Collaborating with the enemy


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Antlurz
June 4, 2004, 05:34 PM
This will probably get glossed over. No one wants to uphold the laws nowdays..

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewSpecialReports.asp?Page=%5CSpecialReports%5Carchive%5C200406%5CSPE20040604a.html




FBI Files Show Kerry Met With Communists More Than Once
By Marc Morano
CNSNews.com Senior Staff Writer
June 04, 2004

(CNSNews.com) - Newly released FBI files reveal that presumed Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry attended a second meeting with North Vietnamese communists in Paris in the early 1970s. Kerry has previously admitted to meeting only once with the North Vietnamese delegations in 1970.

According to the FBI files, Kerry met with representatives from the North Vietnamese government in Paris in 1971 in an effort to secure the release of captured American prisoners of war. Kerry has previously acknowledged meeting "both delegations" of Vietnamese communists in Paris in 1970, but has said nothing of the 1971 meeting.

Researcher and author Jerry Corsi, who began studying the anti-war movement in the early 1970s, believes Kerry is hiding key aspects about his anti-war past from the public as he seeks the presidency.

"Kerry has admitted to one meeting with Madam Binh. Now we have reason to believe there was a second [meeting], so let's press them to admit the second [meeting]," Corsi told CNSNews.com.

"Kerry needs to explain to the American people why he directly went into negotiations with communists," Corsi added. Corsi has written an essay on Kerry's dealings with the Vietemese communists on the Internet site, WinterSoldier.com.

According to Gerald Nicosia, a Kerry supporter and the author of the book Home to War: A History of the Vietnam Veterans' Movement, Kerry's second visit to Paris to meet with emissaries of the North Vietnamese communist government is documented in redacted FBI files from the era.

"The [FBI] files record that Kerry made a second trip to Paris that summer (1971) to learn how the North Vietnamese might release prisoners," Nicosia wrote in an essay in the Los Angeles Times on May 23.

"After deciding not to run [for Congress] in 1970, he and his new wife, Julia Thorne, traveled to France in May to meet Madame Nguyen Thi Binh and other Viet Cong and Communist Vietnamese representatives to the Paris peace talks, a trip he now calls a 'fact-finding mission,"' Nicosia wrote.

Nicosia noted that, "Kerry had tried to distinguish between his own trips to meet with the Vietnamese in Paris, which he considered necessary to fight through the lies of his own government, and actual negotiations with the enemy, which Kerry knew were illegal."

Kerry told the New York Times on April 24 that his first meeting with the Vietnamese communists in 1970 was "not a big deal."

''People were dropping in (at the Paris Peace Talks). It was a regular sort of deal," Kerry explained to the New York Times .

But Corsi believes it was a very big deal.

"You had (Former Nixon aide) Henry Kissinger there (in Paris) trying to negotiate formally with the Paris peace delegation and then these guys (from Vietnam Veterans Against the War) are off on their own side show, establishing back channels to the Vietnamese communists; all of this is against the law," Corsi said, referring to U.S. code 18 U.S.C. 953, which declares it illegal for a U.S. citizen to go abroad and negotiate with a foreign power.

"Exactly who was Kerry ... to have arranged these trips? He had to be in discussion with some link with the communist party of Vietnam in order to establish these trips and meetings," Corsi explained.

Kerry also may have had plans to go to South Vietnam in 1971, according to a June 16, 1971 article in the communist Daily World newspaper.

"Former Navy Lt. John Kerry is planning a three-week trip to South Vietnam in July to report on 'what is really happening' to the GI's there, he told newsmen here," read the article, written by the Daily World's Ted Pearson. Kerry was attending an event in Chicago with Jesse Jackson, who at the time was head of the organization, Operation Bread Basket.

It is unclear whether Kerry ever made the trip to South Vietnam in 1971 and Kerry's campaign did not return several phone calls seeking comment for this article.

Nicosia has criticized Kerry in the past for not being more open about his anti-war past.

"I am in kind of an awkward position here. I am a Kerry supporter and I certainly don't want to do anything that hurts him. On the other hand, my number one allegiance is to truth. So I am going to go with where the facts are, and John is going to have to deal with that," Nicosia told CNSNews.com back in March when the contents of the FBI files became public and caused Kerry to revise his past statements on a series of issues dealing with his past.

"I am having some problems with the things he is saying right now, which are not matching up with accuracy," Nicosia said in March.

"I think [Kerry] may be worried or the people around him may be worried that his association with VVAW (Vietnam Veterans Against the War) is a very negative thing and they want John to back away from it," he added.

Kerry's anti-war activism and his meetings with the communists had a big impact, according to Corsi.

"Vietnamese communists would not have won the war without John Kerry. They were cultivating his protest activity with the VVAW," Corsi said.

Corsi said the Vietnamese communists have shown their gratitude to Kerry by displaying a photo of him at Ho Chi Minh City's Protestors Hall of the War Remnants Museum. The photo of fellow anti-war activist and actress Jane Fonda also appears in the Women's Museum in Saigon.

