[twoblink]

I know, I know, but Skunk and I are talking about WWIII happening in our backyards, and I've realized that my eyesight out of iron sights is about 400 yards, I've done 500 yards before, but not easily...

I hate scopes, if they are zeroed well, great, but most aren't and most don't stay zeroed well..

So I've opted to go iron sights for everything..

BUT, just in case WWIII happens, and I need to start enlarging my circle of protection out to about 1000 yards, any rifle recommendations?

Bolt action of course; my top 3 picks are:

Weatherby,
Sig Blaser
Sako

I will still standarize on the 308 as all my other rifles are..

So of the 3, give me some feed back!

[Tamara]

Iron sights on a 1000-yd gun? :confused:

[Kahr carrier]

Sig Blaser and a nice Leupold . Open sights and a 1000 yards you must have good eyes.:)

[Schuey2002]

Iron sights on a 1000-yd gun?
Maybe he's Superman..:neener:

[twoblink]

No... I would definitely have to go glass past 500 yards... My eyesight won't do past 500 yards...

[echo3mike]

Palma (http://www.uspalma.com/pictures_1.htm) shooters use micrometer sights for 1k using a .308 155gr bullet. Many of the better sights can be modified for shooters with vision issues.

I"m a little curious about your ..most (scopes) aren't (zeroed well) and don't stay zeroed well statement. I've used a number of scopes from a $50 Bushnell , Redfield, Leupold and a U.S. Optics (http://www.usoptics.com) ST-10. Never had a bit of trouble zeroing them or having them maintain a zero.

Granted, there are issues that can affect the E/W adjustments: using ammo different from the stuff used to zero the scope, environmental and meteorlogical conditions and normal wear and tear to name a few. But unless the scope is a real POS, it should be rugged enough to hold it's zero if all the other factors are accounted for.

Oh..guess I should answer the question...if these were the only options, I'ld go with the Sig... has the reputation of being a great shooter (and darn sexy to boot). Sako's are pretty hot too, from what I've heard. 'Course, FWIW, I'ld strongly suggest going with a reliable Rem 700 / Win 70 rifle and a mid to high end scope. You'ld have a great shooter and have money left over for ammo and maybe a trip to Badlands or Storm Mountain to learn how to shoot the thing, since it's better to be a skilled Rifleman with a decent stick than a 200yd "Master" with an expensive tent-pole.

My 2 cents...
S.

[Art Eatman]

I've always sorta figured that if it's inside of 500 yards, I own it. If it's at 1,000 yards, I'd just as soon ignore it.

1,000 yards? They're either not coming my way, or they are coming my way. If the latter case, sooner or later they'll be within proper distance for social conversation...It's one thing to shoot at a stationary target, but it's a whole 'nother universe to shoot something that's moving.

My advice is to get a .22 and go rabbit hunting. A rabbit doesn't know where he's going next, either. This lets you work up to hitting a running deer. After that, life is easier.

Scopes? Well, some are brighter than others, but I've yet to have one lose its zero from "just sittin'". For that matter, even the bangs and bumps from riding in a 4WD truck over rough jeep trails haven't hurt anything. And that's several brands, from Tasco to Leupold.

:D, Art

[Steve Smith]

Iron sights on a 1000-yd gun?

Maybe he's Superman



Nope. Experienced and knowlegable Highpower and Palma shooters can do this easily even in inclement weather. Of course, they are stationary targets. Moving ones, as Art said, increase the difficulty exponentially.

But.

The riflescope ads lower light capability and more ruggedness than the precision sights found on most 1K yard guns. Of course, I know a few guys who are VERY dealdy with the rear aperture and front post of a standard AR...out to 1K.

Art's statements often ring truest. What he said deserves a lot of thought. To address the actual question, though, here's a thought...Having a scope and rifle that will shoot well at 1K is one thing, and having the ability to use them is another. It takes a good deal of experience to be able to know how to make an accurate hit at that range. If you don't connect, you'll just attract attention. Ability cannot be purchased. I'd suggest you get a setup you like and spend a lot of time learning to use it at 600 and less. Forget about what's beyond.

[LevelHead]

Well I love my Sako 75 7mm Rem Mag (http://www.gad.net/Shooting/Range/02-10-17/PA171485_650.jpg). Accurate as Hell, smooth as silk and looks great to boot.

