Most defensive ball ammo?


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sevenpoint62mm
June 28, 2004, 11:32 PM
Thinking a 230 gr ball might be better over all then a 165 powerball hollowpoint. Concerneed about feeding most of all but also very concerned that the powerball won't penertrate and EFMJs seem a little too snake oil to trust. If I had to load ball for defense are there any P+ or P++ rounds?

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sm
June 28, 2004, 11:47 PM
I'm guessing this is for use in a 1911 style.

Originally JMB designed the firearm to use 200 gr. After the powers that be did testing these powers wanted a 230 gr with a velocity of ~ 850 fps, for military use. Worked this long - works for me.

If'n one goes and bumps the velocity up, will the gun run, and if so for how long? Will springs and such have to be changed? Can the shooter get back on target for fast follow up shots?

I prefer to not open a can of worms...230gr FMJ ~ 850 fps out of a 5" bbl is proven.

armoredman
June 28, 2004, 11:49 PM
Well the last time I looked, PoweRBall and EFMJ was doing quite well by Evan Marshall, with a couple of shootings so far.
45 is the only caliber I would not feel too bad with ball.

Mil Novecientos Once
June 29, 2004, 11:38 AM
230gr FMJ ~ 850 fps out of a 5" bbl is proven.
AMEN!

Gunfyter
June 29, 2004, 01:33 PM
230 FMJ A proven stopper for almost 100 years.

R.H. Lee
June 29, 2004, 02:08 PM
If 1610 gr of hardball COM won't stop whatever it is then what will? :what:

Smoke
June 29, 2004, 02:59 PM
Go to the store, pick out the cheapest box of ammo that fits your particular weapon. Practice, practice, practice, to steal a line fromt the shotgun section BA/UU/R


When bad guy shows up, shoot COM until he quits moving. Do not shoot one - assess - shoot again - assess. If you cannot shoot COM go practice some more.

Ammo arguments are similar to caliber arguments. It matters less what you hit the target with than that you hit the target.

Smoke

Dave T
June 29, 2004, 02:59 PM
Evan Marshall is not a quotable authority to many of us here.

That being said, the 1911 Government Model in 45 ACP made its reputation with 230g Ball at standard velocities. I see no reason for +P, let alone +P+ or other silliness.

As always, others will have a different opinion.

Dorrin79
June 29, 2004, 03:17 PM
i think that .45 ball is a perfectly acceptable self-defense load.

On the other end of the scale, I remain undecided as to JHP vs FMJ in 9x18 and .380 - I think underpenetration with JHPs is a concern in those calibers.

I think that ball in 9x19 or .40 is a poor choice for SD - combination of overpenetration and sizable reduction in wound channel vs JHP.

David4516
June 29, 2004, 03:43 PM
On the other end of the scale, I remain undecided as to JHP vs FMJ in 9x18 and .380 - I think underpenetration with JHPs is a concern in those calibers.

I carry JHPs in my 9X18 Makarov... but they are my own handloads. I've got them going about 100 FPS faster than factory ammo, so I'm confident that they will expand, and they should penatrait far enough, I think the only time I'd be worried about that is if you have to shoot thru the arm to get to the vitals...

I'm using an aftermarket recoil spring by the way... I figured that would be a good idea for stout loads in a blowback pistol...

As for FMJ ammo for a .45, I don't see why not... it worked for the army for many decades...

sevenpoint62mm
June 29, 2004, 06:21 PM
Well the last time I looked, PoweRBall and EFMJ was doing quite well by Evan Marshall, with a couple of shootings so far.

While Marshall has some great info he can forsee every instance. Such as if the BBG is stealing my car I'm concerned a 165 hollowpoint isn't going to do much on a front windshield sloped at 45 degrees. EMJ does a little better in this area then JHPs I distrust any bullet design that uses rubber in its design.

sm
June 30, 2004, 02:44 AM
As one of many who has actually shot a lot of materials, in actual settings -read: not just bldg materials or auto glass/winddhields "drug" out to a range, but inside the actual house, or while still attached to the car, they do react differently...

Screw the handgun, gimmee slugs from a 12 bore or a Model 70 in '06. "I done Kilt me a 280Z and Trans Am" ( wind/back steep glass amongst others)

I can't shoot my vehicle if a perp is driving away while stealing it here in my state.

I have shot sitting from inside to outside a vehicle like mine through the passenger side glass to see what works if I need to protect myself if I get boxed in , shot at , and need to defend because "I'm in fear of my life" tho'.

I wonder if Smoke ever made me that IWB holster for a 870 pump...I could have sworn he was going to work on that for me. :)

Sigh...

In the meantime I know what works out of 1911, BHP, Keltec P-11, a J,K, L, N frame, and similar - etc...calibers 45ACP, 9mm, 38spl, .357, .44spl, 9x23, 38 super, .480 Ruger, 44 mag...

Standard pressure ammo with properly proven designed have proven themselves. Not only for me...others before me as well.

For instance...did ya know...

A 148 gr Target WC and 158 gr LSWC from a J frame snubby will go through a passenger glass and through a mattress. So will a standard pressure 200 gr lead SWC out of a 1911. The 1911 230 gr FMJ was a given, did it anyway...yep it did.

Okay maybe I'll never have to shoot through a passenger glass , through a mattress , and through the door of a Jesus Bus 35 yds away...if I find myself in need that 44 mag or .480 Ruger with whatever the hell handloads that were "mild" would be kinda nice to have handy. oops. ;)

[he said these were "mild," I then shot the "bit hotter" loads...oh boy!]

Using Enough Gun means Use Enough Ammo.

Does not have to be tricked out, +p, +p+, or some weird unobtanium material or shape. Lead is amazing stuff. Shot placement, relies on reliable ammo in said gun, and POA/POI is highly recommended.

Old salvage / junk yards , used with permisson are sooo educational....:uhoh: :)

Old houses , new construction sites are fun too...with permisson...shooting guns in the house....oh boy!

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