More of them than us? Or are we just lazy


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killermarmot
June 14, 2004, 01:44 AM
Well I don't actually think we (as in the gun owning RKBA crowd) are lazy but I want to know what you guys think about our number versus their's. After to talking to people about what their stance on guns is it seems the vast vast majority of people don't care. Most think criminals shouldn't have guns then I'm usually asked "why do you have a gun?" depending on the person I gave them the whole song and dance or merely a quick run down of hobbies. They usualy shrug their shoulders say "that's cool, not for me, but hey whatever."or they say something like "yeah my dad had some guns" I have rarely run into a full blown anti when I do boy do I. There don't seem to be moderate antis (possible contradiction in terms) they all seem to be pedal to the floor guns are evil, movies are evil, music is satanic, the children the children the children. I was a kid not too long ago and we had metal play structures and toys that hurt....oh I'm rambling again. So what do you guys think vocal minority or do the antis actually have a decent support base?

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TallPine
June 14, 2004, 02:02 AM
There are more of "us" than "them" in general.

There was a poll a few years back that resulted in something like 75-80% of people believe the 2A guarantees an individual right.

But the "antis" make more noise, and they have lies on their side - which are much more exciting than the truth.

PLUS ... we are not out to take anyone else's rights away: the "there_oughta_be_a_law" crowd always has more to say and louder.

OTOH, look at the CCW movement in the states - that tells you where most of the people are leaning.

BUT ... it doesn't matter what the people want, there are a certain group of politicians and rich yahoos who just want civilian disarmament so their particular elite group can rule the peasants without any hindrance.

7.62FullMetalJacket
June 14, 2004, 02:29 AM
Sheep, wolves, and sheepdogs :D

There are not many sheepdogs. There are, however, alot of sheep. Baaaah.

Sometimes the sheep prefer to call the sheepdogs on 911 and prefer that sheepdogs where blue or brown uniforms.

What the sheep do not understand is that the courts have stated that uniformed sheepdogs are not there to protect individuals.

What they do not understand is that they must become a sheepdog.

sharpie613
June 14, 2004, 02:44 AM
Also, you have to realize, there are lots of groups that will pay you a living to empower criminals. Most of us have to work for our money...

DesertEagle613
June 14, 2004, 02:46 AM
Here's the thing...

We won't win this by playing defense all the time. We're letting them determine the battlefield, always to our detriment. We need to go on the offensive. We should invent a new issue and push it, hard!

Here's a thought: pick an anti-CCW state with a significant rape problem, and advocate a shall-issue statue for rape victims. Nobody's being forced to carry a gun, and (/sob) "HOW COULD YOU keep those poor oppressed victims of the male patriarchy from emancipating themselves!?" (sob/) :D

If we pushed this hard enough, we could really recast the whole tone of the national debate. Incrementalism can work both ways.

fjolnirsson
June 14, 2004, 03:16 AM
As a group, gunnies are afraid to make waves. See the negative responses generated by this thread:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?threadid=85949
And this one:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?threadid=85824

The anti's make more noise. Until gunnies are willing to march in the streets and risk being labeled extremists, we will not take back our rights. The left has proven over and over that activism works.

Check this out:http://www.jpfo.org/alert20010815.htm
I agree.

Art Eatman
June 14, 2004, 09:39 AM
Activist antis never shut up. Their entire mission in life is monomaniacal, to get some part of their world changed to suit them. The organize their lives toward involvement in the legislative process.

Most of us, on the other hand, have real-world lives to lead, and, mostly, we just want to be let alone.

The above applies not just to guns but to such issues as abortion, welfare, smoking, auto-safety, medical care, environment and consumer safety.

Legislative bodies operate on the basis of "The squeaky wheel gets the most grease."

For many who are not activists, it is difficult to find the time away from work or family responsibilities to lobby city hall or a legislature or Congress. It thus readily appears that "our side" has smaller numbers.

Art

Standing Wolf
June 14, 2004, 06:02 PM
There don't seem to be moderate antis (possible contradiction in terms)...

There's nothing moderate about trying to deprive people of their inherent human rights and trying to turn us into serfs. Never has been. Never will be.

joe sixpack
June 14, 2004, 10:10 PM
As someone who recently joined the ranks of handgun owners, I feel
compelled to point out probably the major reason there are as many people with no particular feelings on guns one way or the other, is they
do not understand what FMJ so simply presented in his "sheeps, wolves
and sheepdogs" analogy. That and perhaps the original intention of the 2nd amendment and what that has to do with government control of the
people.

Education of these folks would seem to be fairly easy. However we do face
the fairly large disinformation type campaign of the antis.

Public Relation would go a long ways.

cheers, ab

greyhound
June 15, 2004, 07:46 PM
I post this in terms of the AWB renewal:

Unfortunately, I think a majority of citizens ARE "uncomfortable" with citizens owning "military type" weapons. Just makes 'em nervous; Joe Average has not a problem with hunting rifles or even handguns, but "military type" weapons are "disconcerting".

However, what Feinstein, Kerry, etc fail to realize is that for most folks, this is NOT high up on the list of political things to get worked up about.

So when a poll says that 67% approve renewing the AWB ( and don't get me started on how the "gun neutral" public thinks AWB=machine guns),
what's not noted is that its NOT A PRIORITY with all but a few people.

Ergo, you get 2,000 at the Million :rolleyes: Mom march.

Just my .02

telomerase
June 15, 2004, 10:39 PM
Here's a thought: pick an anti-CCW state with a significant rape problem, and advocate a shall-issue statue for rape victims. Nobody's being forced to carry a gun, and (/sob) "HOW COULD YOU keep those poor oppressed victims of the male patriarchy from emancipating themselves!?" (sob/)

That is a very good idea.

Barbara
June 16, 2004, 05:50 AM
Uh, yeah. Great idea. :rolleyes:

fjolnirsson
June 16, 2004, 06:08 AM
Uh, yeah. Great idea

Care to elaborate?

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