Newest member enjoying the site....looking for your recommendations on a subcompact that "meets mission" for pocket carry and firepower.....yes, I know that IF there was truly that, all would own it....I have read much on the NAA Guardian .380....cons are that it is HEAVY and trigger is 10lbs +....read much on the Glock 27 in .40S&W. A cop friend loves his Keltec in .380. Just asking fellows....I can fly the hell outta a BlackHawk....but the standard Army Beretta 9 is all I've ever carried.
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June 27, 2004, 01:58 PM
I strongly recommend that you look at the S&W 642/442 revolvers. They have snag free concealed hammers, handle .38+P specials and only weigh 15 oz. unloaded. Although their outer dimensions are larger than the little .32's and .380's the way their weight is distributed makes them extremely comfortable to carry and very unobtrusive. I have a Guardian .32 and a S&W Airweight and have found that the Guardian (12oz.) feels like a small rock in my pocket where the S&W just rides better. Don't get me wrong, I like the Guardian and it is a good gun but I carry the S&W more and more. Best of luck, Mike
June 27, 2004, 02:20 PM
I strongly recommend that you look at the S&W 642/442 revolvers. They have snag free concealed hammers, handle .38+P specials and only weigh 15 oz. unloaded.
I might broaden that out a bit but I agree 100% with the basic idea. "Pocket carry" means a revolver and one without any hammer or other sharp edges to catch on anything. You could even shoot a revolver from the inside of the pocket if you HAD to do so. An auto would give you one shot and then quit. (Disclaimer: I carry a revolver _anyway_ but still think pocket carry is a revolver niche.)
I personally carried a S&W 640 for a couple years. Totally snag free. Totally enclosed "humpback" where the hammer would usually be. No way for any pocket grit or anything else to work into the action. And you can either carry hot .38's or move all the way up to full .357 Magnums. Hell of a gun and my 640-1 is actually very accurate and easy to shoot.
I moved on to an L frame because I wanted a bigger bullet. I carry a S&W 296 now in .44 Special. That's an L frame though and would be pushing it for pocket carry. Weight is actually less than the 640 since it is a Sc/Ti gun but size is bigger.
If you could find a used Rossi 720 in the hammerless configuration, that would make a fine pocket gun as well. Here's a shot of my two 720's (in both configurations) and my 296.
June 27, 2004, 02:26 PM
I agree with Mike get a S&W Rev. That said I carry a Colt Mustang or My PPK/S in my pocket In fact yesterday I just picked up a new pocket holster for my PPK. A old Charter Arms exposed ejector rod works good for pocket carry and can be found for 150 range. Unlike the military you get to decide and there are many choices but I would think if you stay with 38/357 you will find something you will be comfortable with.:) You will most likely be like the rest of us and have a nice collection of pocket pistols. I tell my wife there for our children. Iam just testing them. Never can do enough for your children.:D
June 27, 2004, 03:23 PM
I was dubious to the CCW value of these when comparing the J-frames to the little Kel-Tecs (my Dad has a P32). Side by side, the J-frame looks huge in cmparison. However after buying and carrying a 642 for a while, I'm hooked on it. It's extremely light and comfortable to pocket carry, the shape of the revolver doesn't print as much as a semi-auto and with +P .38 specials it's a little fire breather. I also like the simplicity of the revolver. There are no magazine issues to worry about it, it's not as susceptable to jamming on grit and dust, plus it's basic sights and hammerless design leaves no edges to snag on clothing.
After firing the P32 and the 642 side by side, I feel much more confident shooting the J-frame even though it has more noticable recoil. Neither is easy to shoot, but the J-frame feels much more substantial. The P-32 is a very inovative design and I'd still like to get one, but it's like a little toy in my hands. It's so small it's hard to hold. I can't imagine what it would be like to shoot it in .380.
BTW ArmyAviator, are you talking about concealed carry while on duty or while in civie life? I'd think that in flight gear, you could probably conceal a nice 45ACP 1911 fairly easily.
