My dealer says CZ75 "s are crap !


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bfox
June 26, 2004, 05:41 PM
I know different from reading here and other gunboards .
Could you please give me your opinions .Even if you only write one
word I would appreciate it .
I would like to print comments out and give them to him .

Thanks Bill

P.S. I was interested in the CZ85 combat which he also says is crap .
I value you Ladies and Gentlemans opinions More than dealers .

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41mag
June 26, 2004, 05:44 PM
one word?heck here's two.NEW DEALER!(as in get a):D


edit:Agree with the ignorant guy.Mebee you can get 'em real cheap because they're junk.:D

Plinkerton
June 26, 2004, 05:58 PM
Yup. I agree with 41mag.

One local dealer around here likes them okay, but when I aksed him if he would take a CZ over another gun, he said no. He liked them, but said they were nothing special. A decent deal for the price, and that's all.

The other dealer around here said that every CZ that has come thru their store was great, and he really likes them, he just doesnt know a lot about them.

From what I've heard, they are great. A P-01 is next on my list. :D

Matt Dillon
June 26, 2004, 05:59 PM
After having done a lot of research before buying my .40 cal cz75B, I concluded that the CZ line of weapons were extremely underrated. Now after ~800 flawless rounds through it, I'm more sold than ever. Obviously, your dealer doesn't know what he is talking about, and it is probably not worth your time to re-educate him.

grislyatoms
June 26, 2004, 06:19 PM
I have a CZ75 Compact 9mm. For the money, it's a lot of gun. Reliable, rugged, accurate, and simple.

Two things I don't like:

Mags don't drop free (although I understand that this can be fixed easily)

Trigger pull is a little weird.

I like mine.

cookhj
June 26, 2004, 06:31 PM
i had a CZ-75 BD and i loved it. low recoil, felt good in my hands, pointed well, tough construction, reliable, and accurate. you need a new dealer. that guy is obviously an idiot.

George Hill
June 26, 2004, 06:33 PM
Tell your dealer that we all said he is full of crap.
Tell your dealer that Jeff Cooper disagrees with him.

Etc...

czhen
June 26, 2004, 06:41 PM
May be
He started this week on this bss
He was drunk.
He hate CZ because always wanted an excelent pistol and never had.
There are thousands of experienced dealers to get some good advices.
Check www.czforum.com

CzHen

browneu
June 26, 2004, 06:41 PM
I don't know if I would trust your dealer after that kind of blanket statement. Did he tell you what about them is crap? What is he trying to sell in lieu of the CZ. Personally, I think that the CZ pistols and rifles are very underrated and are a great value for the money.

Barry in IN
June 26, 2004, 06:51 PM
I had a CZ75B in .40.
I shot it quite a bit without trouble. I would've shot it more if it were a diffderent caliber.
It was the most accurate .40 I've had.

jdkelly
June 26, 2004, 06:51 PM
Bfox,

I have two CZ-75Bs and I like them both. They shoot well and they are a good value for the money.


Respectfully,

johnk

HSMITH
June 26, 2004, 07:18 PM
Tell your dealer it is time to change the bong water, he obviously is being handicapped mentally by something if he thinks the CZ-75 is anything but one of the finest handguns on the market.

They are accurate, reliable, rock solid sights, all steel and built like a tank, ergonomically very friendly to just about any hand size, and affordable. There isn't anything not to like.

R.H. Lee
June 26, 2004, 07:41 PM
Ditto what everybody else said. I have one CZ, a 75B. It is accurate and functions flawlessly. I trust it completely.:)

RatFink
June 26, 2004, 07:55 PM
I'll bet the answer is $$$, he just can't make enough on the CZ's since everyone knows how inexpensive they can be (Notice I didn't say cheap) and he can probably only make $30 on the sale of one.

russlate
June 26, 2004, 08:32 PM
I have a pair of CZ83's ( 13+1 380 if you can find the hicaps ) that I plan to buy a 3rd one of. " A pair and a spare " is what I want.

