How bad it CAN be


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mhdishere
July 9, 2004, 09:31 AM
I think you folks know that I currently live in New Jersey, and that I moved here from New York City. Folks keep telling me how bad the gun laws are in NJ, and don't get me wrong they are bad, but coming from NYC I know they COULD be a lot worse.

I thought I'd post a few personal observations on the NYC guns laws to serve as a warning.

To get a handgun license you have to apply, in person, in lower Manhattan (not at your local PD). You have to bring a couple-hundred dollar fee (last I heard) as a postal money order (no bank MO's, no checks, no cash). You also have to bring a few passport photos that're less than six months old. They fingerprint you. When I applied the wait was nine months for processing. When they call you back (assuming you passed) you had to go back, with NEW passport photos (the ones your brought nine months ago are now over six months old you see). You get a license, and you have some amount of time (60 days sounds right, but I could be wrong) to buy a single handgun. You then have 72 hours to bring the gun BACK to lower Manhattan for inspection, where they record the serial number in their little black book, and on your license, and they keep your sales receipt. (Mind you, this is three trips to the PD, one of which costs you a day off of work since you're not allowed to bring the gun anywhere but to a range or to the PD). If you want another gun you apply for another purchase authorization, that takes a couple months (and another fee and another trip to Manhattan). Again, you bring it in for inspection. Your license must be renewed (for a couple hundred bucks) every two years. The licensing people treated you like a prospective criminal.

I had a target permit, which required me to belong to a gun club with a range. I could bring my gun there to shoot anytime I wanted, but had to transport it in a locked box with ammo separate. I've heard they stopped giving out such licenses, now you have a premise-target license for which you can take the gun out twice a month on predetermined dates (say the 10th and 25th of every month). If you want to go to the range on another day you have to notify the police in advance, in writing, and you give up one of your other dates that month. The other option is a premise license which allows you to have the gun at your home, and if I rememeber correctly you could only take it out a couple times a year to practice.

I never got a rifle license, that required a trip to Queens which was just too much hassle for me. I worked in Manhattan so I could do the handgun license.

Under Mayor David Dinkins NYC passed an assault weapons ban. The determination of what constitutes an assault weapon was done at the local level IIRC. There was a story of some police chief who decided that any rifle with a bayonet lug was an assault weapon, even a WW I era bolt-action rifle.

:what:

Compared to NYC, NJ is hog-heaven for me. When I want a new handgun I apply at my local PD (four blocks from home), I can get three handguns at a time, and it only takes a few weeks to process the application. No renewals of licenses, and if I want a rifle or shotgun I walk into a shop, plunk down my FID and walk out with my shootin' iron. Of course it could be better, like VT, or TN. It could be worse too (like NYC).

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halvey
July 9, 2004, 09:41 AM
This is America you live in?

Man, I complain because the media rips guns and I want to move to Alaska. I shouldn't complain I guess.

Dain Bramage
July 9, 2004, 09:44 AM
Geez. I just bought a used Dan Wesson Model 15 yesterday in downtown Seattle. I told the wife I would be an hour late coming home. Turns out I was only a half hour late, and most of that time was finding parking and gawking at the selection at Central Gun Exchange. Filled out paperwork, passed NICS, cash on the counter, and out the door with my brown paper bag! :D

For all the liberal whiners in this city, it's still nice to be a part of America.

Werewolf
July 9, 2004, 09:58 AM
Sorry but:

Son - of - a - B****!

I knew it was bad in NYC but not that bad. From everything I've heard and read it is easier to get a gun in Russia.

I wonder how many otherwise law abiding citizens of NYC just say F**k it and procure a weapon offline of the prescribed procedures?

The restrictions you describe for NJ are even prohibitively excessive. You need to move to a free state. There are a few left you know.

CentralTexas
July 9, 2004, 10:29 AM
I've bought guns at garage sales, hand them the cash they hand you the gun. No registration required. If I'm "traveling" I can carry the gun with no license.
I take a one day course and pay under $150 bucks and I have my concealed carry permit in the mail a couple of months later.
I go to the gunshop and either I have a NICS check or if I have a concealed license not even that and the gun goes home with me that day.
What part of infringed don't the left and east coast understand?
CT

41mag
July 9, 2004, 11:01 AM
Wow,the next time I whine about the hoops michiganders have to jump through I'll look at this.
:what:
Maybe we need to re-arange the country.Put all the loonies on the coasts &,if you pass a basic brain function test,let the rest of us live between the mountains.
Geez!

armoredman
July 9, 2004, 11:04 AM
Dear God, man move to AZ! No license, no waiting period, no permit to carry open, no magazine limit, no state AWB, instant background check, shall issue CCW,(CCW negates need for background check, too), no registration, private sales OK, with no state interferance, no ammo bans, carry in vehicle if you wish, etc. How can you STAND it!?!?:confused: :fire: :banghead: :what:

P95Carry
July 9, 2004, 11:22 AM
I am appalled ....... that as described is beaurocracy run riot and outa control. NYC does not deserve to have the title ''American City'' .... :rolleyes: :(

WilderBill
July 9, 2004, 11:30 AM
:eek:


I'm sooo glad I live in the free world! :cool:


The procedure in my neighborhood is more like:
Me; "Hey, you still wanna sell that extra Mak?"
Neighbor; "Sure, whaddaya gonna trade, cause I know you don't have money?"
Me; "How 'bout a pair of used Chevy small block heads?"
Neighbor; "Yeah, OK" (pulling loaded Mak from pocket and handing it to me).
Five minutes tops, unless I stay for a beer.

No wait.
No paperwork.
No hassle.
No kidding!

juggler
July 9, 2004, 12:13 PM
Guess I have it better than I thought. Every gun I've purchased has gone through fairly easily.... anywhere from 15 minutes to 1/2 hour (when the computers were down).Just need the pistol permit and Driver's license.
The part I like is the forms you have to fill out....."Are you a convicted felon? Do you have a restraining order on you?" etc. Kinda ridiculous when you think about it, though I've been told (by the guy doing my paperwork, while waiting for the computer to burp up the ok) that he actually had one guy answer yes to the convicted felon question. Wonder what he was going to do when asked for his permit?
:confused:

Bobarino
July 9, 2004, 12:34 PM
i'm with Dain Bramage. for being a liberal state, (at least on this side of the Cascades) the gun laws are pretty dang good. except for the no full auto and no supressor thing, just about everything else is fair game. shall issue, got my CWP on the spot in about 30 minutes, no waiting period for pistols if you have the permit, fill out the 4473, phone call by the gun shop, hear the magic word "proceed", pay money, go to the range. its not too bad compared to some states. still not as free as it should be though.

Bobby

Jiml3
July 9, 2004, 01:07 PM
I'm originally from NYC but now reside on Long Island, a suburb of NY. Another restriction on guns in NYC is that police officers from the suburbs or New
Jersey cannot carry an off duty weapon in the city. NYC cops are supposed to live in any one of the 5 boroughs. A lot don't, therefore, they are breaking the law. It's not enforced because the police and fireman's unions would be up in arms and if enforced, a lot of guys would retire. If you want to protect yourself and reside in the city, for the most part, you have to be connected
to get a carry license or break the law and take your chances.
WARNING, YOU ARE ENTERING NYC. ONLY POLICEMEN AND CRIMINALS CAN CARRY WEAPONS.

BryanP
July 9, 2004, 01:17 PM
Dear God. That is just insane. :barf:

Compare that to mid January of this year when I was working in Chattanooga TN (I live in the Nashville area). I was driving back from lunch when I noticed this little gun shop / range. I stopped in, saw a WASR-10 hi-cap (AK-47 to the antis), checked it out, dickered on the price a bit, wrote a check, went through NICS and drove back to Nashville with it in the trunk of my car.

Man I love Tennessee.

M2 Carbine
July 9, 2004, 02:05 PM
This is a good lesson to all you folks that think you have some kind of protection because we have the Second Amendment.

The violation of our "rights" is so blatant and widespread we just accept it, not that we can do anything anyhow.


For the last 40 years I've said, If the Republicans ever get in control a lot of the illegal gun laws will be rolled back. These anti gun states will be put in their place.

Ya, right.

kwelz
July 9, 2004, 02:08 PM
I think I like the way I did it last week

1: Try to find a place to park around Keisler's
2: Walk in find the cute girl working that day and ask her is I can see Gun X, Y and A
3: Decide on Guns A and Y
4: Talk ask them to knock 100 bucks or so of the price and throw in free ammo.
5: Walk out of store 800 bucks Poorer but two guns happier.

GunGeek
July 9, 2004, 02:37 PM
Jeeze NYC is crazy, but from what you say even NJ is a nightmare... A FEW WEEKS??? I get bored waiting the 5 minutes it takes to call in the background check so I can take my pistols home the same day!

junyo
July 9, 2004, 02:43 PM
Meanwhile, eighty miles away in PA...

Yeah, guns in 30 minutes, open carry. And can shop for long guns across the line in tax-free Delaware.

mhdishere
July 9, 2004, 03:22 PM
The funny thing was when I lived in NYC we said "At least it's not Washington DC".

PAshooter
July 9, 2004, 07:03 PM
Hey CentralTexas:

I take a one day course and pay under $150 bucks and I have my concealed carry permit in the mail a couple of months later.

I took no course, paid $19 to the local Sheriff, and had my concealed carry permit a couple of weeks later. God, I love PA :D

But seriously folks, this just ain't right. We're all Americans... U.S. citizens, right? Why does the Constitution apply differently depending upon which state you happen to live in?

What part of "shall not infringe" do they not understand??? :cuss:

PlayTheAces
July 9, 2004, 08:16 PM
That NYC procedure is just plain mind boggling. What's the rest of the state like as far as purchasing guns?

I may never complain again, or at least not for a few weeks.

QuarterBoreGunner
July 9, 2004, 08:21 PM
And people slam Cali's gun laws... wow.

Standing Wolf
July 9, 2004, 08:48 PM
Life is much better in the United States.

fjolnirsson
July 9, 2004, 09:17 PM
mhdishere,
This is the first time in sooo long, but I actually feel a little better to be living in CA.
That sucks. A lot. Really.
The current set of gun laws here are as far as I will go. I can't imagine living in NJ, let alone NYC, and dealing with what you describe.
All I can say is, Run. Before they put up the barbed wire fence.

jefnvk
July 9, 2004, 09:26 PM
And I thought buying a handgun in MI was bad.. 10 min at the local police station for a background check/permit, go buy the gun within 10 days, drive back to police to make sure the gun ou bought is the gun you listed,a nd then have a permit printed. But man, 9 months for 1 gun?

BamBam-31
July 10, 2004, 01:58 AM
I get balmy weather here in Cali, too. :neener: :cool:

Seriously, that's pretty bad. Cali's bad, but that's just downright horrible. More power to those that jump through those hoops anyways to exercise their 2nd. Keep the faith!

Feanaro
July 10, 2004, 02:07 AM
I have trouble thinking about the current Federal laws without getting an eye twitch and a deep urge to hit something. Throw in the, thankfully, few bad laws in 'Bama and I feel like strangling a beaucrat(for Jesus and the American way, of course. ;)). How could you stand it?

Dbl0Kevin
July 10, 2004, 09:46 AM
Jersey is almost just as bad when you go to buy your FIRST gun. It took me 14....yes that's FOURTEEN....months to get my firearms ID card from my local police dept! Apparently the "FBI is backed up and not getting the fingerprints back" from what they told me. :rolleyes: Oh and for those of you who like to say police are super citizens.....that was AFTER I graduated the police academy and already had a full background check by the county prosecutor's office.

I have a friend that I graduated with who when he wanted to buy a backup gun he had to go to his OWN police dept that just hired him.....and GAVE him a gun to carry. They then gave him the permit application and he had to put down two references for them to contact!! Ummmm HELLO!?!?! This HAD to be the MOST mind boggling thing I've ever seen from this state! :banghead:

Slingster
July 10, 2004, 11:30 AM
From what I've heard, Hawaii's gun purchase requirements are similar to NYC's, requiring multiple trips to the PD and strict time limits on each phase of the process.

DMK
July 10, 2004, 11:46 AM
How ironic that the Statue of Liberty resides in NYC. You'd think that the sight of it would give the people a clue.

:banghead:

I'd suggest that France should just come and take it back, but they are even worse. :rolleyes:

DMK
July 10, 2004, 11:53 AM
I think "Statewide uniformity of local regulation (http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/Statutes/GeneralStatutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-409.40.html)" is one thing about North Carolina that keeps such nonsense from being adopted in it's cities. Every state should have such a law. At least the entire state can focus their battle for the 2nd amendment in one place and you don't get local ordanances to wear you down.
14-409.40. (http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/Statutes/GeneralStatutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-409.40.html): It is declared by the General Assembly that the regulation of firearms is properly an issue of general, statewide concern, and that the entire field of regulation of firearms is preempted from regulation by local governments except as provided by this section.

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