How do you oppose gun laws you never knew about?


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mikemck
June 17, 2004, 09:31 AM
How exactly do you manage to oppose, or support for that matter, gun laws and restrictions that you obviously never knew about in the first place?

There's a lot of ignorance about what's legal, what's not, what you can do and what you can't concerning guns.

How can this be? How can a responsible gun owner not know what the laws are?

How exactly do you oppose or support what you never knew was an issue?

Well, you can't, obviously.

Just one of the many problems with "one issue voters".

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jobu07
June 17, 2004, 10:21 AM
that's where responsible gun owners come into play and organizations like the NRA and such. Education is the key.

Ant Mod
June 17, 2004, 01:57 PM
How can a responsible gun owner not know what the laws are?

Kind of hard to single out just gun owners. Might as well ask why every car woner does not know all the laws regarding operating their vehicle in the state. I am sure you own a car, have you ever tried to learn everything you can about every law regarding your vehicle? From whats legal to put on it, take of it, operate it, etc? If people do not put as much effort into educating themselves about an object they use more often then a firearm, why would you think they would educate themselves about something less?

Reno
June 17, 2004, 02:32 PM
Don't forget that a big part of it is intentional on the part of the law-makers. The laws are so deliberately confusing that just about anyone can be a "criminal."

Mr. Kook
June 17, 2004, 02:38 PM
One problem is that laws are not standardized. I recently learned that the pocket knife I carry on me daily (blade length under three inches, can be opened with a flip of the wrist) is illegal for me to carry in Wichita Kansas, but perfectly okay in most other jurisdictions. Laws concerning the carrying of firearms are equally confusing in my state. For instance open carry is illegal in Wichita, but in certain other areas it is okay. Laws can vary from county to county, city to city. Because laws are not standardized it is very easy for a person to commit a felony and not even know it. It is also completely impractical for a person to learn every law on the books even on a single subject for a single state.

In short, there are so many laws and laws vary from region to region so much that even the most ardently responsible individual would find compliance with all laws virtually impossible.

Gray Peterson
June 17, 2004, 03:01 PM
Because laws are not standardized it is very easy for a person to commit a felony and not even know it. It is also completely impractical for a person to learn every law on the books even on a single subject for a single state.

Felony? In most states, the most they can charge you with is an misdeamenor by local ordinances. Felony's are typically passed by the state.

shermacman
June 17, 2004, 03:01 PM
Mr. Kook:
That is precisely why the gun laws are written the way they are. Each law on its own is ‘sensible’. Combined, they are deliberately ambiguous so that a normal person acting responsibly is guaranteed to commit a felony by the end of the day. This is also why we must fight back against the gun grabbers. They are patient and determined. Every day another stupid law is passed; small, incremental laws that whittle away at our Second Amendment.

mikemck
June 17, 2004, 03:59 PM
Kind of hard to single out just gun owners. Might as well ask why every car woner does not know all the laws regarding operating their vehicle in the state. I am sure you own a car, have you ever tried to learn everything you can about every law regarding your vehicle? From whats legal to put on it, take of it, operate it, etc? If people do not put as much effort into educating themselves about an object they use more often then a firearm, why would you think they would educate themselves about something less?

What better place to "single out" gun owners, than on a gun forum?

As has been pointed out, nobody can be aware of every single law, of course. However, the ignorance, which is a more consise way of typing "lack of knowledge", that I routinely encounter from gun owners, FFL's, and in general 2nd amendment supporters, goes way beyond that.
It's just a given, and there is no need to cite specific examples, because there are numerous instances to be found on this and almost any other gun forum.

If an issue, like guns, is so important that no other issue matter, as would be the case for "one issue voters", which are quite common among gun owners, I would have thought they would at least be more well informed and vigilant. I have not found this be true however.

It should go without saying that I am in no way saying that EVERY SINGLE GUN OWNER is like this, but in my experience the majority certainly are.

Ant Mod
June 17, 2004, 04:07 PM
What better place to "single out" gun owners, than on a gun forum?

I understand that. My point was to asnwer his question why gun owners dont know/learn the laws etc. I was pointing out that most people dont know or understand the laws regarding anything they do. Its not just gun owners.

It seemed like he was asking "How can this be? How can a responsible gun owner not know what the laws are?"

Well how can a responsible vehicle owner not know what the laws are regarding their vehicle?

It easy to see why many gun owners dont understand or know the laws when you look at how people think in regards to other parts of their lives. It carrys over to gun ownership.

I was using an example to make a point that could be understood.

But then again I see what you are saying about the people who profess to be pro 2nd amendment but know nothing about the actual laws. They only know that there is a amendment in the constitution saying they can own a gun when its so much mroe then that.

mikemck
June 17, 2004, 05:30 PM
To follow along with your analagy with the car owner thing, nobody is trying to take their cars, and I really have not encountered anyone that is one issue voting on cars.

If something is important enough to be a one issue voter about, it would seem to follow that is more than important enough to educate yourself about.
It also obviously goes without saying, but anything at all important enough to vote about is worth educating yourself about as well.

Yowza
June 17, 2004, 07:03 PM
One issue voting does not require you to know what all the laws are. You're not voting for or against the law, you're voting for or against a candidate. All you need to know is what the stance of the person you are voting for is. If they are pro-gun, why would you need to know anything about all of the thousands of gun laws in existence to vote for them?

And since the internet is only recently useful in finding laws, ordinances, statutes, etc. I don't exactly see how the vast majority of people would have actually been able to research all the confusing, sometimes conflicting information without dedicating a career's worth of time to do it. We have lawyers for a reason. They're the ones who know about the law and even they have to research constantly.

Rick

mikemck
June 17, 2004, 09:28 PM
One issue voting does not require you to know what all the laws are. You're not voting for or against the law, you're voting for or against a candidate. All you need to know is what the stance of the person you are voting for is. If they are pro-gun, why would you need to know anything about all of the thousands of gun laws in existence to vote for them?

Yeah, basically you just vote some mouthpiece into office, and whatever they do after that the one issue voter has no interest in.
You summed it up quite nicely, although you probably did not intend to.

That's the problem, right there. That's what one issue voters do for this country, and they are proud of it!

And since the internet is only recently useful in finding laws, ordinances, statutes, etc. I don't exactly see how the vast majority of people would have actually been able to research all the confusing, sometimes conflicting information without dedicating a career's worth of time to do it. We have lawyers for a reason. They're the ones who know about the law and even they have to research constantly.

Yes, so basically before the internet, and really even with the internet, there's just nothing to be done, and the whole shebang is just beyond the majority of gun owners. How convenient.

No wonder the 2nd has taken such a beating, and why numerous states have been able to all but ban guns completely.

For some of you, it's just a matter of time till it's your turn to hand over your guns, and there's just nothing you can do about it. How pathetic. You do get exactly what you deserve though, there is that.

Moparmike
June 17, 2004, 09:33 PM
Its really interesting, those laws. I started telling my mom all the things one couldn't do, the laws on the books like the AWB and how it bans cosmetic features, how full-auto weapons have been heavily regulated since 1934 (she choked on that one!), etc etc.

She thought I could go to the gunshow in Nashville and get her something if I saw something she might like. Makes sense to her, you and me...its like going to Walmart in Nashville, right?:confused: :uhoh:

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