Yet ANOTHER urgent request for info for the Calif Gov's office!!!


PDA






Jim March
August 3, 2004, 08:43 PM
OK, this time, I need to know if your state has a crazy level of "home gun storage if there's kids around laws". Reply ONLY if your state has such, and briefly describe them if you know anything.

In particular: do any specify felonies if a kid gets a gun? Felonies if a kid hurts somebody?

I'll be madly googling for this stuff later tonight but some pointers on which states to look for for this crapola would help me a lot.

This is in regard California SB1140, a bill to increase child-access penalties yet again and blur the line between what's a "loaded gun" and what isn't - if the ammo is stored "in proximity" to the gun, it's "loaded" :rolleyes:. Another Jack Scott special. Governor's staff is asking how common this stuff is and to what extent.

THANKS!

If you enjoyed reading about "Yet ANOTHER urgent request for info for the Calif Gov's office!!!" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
dj53
August 3, 2004, 09:11 PM
From Florida Statutes Title XLVI 790.174 (1):

"(1) A person who stores or leaves, on a premise under his or her control, a loaded firearm, as defined in s. 790.001, and who knows or reasonably should know that a minor is likely to gain access to the firearm without the lawful permission of the minor's parent or the person having charge of the minor, or without the supervision required by law, shall keep the firearm in a securely locked box or container or in a location which a reasonable person would believe to be secure or shall secure it with a trigger lock, except when the person is carrying the firearm on his or her body or within such close proximity thereto that he or she can retrieve and use it as easily and quickly as if he or she carried it on his or her body.

This subsection does not apply if the minor obtains the firearm as a result of an unlawful entry by any person. "


This also means if the firearm is stored unloaded and the minor loads the weapon, the gun owner is not responsible.

cosmos7
August 3, 2004, 09:22 PM
I'll be madly googling for this stuff later tonight but some pointers on which states to look for for this crapola would help me a lot.
Although it's an anti site, I use the Firearms Law Center (http://www.firearmslawcenter.com) to point me in the right direction whenever I'm trying to answer questions.

CleverNickname
August 3, 2004, 09:57 PM
Here's Texas' law:

PC §46.13. MAKING A FIREARM ACCESSIBLE TO A CHILD.
(a) In this section:
(1) "Child" means a person younger than 17 years of age.
(2) "Readily dischargeable firearm" means a firearm that is
loaded with ammunition, whether or not a round is in the chamber.
(3) "Secure" means to take steps that a reasonable person would
take to prevent the access to a readily dischargeable firearm by a
child, including but not limited to placing a firearm in a locked container
or temporarily rendering the firearm inoperable by a trigger lock or
other means
(b) A person commits an offense if a child gains access to a readily
dischargeable firearm and the person with criminal negligence:
(1) failed to secure the firearm; or
(2) left the firearm in a place to which the person knew or should
have known the child would gain access.
(c) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution under this section that
the child's access to the firearm:
(1) was supervised by a person older than 18 years of age and
was for hunting, sporting, or other lawful purposes;
(2) consisted of lawful defense by the child of people or property;
(3) was gained by entering property in violation of this code; or
(4) occurred during a time when the actor was engaged in an agricultural
enterprise.
(d) Except as provided by Subsection (e), an offense under this
section is a Class C misdemeanor.
(e) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor if the
child discharges the firearm and causes death or serious bodily injury
to himself or another person.
(f) A peace officer or other person may not arrest the actor before
the seventh day after the date on which the offense is committed if:
(1) the actor is a member of the family, as defined by Section
71.003, Family Code, of the child who discharged the firearm; and
(2) the child in discharging the firearm caused the death of or serious
injury to the child.
(g) A dealer of firearms shall post in a conspicuous position on the
premises where the dealer conducts business a sign that contains the
following warning in block letters not less than one inch in height:
"IT IS UNLAWFUL TO STORE, TRANSPORT, OR ABANDON AN
UNSECURED FIREARM IN A PLACE WHERE CHILDREN ARE
LIKELY TO BE AND CAN OBTAIN ACCESS TO THE FIREARM."

RAY WOODROW 3RD
August 3, 2004, 10:25 PM
Here is my state's law:

Unless allowed under the lawful use of firearms by minors exemptions listed in the POSSESSION section, it is unlawful to leave a loaded firearm within reach or easy access of a person under 16. This provision does not apply to a firearm stored in a securely locked box or container; or in a location which a reasonable person would believe to be secure; or securely locked with a trigger lock; or under circumstances where a minor obtained a firearm as a result of an unlawful entry by person.

Wholesale and retail dealers of firearms must conspicuously post at each purchase counter, printed in block letters not less than one inch in height a warning that it is a criminal offense to leave a loaded gun within access of a minor (you also have to sign a copy of the above when purchasing firearms through an FFL).


New Jersey does not have felonies. They have degrees
(1st, 2nd, 34d, and 4th degree crimes.)