Not because they have shown any problems, but because of something Mas Ayoob said: if you get involved in a righteous shooting, the police will take your gun, and if they let you out on the street you may then have to deal with the shootee's family and friends. With your main gun locked up in the police station for months.

Nevada's CCW is limited to those guns you've demonstrated competence with. It requires a statement from a rangemaster that lists make, model, and caliber qualified with. It does NOT list serial numbers. In addition to getting a 3rd CZ83, I'm looking for spare S&W M36's and M38's - my other listed carry guns.

In Nevada, you can add a gun to your license by simply firing a qualification with another type of gun and adding it to your CCW file in the SO. In my case, it would take a drive to Reno ( a hundred thirty miles away ) to day 2 of a scheduled CCW class. Or I could qualify locally under the local Sheriff's rangemaster - and you can bet if I've been involved in a shooting I'd have to play phone tag with him, and probably end up with him being unavailable no matter however flexible I am.

The CZ83's are a 380 ( 9x17 ) version of the CZ82 in 9x18 Makarov, designed as a Czech replacement for their military. It's a solid well made little gun. And the CZ75 has an almost 30 year history of performing like the Browning Hi-Power. It doesn't get much better. The CZ85's are CZ75's with minor modifications and a different designation. Also solid guns.

I'd trust their reliability over any US pistol turned out in the last 10 years.

Iggy
June 26, 2004, 09:22 PM
:rolleyes:

SouthpawShootr
June 26, 2004, 09:29 PM
Your dealer's either been smoking something or he doesn't have them in stock and he doesn't want to order it. You should be insulted that he thinks you are so gullible as to believe something like that. I'm sure the next few words out of his mouth were extolling the merits of whatever he had on hand.

RWK
June 26, 2004, 09:39 PM
Your dealer is full of it . . . my only CZ -- a 75B -- is nothing less than outstanding in both quality and performance. Further, as TFL, THR, and so forth suggest, my CZ-experience is typical . . . and it extends well beyond the 75B alone.

BlkHawk73
June 26, 2004, 10:25 PM
Hmmm...Those "junk" guns seem to be popular enough with civilian and non-civilians. Any reason behind his reason? Anytime I hear a dealer put down a reputable model that strongly, I've usually found they've not been allowed/accepted as an factory authorized dealer or soemthing along those lines. Also, curious as to what brands he pushes.

albanian
June 26, 2004, 10:47 PM
I had a CZ-40b that had a poor SA trigger and was not very accurate but it never jammed. I sold it to my friend and he loves it. It has still never jammed but it is still inaccurate, my friend can't shoot well enough to mind so he is happy.

They are not crap but they are not the end all and be all of handguns. I would take a CZ over a Ruger or S&W auto but not over a Beretta or a SIG. They are good guns for the money but not the deal of the century. I only paid $299 for my CZ-40b and I think it was a good deal but not a steal.

My CZ-452 .22lr rifle however is a real deal. I paid less than $200 new for my Special and it is by far the best deal on a .22 rifle you can get. I have also had a CZ-52 and a CZ-70, they were O.K. also but nothing special. Maybe some of the CZ-75s are better and that is really what everyone seems to mean when they talk about CZ. I never had a CZ-75 so I can't comment on those. People rave about them but that doesn't mean much, people rave about Maks and I don't think they are all that great either. Poor trigger, poor sights and uncomfortable grip makes for poor shooting for me.

Most underrated pistol on the market? I would vote Beretta 92fs. You can get a nice used one of the same price as a new CZ and you will have a class A pistol.

MICHAEL T
June 26, 2004, 10:53 PM
Find another dealer.

Wildalaska
June 26, 2004, 10:55 PM
They are accurate, reliable, rock solid sights, all steel and built like a tank, ergonomically very friendly to just about any hand size, and affordable. There isn't anything not to like.

OK lets not get carried away,,,,

Acurrate, relaible, rock sold , all stell and built like a tansk,,

Ergonomically very UNFRIENDLY to small hands...

And awfully heavy....

If they were as expensive as SIGs nobody would get one...they are a super value...