My absolute favorite CCW is my Colt CCO carried IWB. This pistol is just a hair bigger than a Makarov but backs a bigger punch and has much better sights. It's also a LOT easier to shoot than the J-frame or Kel-Tec.
Another vote for a small revolver. I carry an S&W mod 49 "Bodyguard". I used to carry an airweight Centennial (mod 442), but decided I wanted the option to cock the gun. The 49 has a shrouded hammer that can be thrum-cocked. The steel is a little heavier, but I don't notice the difference carrying, but it helps soak up recoil a little better.
In my book, the ultra-lights (Scandium, titanium, etc) are too light. I haven't shot one, and don't want to. Some weight is needed to reduce felt recoil.
June 27, 2004, 08:37 PM
The J frame is the best choice, for pocket carry the hammerless models are a bit safer IMVHO.
I tried a Kel Tec P11 and P32 before buying a J frame, my only regret is that I didn't start with the J frame in the beginning.
I would say that for situations were even the J frame is to big, then use Kel Tec's P32/P3AT.
BTW Uncle Mike's pocket holster is only about $10.00 but works better than most.
June 28, 2004, 12:55 AM
Another vote for the S&W J frame. I have a 642 and purchased a Kramer
pocket holster. They work very well together. Dillon used to carry the
Kramer pocket holsters at a discount, don't know if they still do.
A couple of 5 shot strips of plus p just in case and you're ready to go.
June 28, 2004, 02:23 AM
I've tried several pocket guns. In the end, the S&W Airweight series of Chief's Special (J-frame) is the pick.
With a pair of speed strips in the other pocket, and a good pocket holster, it's fine for carry. Anything lighter than the Airweight is hard to shoot well enough to practice and get good with it.
June 28, 2004, 02:52 AM
How big are your pockets?
Really. Jacket or pants. Backup in the pocket, or only gun in the pocket? Is this "just in case" or do you live / work in a really bad neighborhood? What is your skill level?
Jacket = hammerless .38 or .357 (depending on skill) -- can also be used with baggy slacks.
Kahr compact 9mm can also be carried if your pants are loose.
Pants " just in case" = Seecamp. NAA Guardian. Keltec . 32. NAA mini .22/.22 mag.
Lots of choices, depends on your skills and situation.
June 28, 2004, 02:55 AM
AA ... welcome dude! :)
I much like my SP-101 even tho a tad heavy ... but if we talk ''pocket'' - literally ... then I'll thrown in also perhaps the smallest 9mm pocket piece you'll find. Well .. better IMO anyways than the tiny Kahr.
The Rohrbaugh R9 (or with sights R9s) ..... I have one .. and am getting another .... it is the ultimate IMO in a small 9mm piece and .. true pocket. Heavier than Kel-Tec P3-AT I'll grant you - and way more costly but ... if small is what you want - and 9mm cal min is what pleases then .. consider this piece. Smaller tho than PC9.
I have just recently published a composite ammo report page for this gun .... and that has links to tests also .. may be of interest for you to read.
Go Look Here (http://www.acbsystems.com/boards/data/R9-ammo-data.htm) if you have a minute or two. This lil' pup could be something you could find useful ... tho of course, many useful recommendations have already been made re revo's.
recommend a 642 loaded with either Remmie 158gr+P LSWCHP's or the new Speer 135+P Gold Dot JHP's nestled in a milt sparks PCH-R1. I have chono'd both out of my 642 and I feel well and comfortably armed with the little J-frame. The Milt-sparts hoster is the best pocket holster out there (in my opinion of course). It is smooth on the front to minimize printing, molded to the gun or the rear side and has metal sewn into the borders. The metal allows for the holster to be bent to contour to the leg. Jeans or slacks, pleated or non-pleated; this holster makes the gun disapear no matter what kind of pants or shorts I'm wearing. The overall inverted triangle shape of the holster also allows it to fit better in all of my pockets. I don't understand pocket holster designs that are molded/contoured to the gun on the front. It seems it would print everytime a person steps forward with their leg on which side the gun is holstered on. Here are some pics;
June 28, 2004, 04:35 AM
The original "Pocket Rocket": Glock 26!!!!
Carried in a Galco PH286 pocket holster.
I carry mine like that sometimes and have a friend who does so on a daily basis!!!!
10 rounds of 9mm with 1 in the tube and two spare 15 round Glock 19 mags!!!!
June 28, 2004, 12:44 PM
All of the above suggestions are good. I suggest you also look at the Kahr PM9.
It's a lightweight smooth double action 9mm. Excellant quality carry piece in semi-automatic.
Good luck and welcome to the forum.
June 28, 2004, 02:54 PM
Don't forget the CZ 2075 RAMI, avialable in .40 & 9mm. Small revolvers are a great choice too. My personal choices for pocket pistols would be the RAMI or a .357 snubby of some flavor depending on if it was a solo act or a backup gun. If I'm carrying a full size or compact auto I'll take it's baby counterpart. If it's flying solo, the punch of a .357 would make me feel better.
Regardless of what you choose for a gun get a good pocket holster. I recommend HBE Leather Works (http://www.hbeleatherworks.com/) to get just exactly what you need or want.
June 28, 2004, 04:28 PM
I started with a S&W 638 airweight shrouded hammer J-frame. Then switched to a Keltech P32. I prefer the P32 for everyday non obtrusive carry. My P32 rides in a DeSantis Nemesis pocket holster and practically disappears in a pair or dockers. I found the 638 to be a little heavy in my pocket. Choose the HG which is best for you.
June 28, 2004, 07:09 PM
I have my Keltec P3AT (.380) in my pocket all the time.
June 28, 2004, 10:33 PM
Welcome to THR. :)
Lots of good suggestions here - and variables to consider.
While I certainly won't knock what works well for others, I've noticed here and elsewhere that some folks are quite happy with guns like the Ruger SP 101 and Glock 26 as "pocket guns". They are simply to "bricky" for my carry tastes (even IWB) not to mention the size of my typical pants pockets. I'm admittedly getting old and cantankerous and have evolved to love the "lightweights", whether IWB, ankle or (sometimes more here just lately) pocket. ('been getting acquainted with new j-frame holster from www.hedleyholster.com)
Absolute favorite "carry gun" (usually IWB) is S&W 340 with Crimson Trace overmoulded grip. Including 5-rounds of .38s or .357s, it weighs just 15 ounces. 6-rounds of reloads carry flat in Bianchi speed strip. Another 18 possible in flat plastic "wallet pack".
Next-to-favoite "carry gun" (most commonly on ankle) is Kahr PM-9. Just 19.4 ounces loaded with 6+1 of 9mm and quite compact.
In addition to things I've seen on gun forums about the relatively new Kel-Tec .380, a lady friend recently got one and we ran the first box of FMJs through it last week. Without any glitches whatsover. (Trigger does take some acclimation). For times when I might want more of a pure "ultra-light pocket gun", it made me think I may now "need" one of those too. What, maybe 1O ounces loaded with 6+1? Now THAT is a (small) pocket gun. Then, I have to stop and remind myself of the reason for what is on our DCSA t-shirts: "Friends don't let freinds carry mouse guns - unless they would otherwise not carry at all." ...
June 29, 2004, 10:15 PM
Kel-Tec P-3AT loaded with 70 grain Corbon Pow'R Ball.
Anything bigger isn't a pocket pistol, it's a pocket bulge, there's a difference.
June 30, 2004, 04:37 PM
Although not as popular as lot of other manufacturers and a bit more expensive, Kahr products just can't be beat. I own four, all four have thousands of rounds fired with nary a hiccup.
My 24/7 carry is my Kahr PM9, it carries 7 rounds of 9MM+P, which is two more than most J-Frame .38spl Smithy's carry. It is slightly more ballistically , I hate the word, powerful than a .38spl, it's very flat, very light and very small overall. It has a trigger action right out of the box that is far superior to any stock Glock. Totally reliable and very well built, a really great pocket gun which is what I believe you asked about. I own a (baby) Glock 33 which is like carrying a brick in your pocket, that is if you can even get it in your pocket.
June 30, 2004, 09:47 PM
I went old school..sort of.
I don't really care for snubbies. Matter of personal choice plus I can't hit a (insert expletive here) thing with them. I found a CZ-83.
Yes, it's a little bigger. Yes, it's a little heavier,. Yes it's 380.
It's deadly accurate, has a better trigger than all of the snubbies I have owned and has 13+1 capacity. Pretty easy to hide IWB.
June 30, 2004, 11:01 PM
Certainly nothing wrong with the J-frame snubbies, but the Kahr PM9 gets my vote.
Ultimately it's a matter of personal preference.
July 2, 2004, 05:47 PM
I'm not sure i consider my Glock 26 or 27 a true pocket gun,although i have carried them in a heavy jacket pocket.
My 642 loaded with Silver Tips carries real easy in my pants pocket.
July 2, 2004, 07:38 PM
I have been carrying a S&W 642 in an Uncle Mike's pocket holster for several years. However, yesterday I picked up a Kahr PM9, and just returned from the range after firing 210 rounds of assorted 9mm ammo. Kahr states in the manual that you shouldn't depend on it until firing at least 200 rounds.
The little Kahr handled everything I loaded into it, and I had one FTF of a handloaded hollow point at around round 150 (possibly this one was a bit long in the case). I fired it weak hand, strong hand, two hand, and even intentionally "limp wristed" it a couple of times. I fired it with both standard and +P ammo. Recoil wasn't as bad as I anticipated, but I did work up a blister on the thumb of my strong hand. I wasn't trying for accuracy, shooting whenever the front sight was on the IPSC target at 7 yards, but it appeared to keep all the rounds in the kill zone.
The Kahr fits in the same pocket holster as the 642, and one advantage is that I will carry a reload, since the spare mag fits in a black nylon knife holster, and nobody knows that it isn't a small folder on my belt. I never did find a good way to carry spares for the 642, since speed loaders are too bulky, and speed strips don't co-exist with the keys, change, etc. that reside in the non-gun front pocket.
The Kahr is presently loaded with Cor-bon 115 +P, and I feel pretty happy with 7 of those in the pistol and an additional 7 of them in the spare mag.
July 3, 2004, 12:25 AM
Speaking for myself, I can't carry in my pocket. No matter what I do I can't seem to comfortably conceal a handgun in my front pocket. I wear relatively loose fitting jeans but for some reason it just doesn't work for me.
So, if you are anything like me, find another way to carry.
I prefer IWB.
July 6, 2004, 03:53 PM
Is the Colt CCO.....but it does not fit into a pocket well.
I have tried many designs over the years to find the perfect pocket piece...from High Standard Derringers, Beretta 32a's, AMT Back Ups, various .38 snubbies, etc.
One of the best is and always will be the Jayframe .38...take your pick of models and features...I like the Bodyguard, but the 442/642 is great too. The balance of a small revolver in a good holster, is excellant...it is a great American concealed classic!
My lady friend recently picked up a Kahr PM9 and I must say that is one sweet little gun!! And if I was in the market for another pocket piece(one day I will be), I'd get that one. Expecially in the military...at least there will be Nine ammo available, if only ball(yuck). I'd load it with Plus P JHP's myself. It's easier to shoot fast and accurate that the Jay(on average), less recoil, more power, more ammo, faster reload, etc.
I suppose the dinky .380 has it's place too, though under powered, it beat throwing rocks. I fired the Keltec and did not much care for it...but for deep concealment/extreme close range emergency....
Personally I'd love to find a Colt Pocketlite Mustang...that would be my .380 flavor of the month.
The Baby Glocks are good guns, but rather chunky for the average pocket.
July 8, 2004, 02:07 AM
The best thing to do, is to check out a couple of pistols, carry them around the house in your pants and see which one you would carry, day in and day out. Too many people have CCW's and don't carry, because it is too uncomfortable. It also pays to have a good pocket holster.....
July 8, 2004, 01:15 PM
Howdy Aviator ... I'll bet we know some of the same people.
Another vote for the Kahr here, mine is a P9 but I'm planning on picking up a PM9 one of these days.
July 8, 2004, 02:52 PM
I usually have my NAA .380 or my S&W 637 in my pocket. When I wear my sweat pants with really shallow pockets I throw my NAA .22 lr mini in them.
July 8, 2004, 05:25 PM
Hope you are enjoying the salubrious climes of summer at Mother Rucker. I spent a couple years there in a previous lifetime when the Italian helicopters were still flying (Hueys that is).
Pocket carry is an interesting proposition, people buy handguns with the intent of pocket carrying them and often wind up leaving them at home because they are too heavy, too bulky, too abrasive etc. So find something light, small and smooth, and by all means use a pocket holster to keep the beastie oriented properly and help keep it from printing.
The Kahr is a popular 9mm choice, I have a P9 and like it a lot but it is a bit large for true pocketability. The smaller PM9 should be just the ticket. Hope I can find as good a deal on one as I did on the P9... .
Lots of people like the Kel-Tecs. I just bought my wife a P3AT for her birthday, it is still in the break-in period but she likes it a lot. I do too. By all means get K-Ts hardchromed for pocket carry. The company will do it for $20.
Traditionalists have an ongoing love affair with S&W J frames in one or another alloy. They have worked well for decades, and continue to do so.
So many choices, so few $$$...
July 12, 2004, 03:15 PM
The 642 is my choice. It is truely a point and shoot device...and with the totaly enclosed hammer, can be fired right through the pocket if the situation calls for it. I replaced the rubber grips with some old S&W wooden J-frame grips I had laying around for smoother draw. Not that the rubber grips bad, just my preference.
July 13, 2004, 01:40 AM
If I'm not mistaken, none of the pistols your friends mentioned are realy sub compact. My all time favorite sub compact pistol is a .32 cal. seacamp.
I bought it several years ago when Seacamp couldn't keep up with the demand, and had to pay the money up front, and wait three years fore dilivery. I think it was well worth the mony and the long wait. The construction and finish is second to none, and it is realy small, maybe the smallest in it's class. It is strictly all business, no sights, strictly double action, and probaly the safest gun available. Don't overlook it, when making your choice.
July 13, 2004, 09:59 AM
Some folks have lost sight of the fact that you are looking for suggestions for a pocket pistol.
The Seacamp is a great pistol but pretty much limited to Silvertip ammo in a rather anemic .32acp caliber. Kel-Tecs, I've owned three of them, are just OK. They have had many reliability issues and I would not trust one to save my life, God forbid the need should arise. S&W J-frame revos are great guns also but carry only five rounds with speed strips and speed loaders as your "quick"reload options, these items are clumsy to carry and awkward to use especially if you are in a panic situation. Also a revo tends to "print" through your clothing. The Colt CCO like the smallest Glocks are fantastic weapons but are just too big to be considered pocket pistols, much like carrying a brick in your pocket. Glocks are hard to beat, great price, totally reliable and light weight. If you decide that I.W.B carry is OK for you then a Glock is the way to go.
Where does that leave you? The answer is simple, the Kahr PM9! It carries 7 rounds on board with all the spare magazines you care to equip yourself with. The gun is very thin, very light, very accurate and totally reliable.
There are dozens of tiny "Saturday Night Specials" available that look great but aren't worth their weight in cow dung so be careful when making your choice.
Good Luck in your military career, I crewed a Navy HU16-D during two tours in Viet Nam, love them helos.
July 13, 2004, 02:04 PM
Unless you are wearing your flight suit, you may find your pockets a bit lacking. Sometimes this can be rectified by going up two or more inches in the waistband, you need enough room in the pant leg for both your leg and the pistol, with a little extra so you can still move. If the pants are otherwise OK but the pocket is too small you can make your own pocket to fit the gun of your choice.
The heavier steel framed pieces tend to move around a lot and will pull your pants down if your not careful, but are easier to shoot. The plastic and alloy framed ones can be a real pain in the hand if they don't fit just right, so handle and shoot as many as you can before buying, and don't be afraid to switch or modify the grips to make it fit you. The better the fit, the more accurate a small pistol gets.
July 14, 2004, 09:59 AM
Ditto on the S&W 642 being great as a carry gun! Mine is very, very accurate and the trigger was fine from the box. I also carry a Beretta Bobcat 21-A in stainless sometimes in .22LR. Yes I know its a .22 but this small pistol is acceptable accuracy wise, don't jam with the right ammo, and I have yet to feel unarmed when carrying it. There is times the best carry gun you can get is the one you will have with you when it's needed. Both of my choices are small, accurate and reliable and I hope I never ever have to use them!
July 14, 2004, 02:36 PM
Also a revo tends to "print" through your clothing.
Depends on your clothes and how/where you carry. I've pocket carried both an MK9 and various J-frames and the J-frames are hands down (1) less likely to print and (2) faster to get a firing grip on in the pocket. YMMV...
July 14, 2004, 04:22 PM
I carry a 442 as backup to my 1911. I've carried the 442 both in pocket and on ankle and find I like it better on my ankle. What then for the pocket? I'm thinking real hard about a P3AT. For the money, I can't go wrong given what I've read about it.
My only issue with the 442 in the pocket is the bulk in a pair of jeans - seems a flat auto would be better there. .380 is really less than I'd like, but this is a backup not a primary.
July 14, 2004, 09:10 PM
I don't think the slight buldge around the cylinder makes it obvious you have a revolver in your pocket. You might even impress onlookers who think it is caused by something a bit more organic.
I shot a hundred rounds of .357 through my 605C last night and I have to say that by the end of the 100 rounds I felt like I had a nose bleed from the vibration. I probably won't shoot too many more .357 rounds, mostly because I don't want to stretch out the frame. I think I'll stick with +p .38s for the most part.
July 14, 2004, 10:18 PM
slight buldge around the cylinder
I should have elaborated a little. In the pants of my khakis, the sharp corners of the MK9 are more visible than the cylinder of the J-frame. Most of the rest of the J-frame is thinner and/or rounded and seems to melt better into the fabric.
July 15, 2004, 04:25 PM
I'll have to agree with Zeke Menuar. Go with a CZ-83.
July 15, 2004, 04:52 PM
Rohrbaugh R9s handsdown
July 17, 2004, 01:19 PM
I prefer not to dip below the 9mm for a carry gun. The PM9 fills this role well. It is relatively light and flat and carries well in a pocket or ankle holster. Mine has been reliable with the Gold Dot 124 +P cartridge that I use for carry.
July 17, 2004, 04:31 PM
JNEWELL, come on now. You say the "sharp" corners on a Kahr PM9 print more visibly than the cylinder on a J-frame revo? Man I find that hard to believe unless you are wearing skin tight clothing in which case anything will print. What's sharper than the business end of a revo cylinder or the front sight on a revo?
Are you pocket carrying without a holster? If so, that's not too wise.
I own both the PM9, and three other Kahrs, also an assortment of 5 S&W J frames. The only revos that are easy to draw are the hammerless models but nothing slides out of it's holster like my PM9, nothing could be easier or much quicker. Not to mention that the PM9 reloads much more quickly than bulky and clumsy speed strips or speed loaders. I love every one of my J frames but for everyday carry the Kahr PM9 is my favorite.
As for Rorbaughs, they still have to face up to the test of time and I feel certain they will do just fine but consider this, for the price of one Rorbaugh
you could have 2 Kahr PM9s, one in each front pocket. Balistically they should prove to be about the same. 9mm over .38spl anyday.
July 17, 2004, 05:09 PM
First, thank you for your service!!!
Welcome to the board!!
The issue of pocket carry is a straightforward, yet complex issue.
Guns small enough to fit (both size and weight) are usually small in caliber and guns that are of sufficient caliber usually kick like the proverbial Missouri mule!!! The size of your pocket is also a factor. BDU's have bigger pockets than Wranglers!!! The cost of the gun as size and weight are lowered is a significant factor as well due to rare strategic metals being used in the construction. (eg. titanium and scandium) Common ordinary polymer is, in my opinion, the best bet for a pocket frame material.
This leads back to the above mentioned Glocks and Kel-Tecs. I understand that Kahr has all but perfected their "PM" line of pocket guns.
I have a Glock 26 and a Kel-Tec P3AT that serve well as pocket pistols.
My stainless Kahr MK9 is small enough, but is a bit on the heavy side for pocket carry. As touching revolvers, my only experience has been with the aluminum framed Taurus M85UL. (The 'UL' stands for ultra lite.) It's a decent little gun in .38spl that can be had for somewhat less than it's more expensive S&W cousin. It's drawback is that it kicks like the aforementioned mule and only holds five rounds, thus forcing you to carry at least one speed-loader.
Like I said, straightforward, yet complex!!! :evil:
I hope this slight dissertation has provided you with some insight and not confused the heck out of you!!! :what:
July 18, 2004, 01:15 AM
I carried a pocket revolver for years, but I decided to go to auto for the following reasons:
1. Much quicker reload.
2. Better ballistics in the same size gun (40S&W vs 38 Spec.)
3. Similar reliabilty with similar care and maintenance.
4. Very small options for times when nothing else can be carried.
5. More shootable guns in a greater power range.
6. Can carry more spare ammo in smaller packages
I know many like them, but I have not warmed up to the plastic guns.
I own and carry a NAA Guardian in 32 ACP and a AMT Backup in 40 S&W.
I am still happy with both those choices.
July 18, 2004, 09:03 PM
You say the "sharp" corners on a Kahr PM9
No, I said the sharp corner on an MK9...dunno about whether the PM9 is more or less "melted" than the MK pistols. But if they're the same, yes, that is what I said. The corners at the rear of the slide and the corners at the end of the grip section are much sharper and more prominent in my pockets than the aft section of a Centennial and its grips.
I find that hard to believe unless you are wearing skin tight clothing in which case anything will print
Nope, I wear very loose-fitting khakis, with pleats too boot, to provide extra fabric so the fabric is loose around all the stuff in my pockets.
What's sharper than the business end of a revo cylinder or the front sight on a revo?
There's nothing sharp about either when they're in a pocket holster, which is how I've carried this one for years. The front sight on the J-frame is actually less prominent than the front sight on my MK9, by the way.
Are you pocket carrying without a holster? If so, that's not too wise.
If I were, the sharp corners on the Kahr would be even more prominent than the J-frame, which is mostly curves. I don't carry handguns that aren't in holsters.
Unless someone's got huge pockets, the Centennial will come out faster with less need for a grip adjustment. I can get an almost perfect firing grip on a J-frame in my pocket. I can't do that with my MK9 -- with any pair of pants I've owned.
July 19, 2004, 02:35 AM
Another vote for the weird S&W 296 .44spl.. With 5 rounds of Hornady 180grain XTP , which does 950fps in mine (and prints 2" 15yard groups!), it weighs 22oz. IN it's thin horsehide Kramer pocket holster. It is smooth and fits concealed into the front pockets of BDUs or in the back pocket of most anything ,or in a jacket pocket (esp nice inside a leather flight jacket). Most controllable bang for the weight I know of. I shoot it twice a month 20 rounds per outing , I think it will hold up indefinetly at that rate ( I shoot other guns many hundreds of rounds in that time period). Next size DOWN for me is a slicked up Colt .38spec Agent in same type holster,that weighs 18oz loaded & holstered. Forget .357s that weigh less than say 27 oz unloaded unless you are talking emergency bear medicine(dream on!). The next step UP for me is a lightweight Officers .45acp which weighs about 30oz loaded without holster. ;)
July 22, 2004, 04:36 PM
My SW332 - they don't make em any more.
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