Harry Tuttle
August 3, 2004, 10:44 PM
as y'all are prolly aware
Maryland is all about child protection gun laws



(c) Prohibited. A person may not store or leave a loaded firearm in a location where the person knew or should have known that an unsupervised child would gain access to the firearm. (d) Penalty. A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor and on conviction is subject to a fine not exceeding $1,000. (e) Effect of violation. (1) A violation of this section may not: (i) Be considered evidence of negligence; (ii) Be considered evidence of contributory negligence; (iii) Limit liability of a party or an insurer; or (iv) Diminish recovery for damages arising out of the ownership, maintenance, or operation of a firearm or ammunition. (2) A party, witness, or lawyer may not refer to a violation of this section during a trial of a civil action that involves property damage, personal injury, or death.

heres the Montgomery MD sub code

57-7. Access to guns by minors.
(a) A person must not give, sell, rent, lend, or otherwise transfer any rifle or shotgun or any ammunition or major component for these guns in the County to a minor. This subsection does not apply when the transferor is at least 18 years old and is the parent, guardian, or instructor of the minor, or in connection with a regularly conducted or supervised program of marksmanship or marksmanship training.
(b) An owner, employee, or agent of a gun shop must not allow a minor to, and a minor must not, enter the gun shop unless the minor is accompanied by a parent or other legal guardian at all times when the minor is in the gun shop.
(c) This section must be construed as broadly as possible within the limits of State law to protect minors.

57-8. Child safety handgun devices and handguns.
(a) Findings. ...
(b) Child safety handgun device.
(1) A firearm dealer who sells, leases, or otherwise transfers a handgun in the County must provide to the recipient of the handgun a child safety handgun device for the handgun at the time of the transfer. The dealer may charge for the child safety handgun device.
(2) A transferor who would be a firearm dealer if the transfer occurred in the State) after October 8, 1997 must obtain a child safety handgun device for the handgun: (A) at the time of a transfer in the County; or
(B) before entering the County with the handgun if the transfer occurred outside the County and the transferee resides in the County.
(c) Notices.
(1) A firearm dealer who sells, leases, or otherwise transfers a handgun must post conspicuously in the dealer’s place of business a notice of:
(A) the requirement in subsection (b) for a child safety handgun device; and
(B) the prohibition in State law of storing or leaving a loaded firearm in a location where an unsupervised child can gain access to the firearm.
(2) If the firearm dealer transferring a handgun does not maintain a place of business in a commercial establishment, the dealer must provide the notices required by paragraph (1) in writing when transferring the handgun.
(d) Enforcement.
The Department of Health and Human Services and any other department designated by the County Executive enforces this section.
(f) Regulations. The Executive may adopt regulations under method (2) to implement this Section.

>>>>>>>
Carole Price's son was shot when he and some buddies broke into a renters room in a townhouse. Carole went on to lead MAHA and sue Ruger...

http://www.mcrkba.org/PriceCase.html

Del. Donald Murphy / (R) Baltimore County: "I can understand the victim's parents are looking for someone to blame other than themselves and it's sad, but in many cases, that is who is to blame. From here on out, parents need to take responsibility for where their kids are and what they do."

geekWithA.45
August 3, 2004, 11:01 PM
This was compiled by the Soros foundation.

www.soros.org/initiatives/justice/articles_publications/ publications/gun_report_20000401/GunReport_Chart2.pdf

www.soros.org/initiatives/justice/articles_publications/ publications/gun_report_20000401/GunReport_Chart1.pdf

Sometimes, the links don't work, and there's no external references. One might think that they're trying to hide something, yes?

geekWithA.45
August 3, 2004, 11:18 PM
Oh, yeah, another thought...you know about the Merced pitchfork murder, right? JPFO's Innocents Betrayed covered that one nicely.

Summary for those of you who don't know:

Maniac kills kids with a pitchfork. Gun competent girl present in the house unable to access her firearm due to safe storage laws.

http://johnrlott.tripod.com/postsbyday/5-28-03.html

Jim March
August 4, 2004, 01:02 AM
Yes, we know about the pitchfork case :(.

THANK YOU for the other references. From the brief scan I've done so far, it appears California's *current* laws on the subject are fairly "par for the course", and almost identical to FL fr'instance.

I'll be digging into the links provided in a bit. I'll be able to show you how I phrase my final report to the staff preparing the report Arnold will read tonight.

Zach S
August 4, 2004, 08:45 AM
Any person who resides in the same premises as a minor, who owns or possesses a firearm, and stores or leaves that firearm in a condition that the firearm can be discharged and in a manner that the person knew or should have known that an unsupervised minor would be able to gain access to the firearm, is guilty of a misdemeanor if such minor gains access to the firearm without the lawful permission of the minor's parents or a person having charge of the minor, and the minor in turn possesses that weapon unlawfully on any campus or educational property in North Carolina; exhibits the weapon in a public place in a careless, angry, or threatening manner; causes personal injury or death with the weapon not in self defense; or uses the weapon in the commission of a crime. A minor is defined in this law as anyone under the age of 18 who is not emancipated.

This law goes on to provide that it shall not prohibit a person from carrying a firearm on his or her body or placed in such close proximity that it can be used as easily and quickly as if carried on the body. This provision of the law should not be interpreted however to modify the previously recited law on carrying concealed weapons in North Carolina. Additionally, this law does not apply if the minor obtained the weapon as a result of an unlawful entry by any person.

A written copy of this firearms storage law, found in G.S. 14-315.1, is required to be delivered by the transferor in any retail commercial sale or transfer of a firearm to the purchaser or transferee of such weapon. All such transferrers should take appropriate steps to have a verbatim copy of this law available at the time of any transfer of a weapon.

If you enjoyed reading about "Yet ANOTHER urgent request for info for the Calif Gov's office!!!" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!