I personally cant use one as a "carry" gun, grip frame too big for my hands...that being said, I would use one as a truck handgun....

On the other hand to call em crap is stupid.

WildnotthebeallandendallbutstillniceAlaska

Gunsnrovers
June 26, 2004, 11:08 PM
Your dealer is either an idiot or thinks you are to make a blanket statement like that.

Marcus
June 26, 2004, 11:25 PM
Gun dealers generally know about as much about guns as car dealers know about cars. Which is to say just barely enough to do their job. There are exceptions of course here and there and they are to be treasured. :) The CZ-75 is the *original* "wonder nine" and is the one all others are compared to world wide. Many are found wanting. The Beretta 92 is based on the CZ-75 pattern ,except for the original odd magazine release location which took Beretta a good many years to fix (putting it where the CZ had it all along). To this day they can`t approach the CZ-75 or 75B for durability especially with hot euro spec ammo. The US is probably the ONLY country in the world where the CZ-75 isn`t considered a top 5 choice on every professional`s list of best service guns. A little ignorance goes a long way. Are they the absolute best thing out there? Maybe not, but NO other service auto will serve you *any better* either,for ANY price. Since the 85 Combat is the premium version of the 75 I can`t see how you can go wrong. Marcus

Black Snowman
June 26, 2004, 11:36 PM
After buying pistols from Glock, Taurus, HK, Magnum Research, Browning, Colt, and FINALLY CZ, the only brand I want more of is the CZ. I have a CZ 75B in 9mm and you can add just about every other CZ 75 series pistol and the CZ 97B to my wish list.

Kamicosmos' CZ 97B is simply the most ergonomic, easiest, and most accurate 45 ACP pistol I have ever seen or shot. I can shoot it almost as well as my dot scoped Browning Buckmark 5.5 Nickel Target after only putting about 50 rounds through it. I can't believe how good of a gun it is.

I also bought a CZ rifle. A CZ 550 Varmit Laminated. The only bad thing I can say about the CZs I've owned, handled and fired is that the triggers start out a bit scratchy. However once thier broken in, or I spend a half hour with them and small stone, they're some of the best factory triggers I've tried.

This it the single biggest thing holding back their sales. If they just spent another 2 minutes finishing the contact surfaces of the trigger at the factory I can't see how anyone could turn one down.

Walt Sherrill
June 27, 2004, 12:26 AM
New dealer. (One who has good sense.)

HSMITH
June 27, 2004, 12:50 AM
WildAlaska, I meet few men that have smaller hands than I do, and with a proper grip none have had a problem with the CZ-75. FWIW, I am 5'8" with wide hands and short fingers, my hands overall are small for men and about average for most women and quite small overall.

I have been up against the 'small hand' deal for my entire life, the CZ-75 is one of the few guns that does NOT penalize me for my hand size.

Maybe you need to try some new grips?

Gunsnrovers
June 27, 2004, 01:12 AM
I will 2nd better grips on the CZ helping.

I've got small paws and the CZ felt large UNTIL I got my grips from Hakan in the mail. Wow. Big difference.

dairycreek
June 27, 2004, 01:39 AM
My dealer is a retired military shooting instructor. My dealer is also a LEO who shoots competition and wins. My dealer says that CZ's are among the best made firearms in the world. My dealer is smarter than your dealer. Nah. nah, nah, nah, nah! Good shooting;)

Wildalaska
June 27, 2004, 02:02 AM
HS Ive owned probably 6 of em at various tiomes...cuz I like the way they look, I like the Peterson rails, I like the DA/SA trigger when worked, they are sturdy...

They dont fit my hand (its a complaint I hear quite a bit),,,

Its not the grip width (altho I have screwed with differentygrips ) its the legnth of pull in DA mode...interstingly enough Tanfgolio clones dont bother me...either the trigger is set further back in the frame or curved different, or the top of the frame is a little narrower...dunno,,,,

Always said that if they made a "short trigger" for the CZs I would get one again (hell I will get one anyway again sooner or later...)

Anyway not bad guns (though a bit too heavy), just dont fit me and toehrs I talk too..

Plus its not a High Power...ever hear of someone that that didnt fit?


WildmanlystrongyetdelicatehandsAlaska

GigaBuist
June 27, 2004, 02:32 AM
A CZ-75B in 9mm was my first handgun. Came recommended by a retired Marine (they're never ex-Marines -- they just retire) and I cant' say it was a bad choice at all.

In HIS hand he could put 10 rounds through a 2" hole at 10 yards easily time after time. Seen him do worse with his own Beretta 92 that same day -- and the bugger probably owns 30 handguns easily.

Used to tell me my pistol was confused. It shoots as accurate as a target gun but it's a combat weapon.

The SA pull is fine for me, but the DA pull doesn't work at all. I've got hands the size of a 12 year old Japanese school girl's. Given that I don't have the decocker model I see no reason why I'd ever plan on doing a DA pull though.

It is a heavy gun which is one of the things I actually like about it. I have no intentions of making it a primary CCW piece -- but damn if it isn't fun on the range. Now, if I didn't have to worry about it printing or could carry it openly, giddy up!

I've never seen the gun fail in the 3 years I've had it. Wait, scratch that. If I don't clean it out after 300 rounds of dirty ammo it fails to feed sometimes. I did that as an experiment. Brush the feed ramp off though and you're good to go.

The sights are sturdy, the finish is good, the SA trigger pull is OK, it's accurate as you can get in a combat ready pistol, it's all solid steel, 15+1 capactiy, and reliable as you can get. That's a quality 9mm pistol.

Your dealer has issues. I'm guessing he offered you a fancy custom Kimber or a cheap Jennings after that exchange.

Majic
June 27, 2004, 04:11 AM
Does this dealer carry the CZ line or was he pushing something else that day?

mbott
June 27, 2004, 08:15 AM
Does this dealer carry the CZ line or was he pushing something else that day?

Does it really matter? :)

--
Mike

Jeff Timm
June 27, 2004, 08:53 AM
For sublime thoughts on Gun Shop Staff I refer you to the gentlemanly musings of Dean Spier, whose name I never spell right.

http://www.thegunzone.com/fatfrank.html

Geoff
Who doesn't give advise in gunstores. :scrutiny:

VG
June 27, 2004, 09:10 AM
CZ's are not as good as some of the cheerleaders say, but what is?

They are big, solid, inexpensive pistols that work well and are decently accurate. And they're not derivative of other designs for the most part and so can claim a place in a collection.

Baba Louie
June 27, 2004, 10:04 AM
Crap... as compared to ???

Heavy? Yeah
Some tooling marks inside? Yeah
Longish DA trigger reach? Yeah
Made in a third world European nation with a long history of firearms manufacture and notable quality while using low cost labor which helps keep the prices down? Yeah
Goes bang every time (at least mine have)? Oh yeah
As accurate as any other of my handguns in my hands? Definitely yeah
Made by a German/Swiss/Austrian/MA/AZ firm using high priced labor and or importing costs? No
So tell your dealer to knock off $30 and buy all he's got in stock :D
You'll be a happy camper by helping rid his shop of crap handguns he offers for sale (assuming he stocks/carries them).
If you're a southpaw the 85 is nice (I think the 75SA also has an ambi safety... but don't quote me)

Don't show him the printout! He'll only realize there are a lot of crap handgun owners out here and raise his prices accordingly to fleece us ;)