"As soon as [Kerry] came onto the seen, [the Vietnamese communists] latched on to him like bees on to honey. [The communists] said 'This is a guy who tells our story, it will undermine the sympathy for the war in America,'" Corsi added.

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Malone LaVeigh
June 5, 2004, 02:43 AM
BFD. the great thing about our country is we have the right to talk to whoever we want.

BTW, it's also been documented that Nixon's representatives interfered with the Paris peace talks to keep Humphrey from winning the '68 election.

Cool Hand Luke 22:36
June 5, 2004, 03:52 AM
Malone LaVeigh:

BFD. the great thing about our country is we have the right to talk to whoever we want.

No, under certain circumstances it's treason.

BTW, it's also been documented that Nixon's representatives interfered with the Paris peace talks to keep Humphrey from winning the '68 election.

Where is this documented? (Noam Chomsky's Blog doesn't count.)

c_yeager
June 5, 2004, 04:08 AM
No, under certain circumstances it's treason.

Under what circumstances would TAKING to someone be considered treason?

Delmar
June 5, 2004, 05:26 AM
Under what circumstances would TAKING to someone be considered treason?

See above, if true. They will NEVER charge Kerry with it, even if they could prove the allegations beyond a doubt.

Yer not supposed to be negotiating with the enemy while the government is doing the same, if it can be proven that you were aiding and abetting.

Hard to prove treason-two reliable witnesses and all, and a long time ago.

Tom Bri
June 5, 2004, 07:28 AM
No declared war. What was the treason? I agree it smells like treason, but legally it probably wasn't.

Stand_Watie
June 5, 2004, 07:50 AM
http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/953.html

Here is the chapter and section cited by the article. I'll leave it to the board's attorneys to debate whether he violated it.


TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 45 > Sec. 953. Prev | Next
Sec. 953. - Private correspondence with foreign governments



Any citizen of the United States, wherever he may be, who, without authority of the United States, directly or indirectly commences or carries on any correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government or any officer or agent thereof, with intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government or of any officer or agent thereof, in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or to defeat the measures of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.


This section shall not abridge the right of a citizen to apply, himself or his agent, to any foreign government or the agents thereof for redress of any injury which he may have sustained from such government or any of its agents or subjects

c_yeager
June 5, 2004, 08:05 AM
"The [FBI] files record that Kerry made a second trip to Paris that summer (1971) to learn how the North Vietnamese might release prisoners," Nicosia wrote in an essay in the Los Angeles Times on May 23.

Yeah, cause getting our POWs released from custody in North Vietnam is a really underhanded thing to do.

Trying to get people out of Vietnam is probably the ONE good thing that Kerry has done.

pick your battles.

Jeff Timm
June 5, 2004, 10:13 AM
C. yeager opined: "Yeah, cause getting our POWs released from custody in North Vietnam is a really underhanded thing to do.

Trying to get people out of Vietnam is probably the ONE good thing that Kerry has done."

Or, by emphasizing the POW issue, caused the NVA to hold on to our POWs even longer as a bargaining chip.

Or, by encouraging the enemy to believe there was a major pro-communist movement in the United States, continued the war for years.

Geoff
Who will NEVER forget the betrayal of the South Vietnamese by the Democrat Party. The first major invasion of SVN by the communists, was defeated with weapons from the "Arsenal of Democracy." The second was successful because, despite "international agreements" the Democrats stopped all support. This ruined the reputation of the United States for thirty years.

Antlurz
June 5, 2004, 12:38 PM
c_yeager wrote:Trying to get people out of Vietnam is probably the ONE good thing that Kerry has done.

If THAT was THE example of a GOOD thing that he's done, I'd hate to see a list of the bad stuff.....:barf:

To go to a foreign country and "negotiate" on a private citizens level takes 'nads the size of vollkswagens, or a lot of experience in running a peanut plantation... Whether it is perceived as good, bad or indifferent, it was still ILLEGAL!!!

Ron

Hawkmoon
June 5, 2004, 12:58 PM
BTW, it's also been documented that Nixon's representatives interfered with the Paris peace talks to keep Humphrey from winning the '68 election.
I don't know that it's documented, but I also remember a lot of "buzz" during Carter's presidency and just after, to the effect that Reagon's goons sabotaged Carter's efforts to settle the Iran hostage situation as a way of making Reagon's election campaign easier.

porciniman
June 5, 2004, 01:03 PM
I also seem to remember Jane Fonda visiting "the enemy", as did Sean Penn.
I agree with c_yeager:
"Under what circumstances would TAKING to someone be considered treason?"
VB

Antlurz
June 5, 2004, 04:53 PM
porciniman wrote:"Under what circumstances would TAKING to someone be considered treason?"

As noted above:
TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 45 > Sec. 953. Prev | Next
Sec. 953. - Private correspondence with foreign governments



Any citizen of the United States, wherever he may be, who, without authority of the United States, directly or indirectly commences or carries on any correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government or any officer or agent thereof, with intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government or of any officer or agent thereof, in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or to defeat the measures of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

Doesn't seem to hard to understand to me, at least...:scrutiny:

Ron

c_yeager
June 6, 2004, 03:06 AM
shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

Doesnt really sound like the penalty for treason now does it?

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