For a fun project that can be accurate as Hell, be smooth as whatever you want it to be and look great too, build your own (http://www.gad.net/Shooting/LevelHead/PSS/index.html).

[twoblink]

Art, I've tried rabbits, they are HARD.. you are right, they themselves don't know where they are going next, and so the unpredictability applies to them also..

My friend up in San Fran and his buddies up there have a mini M1A 500/1000 competition, and that's Iron Sights. So I know it's possible..

I'm leaning towards if it's not within 500 yards, I'll ignore it, but I have to keep all scenerios open.. :scrutiny:

BTW Art, I need a big favor. Skunk says his rifle shooting SUCKS; and I keep telling him to buy a .22LR and he will improve by leaps and bounds and he refuses too... Time for you to preach the joys of .22's to him!

I believe every man and woman should own at least 1 .22 in every action he/she owns...

[uglymofo]

Two,

Where do your friends go to get their mini M1A work done? How long is the actual course?

I'd have to disagree with the 'stay within 500yd' (if I may be allowed to paraphrase). On my few attempts past 100yd, I went to Sacto and shot at 2, 3, 4, 500M silhouettes, then 100 to 1000yd in hundred yard increments, in winds varying from zero to 20 or 25mph. It was definitely a challenge, especially >700yd, but with a good spotter (and I had an excellent spotter/coach), it's no tougher than anything else (like learning to ride a bike, or driving a car--I don't mean it's no tougher than shooting at ~500yd), and quite a learning experience. The best part is I learned "how" to spot--that is, what to look for, what a spotter's responsible for, the vernacular, and how to read wind (though I'm not very good at it yet, I'm never off the paper, and usually in the black--I know it's a real big black, but as a novice at LR, I'm real pleased with that). Granted all these challenges can be had at ~500yd; but the mirage and wind are much harder to dope at >~700yd.

I'd agree with the idea of at least experimenting with 22LR between 100 - 200yd just to practice calling, hold, trigger work, scope adjustment, etc. It's a real cheap way to discover one's faults or learn more correct concepts.

addendum: I reread the question and some of the replies; I had one hell of a coach on my LR outings. By fluke I met him over the internet and we met up in Sacto. He's an instructor at Badlands, so my experience is definitely not the norm for a novice rifleman (which I am, too). I learned more in my trips (about 12 hr all together) to the 1000yd line than I did in all my shooting sessions with my local long-time club members (no offense to them; they just weren't professional shooting teachers). 500 is probably a good limit if one doesn't have the luxury I had.

[Frohickey]

Rem 700 with a good scope. Since you and Skunky are trying to out-tactical each other, I suggest one of those mil-dot reticle scopes with external windage and elevation adjustments, perhaps in the 1/2 MOA per click or larger.

I would also suggest a drag bag with the 700, which doubles as a gun mat. Of course, a ghillie suit is a given. :D

If you insist on shooting 1000 yards with only iron sights, you have to have bionic eyes, or large targets... or both. This ---> :scrutiny: will be you on the firing line as you try to see where your target is at.

Leupold has those LPS scopes, with the illuminated reticles. For low light conditions.

Maybe what Skunky needs is some dry-fire exercises with the rifle. Coach him and put a penny, balanced on the barrel of the rifle. See if he can press the trigger without the penny falling off.

[twoblink]

I'm not sure where my friend shoots, I just know he lives up in SF.. He's an old high school buddy of mine, and he told me about it, and so at least I know it's possible. He was bragging his first time out, he got 1 round on the paper at 1000 yards! I thought that was impressive, for iron sights... He said, the spotter is more important then you are.. and there are tips and tricks..

I don't know though, I don't think I can hit much iron sights at 1000, it's not a confidence issue, it's an eyesight issue..

But he says if you find a good coach, they teach you to use other "optical aids" to find your target..

Skunky needs someone to go rifle shooting with him.. Ruger 10/22's are VERY tactical, don't you see SWAT using them?

I'm not tactical, that's Skunk. Me, I'm Logistical...

I'm Practical/Logistical/Tactical, in that order..

Skunk is Tactical/Tactical/Tactical, in that order...:D

I might have to yield to the dark side and buy a scope for a rifle I intend for 1000 yards... Unless I find a really good iron sight coach :banghead: