom of the case?

I left them in the mouth, but I just read somewhere online that one should push them down to the base of the case?

Perhaps I try some more soon, pushed right in...

Then again perhaps I'll try bullet shaped ones - the "empty case" shape doesn't feed from the magazine (HK USP9F)

Thanks!

T.S.

[444]

I did mine exactly like you did.
Used the case as a cookie cutter, bullet flush with the case mouth.
I have also read that pushing them back against the primer is better but I have never tried it.
By all means, play around with it. See if you can improve things and keep us posted with your results.
I have played with this on and off for years. I never did a huge amount of it, but have loaded a few hundred of them here and there. I shot most of them indoors at ranges of maybe 10'-20'. The vast majority of them were fired from some kind of revolver. I have also fired a few out of a Winchester 94 chambered for .45 Colt. They all seemed to work fine for me.

[Ross]

T.S.,
I think that your bullets are way too short at 6,5 mm. I'd try at least a caliber length or maybe more.
If they are too cold, they may be too brittle.
As an aside, if they are left loaded a long time, the wax will contaminate and kill the primer.
Regards from Darkest California,
Ross

[The Scandinavian]

Ross, 444,

Yeah, I was wondering the same thing about the effect of length.

I'll melt up another batch later (have some real work to do first ;) ) much longer, and I'll seat them back against the primer.

I almost wish I had a revolver. They are a bit fiddly to drop into the barrel one at a time. At least I have found that pressing on the very back of the extractor causes it to ride over the case rim easily, so at least I shouldn't hurt the gun doing this.

Cheers!

T.S.

[The Scandinavian]

Hi

I tried another batch, using deeper wax.

In fact I miscalculated slightly and the 9mm cases ended up completely full. However I carefully cleaned out the surplus wax that had oozed up into the primer pockets, hardened them for a few minutes in the freezer and then primed and tested them.

Whilst they aren't quite in the hardball category as far as accuracy goes, they are MUCH better than the previous batch. Plenty accurate enough to hit a tin can at 25 feet.

I shall pull one 'bullet' and weigh it, and also chonograph one too, and see how it compares to a good air rifle for muzzle energy.

Penetration at 25' is one or sometimes two thicknesses of cardboard.

Thanks for your help in getting this far

T.S.

[BEARMAN]

The rubber bullets that you say look like chair feet actually are more like large air rifle pellets. They are supposed to be more accurate but you have to enlarge the primer hole and they still need to be fed singly into the chamber of an auto. Also the primer will not propel a rubber bullet all the way through a .357 rifle barrel and in a lever action with poor access to the breech end, a hard to clear barrel obstruction. They have worked quite well in revolvers but indoor in the basement the smell from the primer is not pleasant and considering the lead in the primers, probably not to good an idea. GOOD LUCK.

[The Scandinavian]

Perhaps I should investigate these rubber bullets more...

The shop I went to didn't have chair feet in 9mm :D but they can order them.


OK, now the chrony results:

average velocity 459fps
bullet weight 11.5gr


Muzzle energy 5.4 ft lbs.

[Hal]

Rather than pushing the case cookie cutter style into the wax just invert the empty case into the melted wax and let the wax hardden inside the case.

use a double boiler setup and substitute a couple of cookie pans.

Melt the wax to the desired thinkness, then put the empty and unprimed cases mouth first into the melted wax. You can speed up the hardening process by slowly adding water to the hot water.

[The Scandinavian]

That's a great idea HAL, thanks.

By the way, has anyone had trouble with the wax adhering to the walls of the case? I just looked at some of the ones I just fired, and some of them have left half the "bullet" behind.

Thanks


T.S.

[BluesBear]

This thread sure brings back some memories. I haven't shot a wax bullet in over 20 years but I fired a bus-load years ago. I set aside some nickled resized cases just for wax use. I enlarged the flash holes to eliminate primer set-back.

I used Gulfwax paraffin from the canning aisle of the grocery. I softened it up just enough in a warm oven so that it was easy to push the cases in. The secret I found was to lightly grease the inside of the case just like you would a cake pan. I'd put some crisco into an old shot glass and just dip the mouth of the case in it. Then I'd swab the inside of the case with a .38 caliber bore mop to lightly coat the inside of the case.

The bullets were clean enough to melt down and reuse.

[blue86buick]

I assume with the wax bullets you JUST use a primer, and no powder. Would you be able to use any powder at all (1.0gr?), or would that just blow molten wax out of the barrel?

[Vern Humphrey]

No powder -- there's no point to it. The primer does a good enough job, all by itself.

I recommend Speer Plastic Training Bullets and Cases: They come in .38 Special and .44 Mag. The plastic bullets come in .38, .44 and .45 (use brass cases with enlarged flash holes for .45.)

You can get them from Midway (1-800-243-3220) for about $5.00 for a box of reloadable cases, and about $6.00 for the reusable bullets.

No tools are needed for reloading. You seat the primers by putting them on a hard, flat surface and pressing the case heads down on them.