Grunt
June 27, 2004, 10:37 AM
Alright, let's play one of my favorite games, "follow the money." :D First question, what does he carry in stock? Is it CZ or is it something he can sell you that he just so happens to carry right now? Next question, what kind of mark up does he have on a lot of the crap he sells? Could it be that he can't make as high of a profit margin off CZ as he can off of another name brand? If not, then yeah, the CZ would probably be crap...for the salesman!:rolleyes:

armoredman
June 27, 2004, 10:53 AM
The CZ lineup covers a whole buncha angles, but it would be nice if they covered a few more niches. I have had a CZ75 Compact, and wish I had never sold it - very reliable, accurate, dependable, etc. My wife has a new CZ 2075 RAMI, and it has all the above attributes, as well.
Got big hands? CZ97 45 ACP, a big pistol designed for big hands.
Average? Any CZ75, 9mm or 40 SW
Small hands? PCR. PO1, RAMI, CZ75 Compact
Light weight? PCR, PO1, RAMI
Steel? CZ75 full and Compact
Like 1911, but wanna CZ? The discontinued, (carried by cdnninvestments.com) CZ40. a co-designed pistol from CZ and Colt, originally called the Colt Z40. Find a Colt Z40, have a heck of an investment collector....I know where one is, and if I get my raises like I should,m that puppy is mine.
I like CZ, and think they are far better than most big name guns. I worked on a rental range for a year and a half, and the only guns that didn't break were the Rugers and CZs. Oddly enough, the inexpensive ones....
No, lets have CZ bring out the CZ97 in 10mm, and the Compact in 40, and the standard in 357SIG, and we'll be closer to covering the bases....
:cool:

SouthpawShootr
June 27, 2004, 11:03 AM
You forgot the CZ100, the CZ alot of people would like to forget :D . I have one and it's been 100% reliable. Trigger is awful. Once you master the trigger, though, the gun is a tack driver. AND it has never jammed. Got it for $300 (probably overpaid just a little), but I'm satisfied with it.

Calhoun
June 27, 2004, 12:37 PM
GigaBuist wrote: "I've never seen the gun fail in the 3 years I've had it. Wait, scratch that. If I don't clean it out after 300 rounds of dirty ammo it fails to feed sometimes. I did that as an experiment. Brush the feed ramp off though and you're good to go."

If you haven't done it already, try polishing the feed ramp. About 15-20 seconds with your best friend Mr. Dremel is all it takes. Maybe not even that long. It helps alot. At one point as a test I didn't clean my 75B for close to 600 rounds. Never skiped a beat. I still don't clean it but maybe every 2nd or 3rd trip to the range (approx 150 rounds per trip).

To comment on the original thread; opinion is just that. If your dealer doesn't like CZ, good for him. More for the rest of us. I don't like Glocks, ever heard anyone say that the Glock is "The Ultimate". Maybe he just can't shoot them well. I can't shoot a Beretta for crap, so for me they suck. At the same time, I wouldn't begin to say that overall they suck.

Rent one yourself and make up your own mind. Or, just trust us on this one and get the 85. If you don't like it I'm sure somebody around here will take it off of your hand. PM me first though, I think I can give it a loving home. I personaly love me 75B. If things were to turn south real quick-like, it's the first pistol I'm going for. I shoot it more accurate than any others.

Have fun, be safe, Peace Out,
Calhoun

Sactown
June 27, 2004, 02:03 PM
Does this dealer also sell crack with his guns, because he's smoking his own product. CZs are great (both rifles and pistols) I have a 75 and it's been problem free and extremely accurate. Find a new dealer, whatever he's pushing, you don't want it.

armoredman
June 27, 2004, 02:06 PM
You are right - I forgot the CZ100, and the 101 they should have imported, along with the exquisite CZ122 .22lr I wish I could get.... I have fired the CZ100, and the trigger wasn't that bad.

4thHorseman
June 27, 2004, 02:17 PM
Hey bfox, if your dealer said they are crap...that's great! The he won't mind selling you them for cost, would he?:D

Just because he is a dealer doesn't make him an expert.

Diamondback
June 27, 2004, 02:59 PM
Your dealer :

A) Doesn't know what he is talking about and therefore I would be skeptical of any of his other "opinions" or advice.

or

B) He wants you to buy a different gun whose sale will yield him a larger profit and therefore he is interested only in his own profit margin and has no regard for the customer.

If you want an accurate assessment ot the CZ read Marcus' post on the previous page....he had said nearly all that needs to be said on these guns !

-Regards

eerw
June 27, 2004, 03:08 PM
He makes me laugh..

get a new dealer...

the CZ line of guns are quality...the CZ75 I had..shot well, reliable and accurate...it does exactly what it was designed to do...

PCRCCW
June 27, 2004, 07:39 PM
Well after close to 20......yes, 20 of them I can say I think they are as good as you can get........Sig, STI, Glock........whatever floats your boat. Ive had ALOT of nice guns and my CCW's have always been CZ's. Ive had ones that werent as accurate as the others or had a hiccup here or there....but in general, they are a damn fine gun.

Get a new dealer and laugh hysterically at your old one :D

Shoot well.

Mannlicher
June 27, 2004, 10:22 PM
I have only one CZ, a 75D PCR. I bought it because it was a 'deal', NIB, $300 out the door complete with an Uncle Mike's holster and a box of shells.

I had never shot or owned a CZ before buying that one. Now, after owning this little 9mm for a few years, I would not part with it under any circumstances. I find it to be accurate, totally reliable, easy to carry, takes Hi Cap mags, and it as a joy to shoot. Other than a couple of Browning HP I own, this is my total favorite 9mm now.

bradvanhorn
June 27, 2004, 10:51 PM
My $400 (which some tell me is expensive for a CZ) CZ 75 B SA is probably the finest 9mm handgun I've ever owned. Beretta's, HK's, Sig's, and other's I've probably forgotten - all are good guns (heck great guns), but I'd sacrifice them all for my CZ. In fact, I recently traded my HK USP 9mm for my new CZ 75 B, and I got killed on the trade. But you know what? I'd much rather have the CZ any day.

If I were buying again today, and thankfully I'm not (too much money spent this month already), I'd say get the CZ 75 B SA if you can live with single action only, or the CZ 75 BD if you want a traditional double/single action gun. If you want something lighter and more compact, go with the CZ 75 D PCR.

Also, there's no need to insult the moron you were dealing with. If you have no other choice, go back and buy the CZ (assuming you can). If he again tells you it's crap, you can kindly ask for a deep discount (as someone else suggested) since you don't want to pay full price for your crap.

Just remember, for every rule there's always an exception, but if you buy a CZ I doubt you will regret it.

Stephen A. Camp
June 28, 2004, 01:43 AM
Hello. I've had rather good luck with several CZ handguns and rifles. They seem very good buys and have worked for me at the range and in the hunting fields. While I'm quite partial to the Hi Power and the 1911, I would not hesitate to use one of my CZ pistols for "serious" matters.

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid49/p1710b8783aa7227bd3140326eac1ba6a/fcb3b5dd.jpg
This old Pre-B had Novaks added by Kurt Wickman some years ago. The target was fired at 15 yards. It's not a "Camp Perry pistol", but it has plenty of accuracy for my needs, real or perceived.

My observations mirror WildAlaska's: The DA trigger reach is a tad long for some folks and on the edge for me. When I carry this gun, it's cocked and locked so that's not been an issue. For folks not preferring to tote in that fashion, it very well might be.

CZ's are not perfect; I'm STILL looking for the perfect pistol and have yet to find it from any maker. Jeff Cooper said something to the effect that "Perfection exists only in the mind of God." I believe that to be true, but keep looking. I've not found perfection with any handgun, but some are darned good and I personally think the CZ's fit that catagory.

Rough interiors? True.
Too long a trigger reach? True, for some.
Reliable? In my experience with several, yes.
Accurate? Surprisingly good "service" accuracy.
Durable? They seem to be; I've been shooting the same ones regularly since the early '80's.

The CZ handguns I've tried (CZ75, 75B's with one exception, 85's, 97's, and 83's) have had very usuable DA/SA pulls out of the box. A couple were exceptionally good. One CZ75B had a good DA pull, but a rather gritty, poor SA pull. That could have been easily fixed, but I sold the gun as I didn't care for the caliber.

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid31/p56225a9a054543679bec2cb34b0e3795/fd47b74f.jpg
This CZ83 has been a stellar performer. The caliber is not my first choice for self-protection, but the gun's quite easy to get the hits with and this one's proven 100% reliable with any and all ammunition tried except Federal 90-gr. Hydrashoks. It's reliably unreliable with them. Everything else works smoothly and w/o fail.

I do not claim to understand your dealer's "reasons" but do disagree with him.

Best.

Longbow
June 28, 2004, 02:41 AM
My only expereince with CZ's is with an EAA CZ clone (Witness). I used it in USPSA competition. My extractor broke twice in a match (ya know, these things only happen in a match :mad: ). I eventually replaced it with an EGW extractor. It got sold before I can fire more rounds through it. Some competitors I know had the same issues. This expereince is the only thing that prevents me from considering a CZ or CZ based handgun again. Otherwise, they do feel good and somewhat accurate. I don't know if the real CZ's share the same weakness.

Lt. G
June 28, 2004, 02:42 AM
I own two CZs an older 75 and a 97. Both are excellent handguns, eat anything and are dead nuts on target. I will eventually own the whole lineup. This are great weapons, I will be talking to my FFL about a Rami real soon. Just my opinion, albeit a strong one.
Cheers, Lt. G

denfoote
June 28, 2004, 05:34 AM
Your dealer is an idiot!!! :banghead:

Berg01
June 28, 2004, 09:23 AM
The experienced shooters that I know seem to like the CZs, and most of the ones who have tried out my 75B 40 S&W seem to like it.

The gun shops here in suburban Phila., PA will talk up CZs if they have a used one in the case to sell, and talk them down if you want to order one. Just like a car dealer who is out to sell you one on the lot, as opposed to ordering you what you want.

The closest CZ stocking dealer is a 90 minute drive from here, and it is a great place to buy a gun. When I'm ready for another CZ, i'll make the drive.

valor1
June 28, 2004, 10:17 AM
Look for another dealer maybe he stocks only jennings or charter arms. Anyway, I have a question guys. Are CZ's made of forged or cast steel (there goes that question again)? I like these guns and wouldn't care whatever process they are made of. I just want to know. Thanks

Ky Larry
June 28, 2004, 10:22 AM
CZ sells every gun they can make so there must be a big market for "crap."

armoredman
June 28, 2004, 10:54 AM
Longbow, the EAA guns are made by Tanfoglio of Italy. I have had 6 of them with no problems as well, but don't let that turn you off CZ!

Going to shoot the RAMI today!:cool: :D

PaladinX13
June 28, 2004, 12:22 PM
Anyway, I have a question guys. Are CZ's made of forged or cast steel (there goes that question again)?

AFAIK, they're forged. But that's second hand information.

Shane333
June 28, 2004, 01:20 PM
Reminds me of an experience I had last year. I went into a gun store and asked the owner if he had any Saiga rifles. He commented that they were junk and that I shouldn't settle for less than a Bushmaster (he had plenty of those in stock ;) ). I simply walked out.

Two weeks later I looked into the same store to check on some ammo prices, only to notice that this arrogant know-it-all dealer had brought in some Saiga rifles to sell.:scrutiny:

It seems the guy was simply lying to me in order to make a lot of money off of me by selling me his big-brand-name hardware. My guess is that this dealer you're talking about is trying to do the same.

Oh, the happy ending to the previous story is I found another gun store with nice, trustworthy salespeople and bought the Saiga from them. For their good service I'll give them a little plug and say that the good store is Gunnies located in Orem, UT.

Plinkerton
June 28, 2004, 03:53 PM
Anyway, I have a question guys. Are CZ's made of forged or cast steel (there goes that question again)?

I have also been informed that they are forged. As far as I know, it's the truth. :D

orangeninja
June 28, 2004, 04:03 PM
I know I'm just adding to a pile of good remarks, but I own 4 Sigs and will not compromise on quality and reliability on a personal defense weapon. Rifles...maybe a little....shotguns...well, why would you? An 870 is hands down the most versitle and reliable of all scatter guns...but a pistol? No.

I own 4 Sigs, 2x229s and 2x2340s....Never had a single one jam. That being said, I would trade either of my Sig 2340s for a CZ 85 Combat. CZ makes the best 9mm available in my opinion.....in my experience. I have yet to shoot that hand made 9mm Sig for $3000.00. But I've shot just about everything else. The CZ 75B is dead accurate, seriously reliable and will last 100 years if treated well.

clipse
June 28, 2004, 05:39 PM
I alway thought CZ's were crap. Hmmmm. I guess I'll have to look at my P-01 and 75B a little different now. :D :D :D


clipse

NoHarmNoFAL
June 28, 2004, 05:42 PM
My wife loves hers. It shoots well and is well made.

Litlman
June 28, 2004, 06:07 PM
Proud owner of TWO pieces of crap!!!!!!75 BD and 85 Combat in Two Tone! Crap, I love crap,crap,crap, crap. To all board members, please send me your CZ crap. What part of Pa .are you from and, who is your dealer? Be good.

bfox
June 28, 2004, 08:25 PM
The gunhop I was talking about is in a suburb of Pittsburgh called
Penn Hills . The shop is Powells guns .
He always gets a little ticked off when I say I read something on the internet.
I value all your opinions .

Thank You , Bill

Skunkabilly
June 28, 2004, 08:55 PM
My dealer says CZ75 "s are crap !

My opinion: Your dealer be gettin' high on his own supply!!!!

CZs are great.

Ash
June 29, 2004, 09:49 AM
Got a great CZ dealer in Hattiesburg, MS, who carries the common models (no CZ-83). They speak well of them.

However, they pull the same crapola on rifles. They say they won't carry the Savage 110 because it isn't good quality (I can definitely vouch differently) but they have a number of Remington 710's on the rack. Yeah, they only sell quality stuff...

Ash

Sean Smith
June 29, 2004, 10:10 AM
Tell him that if they are crap, and everybody knows it, he should be able to get you a great deal on one. :D

Walt Sherrill
June 29, 2004, 11:23 AM
Longbow:

Not only, as previously noted, are EAA guns made by an Italian firm, the guns are subtly different -- not truly CLONES in the common sense of the word. (They're made on the same basic pattern, but a lot of minor differences.)

The EAA guns are simpler (arguably better, in that respect), and have incorporated design features to make manufacturer easier, too.

Many parts don't interchange (different size pins, for example). Barrels aren't interchangeable, mag releases are different, safeties are different, firing pin and pin safeties are different, slide don't interchange, etc., etc. Even mags can cause problems, as the mag releases are set in subtly different positions. (The mags can be made to work with a needle file, if they have problems.)

There's nothing wrong with EAA guns, per se -- and lots more after-market parts are available for them. I have CZs, an EAA, and other "clones," including a couple made in Switzerland, and like them all.

Black Snowman
June 29, 2004, 12:00 PM
I'm spoiled by Kansas City, with the distributor right here almost everyone carries CZs in stock and we get to see unusual stuff like the new laminated rifle stocks and The Bullet Hole even had a Champion on the shelves for a while. First place I've seen a CZ 40-P and a RAMI as well. They used to be kinda snobish joint (at least to me) but their customer service and pricing improved dramaticly when Cabela's moved in. Not a coincidence I'm sure.

Chuck Perry
June 29, 2004, 11:39 PM
That's why I use Braverman's in Wilkinsburg. Great selection, no hassle.

miko912
June 29, 2004, 11:58 PM
Denfoote took my answer. I'm no expert, but mine has been a great first pistol. I'll never sell it. Ever.


Miko

ExtremeDooty
June 30, 2004, 12:12 AM
I don't have a CZ, but from everything I've heard I wouldn't hesitate to buy one.

On my last trip to the gun store, I had $350 in my pocket to buy a Taurus 38. The Dealer told me all Taurus were Brazilian crap and tried to get me to buy the more expensive S&W's. I walked out and haven't been back.

Within a week, I bought a Taurus 605 (357) from someone on a Gun Board for $200 and have been carrying ever since putting several rounds through it at the range.

Find a dealer that will sell you the gun you want not the one he wants to sell you.

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