[priv8ter]

Went to the range yesterday with my new Ruger Black Hawk in .45 Colt, and...I wan't pleased.

All shots were on paper at 25 yards, so I guess you could say I had Minute-of-torso accuracy at 25 yards, but there was nothing that could be confused for a group...unless you are proud to measure groups in the 8-10 inch range.

As I cleaned the gun for another trip to the range tommorrow, I noticed that the adjustable rear sight is lose. I mean, it doesn't rattle if I shake the gun, but if I place my index finger on the rear sight, it is pretty easy to move around.

The only other adjustable sight pistol I have is a Ruger MK II, and on that, the rear sight is pretty stable. No real movement. So...as I said, this might be a silly question, but should that screw be tighted down prior to wasting another box of ammo trying to get my gun to group? And if so, is there a torque speck? On a little screw like that, it doesn't seem like a 'Star Torque' situation.

Thanks for any help!

greg

[Jim March]

Hence this:

http://bowenclassicarms.com/shop/default.asp?action=_top&category=3

Review:

http://www.sixgunner.com/backissues/taylor/bowen.htm

There's now an alternate version that's less likely to come unscrewed/unadjusted called the "rough country":

http://bowenclassicarms.com/shop/default.asp?action=_top&category=6

And Gary Reeder has been messing around with this issue too:

http://reedercustomguns.com/information/sight.htm

[critter]

I have a Bisley model of the same gun in the same caliber. It is a GREAT shooter and at that distance will make LITTLE groups, especially with hard cast, 300 gr bullets loaded over a lot of H110. If you are shooting SOFT lead bullets, they may not be grouping due to not holding in the rifleing. Hard cast or jacketed bullets SHOULD do MUCH better

The sights should not move around easily. The screw in the top is for elevation and the little one on the side if for windage. Neither will tighten a loose sight. The spring under the sight should be keeping it tight enough to not move MUCH while shooting.

Don't dispair of your gun yet. They are good guns and usually shoot quite well. Do some more investigation on the sights and on loads. If, indeed, the sight is loose (and you can't fix it easily) it might need a trip back to Ruger. They will make good on their stuff.

Good luck.

[JoeHatley]

www.millettsights.com makes a quality replacement rear sight for Blackhawks.

I've got one on a convertable model, to get extra adjustablity that is repeatable. www.midwayusa.com usually has them for a good price.

Good Luck...

Joe

[zeke]

Not a silly question at all, just had exact same problem with a new stainless Bisley in 45 LC. Almost all my blackhawk adjustables have some movement, but they kinda spring back to one side or the other. On this particualr Bisley, the rear sight can be moved much further to either side, and not "spring " back.
Yet one more thing to be checking on Rugers:(

Several years ago, put a Bowen adjustable on a Blackhawk, the difference it made was well worth the cost. It had repeatable windage and elevation adjustments, much better sight picture and much greater range of adjustability.

Another thing to check on Ruger sights is the elevation of the pin holes that are used to pin in the rear sight. Have one where the holes are at different elevations, changing windage as height was adjusted.

Also have an earlier (discontinued ?) Bowen adjustable on a MArkII.

While i like Ruger SA's alot, would be willing to pay a little extra for better quality control/better tolerances. Kinda like what Kimber originally did with their 45's.

[J Miller]

priv8ter,

I'm going to come at the problem from a different angle. I doubt that the loosness in your sight could account for an 8 to 10" group at 25 yards. For that to be the case the sight would have to be floppy loose.

Before spending money on sights do some diagnostic checking first.

Start with the chamber throats. Slug them, or have them slugged and measure the slugs with a micometer.
If the throats are undersized, or if they vary from chamber to chamber, the groups will suffer badly.
Ruger .45 Colt cylinders are notorious for haveing undersized and inconsistant throats. My last two did.

After that, check the forcing cone. An improperly cut forcing cone can affect accuracy.

Then check the muzzel crown. An off center or uneven crown will play havoc with accuracy.

If the chamber throats are undersized, they can be easily dealt with. There are a number of gunsmiths that perform this service, and at least two people who are forum members that do it as well.
Brownells even sells reamers to do the job, but it's not really cost effective unless your going to do a bunch of them.

Here are the two forum members that I am talking about :
The .45 Throatdoctor http://45throatdoctor.com/ . His site is full of usefull information even if this is not your problem. He did my last cylinder and it did improve both accuracy and reduce the leading problem I had.
And the http://www.cylindersmith.com/ . I have read many good reports about his work on several forums.

Ruger rear sights do leave a lot to be desired, so reguardless of the chamber throat condition, purchasing a better sight can't hurt.

Joe

[priv8ter]

Well, thanks for all the advice so far.

I went back to the range with it yesterday, and same results. Of course, that was also using the same loads...250gr Ultramax Cowboy loads.

My accuracy was about the same...on paper at 25 yards, but all over the place. :confused:

In the big picture, this doesn't bother me too much...I bought the gun because I think I would like to get into CAS, and on paper at 25 yards, should be good enough for Cowboy Competitions, where most shots are closer than that.

The reason I got a .45 Colt instead of a .357(other than just a plain desire for a new caliber) is had dreams of being a cheap skate, and why not get a Cowboy Gun I could also use for Handgun Hunting someday. And, obviously, 'All over the place at 25 yards' is not sufficient accuracy for handgun hunting.

So...I guess what I will do now is try to track down some hardcast loads and see if they group better. I did see a guy at the range yesterday, who had bought after-market sights for his two Blackhawks...they changed the gun from adjustable sights to fixed sights. may just do something like that anyway. I liked them better than my stock sights.

Another question would be then...if it a problem with soft-lead load not stabilizing, would a Winchester Silver-Tip maybe stabilize better? I'm just asking because no local store(even Sportsman's Warehouse) has hardcast loads for .45 Colt, but they do have Winchester Silver-Tips I could
experiment with.

If changing loads doesn't work, then I guess I may have to follow Mr. Miller's advise...but then, I would actually have to learn something about my guns :uhoh: Throat mesurments? I used to rope and choke 17" in the navy...does that count?

Thanks for all the info so far!

greg

[slabsides]

A rear sight that moves in its channel in the frame can account for the inaccuracy you describe. Many Ruger rear sights have front extensions (shanks) that are smaller than they should be, and with a slightly loose front pin or oversize shank hole, can cause considerable movement. Enough to produce 8 inch groups? Could be. Could be undersized chamber mouths, common in BH .45's. Could be the ammunition too. And how good are you with other guns?
Fix for a sloppy sight: unscrew and remove the elevation screw (put parts in a plastic bag to keep them together.) Pivot the sight up on its crosspin, and lift out the elevation spring. Note that it fits in a recess, and must be replaced that way. Drive out the cross pin. If it's really loose, locate a numbered drill that's a bit larger and cut it (Dremel cutoff tool) to use as a replacement. Turn the sight body over, and with a center punch, put a couple of shallow dimples right on the bottom edge of the shank, on each side. This will make small protrusions, in effect widening the body of the sight invisibly. Try to make them even. Then test to see if the sight body will go back into its seat. If you've been too enthusiastic with the punch, take a few file strokes to the sides where they rub. Replace everything in reverse. Voila'! you're a gunsmith! I've done this to six of my eight Rugers, helping accuracy every time.