[Skunkabilly]

What long gun load would yield the least penetration, i.e. not go through a wall, not compromising reliability?

Lightest .223 (55 gr???) with ballistic tip?

[GooseGestapo]

.22lr with shot capsule.
Why the question ????????????????

[DMK]

Home defense? It's a tradeoff. Do you want to bet your life on something that even can't shoot through sheetrock?

A shotgun with light birdshot is probably the best compromise. Yea, up close it will blow right through sheetrock, but those light little pellets lose velocity awfully quick.

Maybe an AR or AK/SKS with Glasers, who knows. I don't know anybody who can afford to buy those rounds *and* shoot them off.

Hey Skunk, you should know all this. Get some wood and sheetrock and try for yourself. Haven't you been taking notes?

[Skunkabilly]

Why the question ????????????????

Mr/Mrs Gestapo, home defense in cheaply built suburban apartment complex.

[Oleg Volk]

Get low down and shoot up. Doesn't matter what you load up them, though I'd be in favor of ball or AP.

[Skunkabilly]

Oleg, that makes sense...I thought about that however my apt is on a landing and my neighbors on a half set of stairs up :(

[Haycreek]

Winchester Ranger 45 grain fragible in 5.56

[DMK]

Get low down and shoot upI thought about that however my apt is on a landing and my neighbors on a half set of stairs up Yea, that and the laws of physics that state what comes up must come down. :what:

I don't think it matters if it's next door or two miles away, you're still responsible for that round if it kills somebody.

[gun-fucious]

to drop a human you need ~13 inches of penetration

[Kobun]

Why be concerned about penetration through walls?
Just hit your intended target with all rounds fired! ;)

I would guess (but havn't tested) that several of the rounds police use, like the Hornady TAP will have adequate results when it comes to not penetrating the "average" home wall.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?s=&postid=43854

[telewinz]

Get the 40 grain 22 sp. They are intended for Hornet velocity.

[benEzra]

I'd say Federal 40-gr JHP (@3600 or 3800 fps, IIRC). Very lightweight bullet that breaks up on light cover, but used by many SWAT teams for years with good performance. Not a cover-defeating round, but if you wanted wall penetration you'd use something else.

(Flame suit on . . .) My personal opinion would be that in an apartment-defense situation you probably don't need 13" of penetration. (The heart is only 2-3 inches behind the sternum, anyway; 13" would be an exit on most people.) I can see why LEO's might want something with deeper penetration for general use (or sniper shots), but defending an apartment bedroom would be less demanding in the penetration department. I know there are variety of opinions on this, though.

bE

[gun-fucious]

ideally a 4 inch penetration is sufficient,
however sometimes arms and other items get between the barrel and the dropzone

[twoblink]

.223's penetrate less then 9mm's or .45's through walls (surprisingly).

Low penetration?

Try a shotgun with birdshot :D

[Art Eatman]

20-gauge with #9 Skeet. Devastating at in-house distances. Little energy left after impacting sheetrock or thin panelling.

As a buddy of mine found out, it's survivable at around 25 yards. :D (Okay, okay: She sez, "You let that parrot out of the house and I'll shoot you!" Well, he did and she did. She then threw down the shotgun, ran to him and said, "Oh, my God! What have I done?" He sez, "You shot me, you stupid (bleep/bleep/bleep)!")

:D, Art

[Kobun]

Art:
What kind of people do you hang out with??? :D
That must be one of the craziest things I've ever heard.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?s=&postid=43854

[Art Eatman]

Kobun, I apparently have a knack for finding people who are best described as "Nutzoidal".

Remember the line from one of the Mountain Man movies (Redford?) where a couple of guys are talking about a friend who wintered in a cave with a mountain lion? "That lion never did get used to him." Well, I know a lot of folks like that...

That's possibly why I've felt so at-home at TFL and THR.

:D, Art

[Steve Smith]

Art, we are ALL at home here. THR...home for wayward "nutzoidal" folks.

[sm]

Well "long gun" huh?

I too live in an apt, top floor. I have taken the time to shoot various building materials...of course I've shot various materials like car doors , windshields...etc.

Shotgun with #6's come to mind. Shoot a rabid 80# dog inside an old 'shotgun shack' sometime on an old farm...educational.

Agree shot placement is critical to the "stop and immediate threat", being responsible for each round, I Agree with Oleg if can- shoot upwards. I do however have my apt arranged (laugh) with furnishings in such a manner where I know my "fire lanes".

Its just the BG won't care about my fire lanes , so I hope I shoot first and stop, and if BG misses-I hope he hits a pc of furnishing, (or my neighbors aren't home). BTW I use my CCW's-- 45ACP or 9mm--here in apt, no long guns kept here. Works for me due to set up of complex and grounds.

I did set mom up with a shotgun, 20 ga with Buckshot, being in a house...again funiture helps...priority is for her to hit BG and be safe...we can always get another TV...etc.

[Oleg Volk]

Due to the issues of maneuver, availability of both hands, etc., I'd want an autoloader instead of a pump or another manually worked action for indoors...ideally.

If firing up, you are increasing the likelyhood of the round hitting any kind of obstacle at an angle and destabilizing enough to be non-lethal at extended ranges (next apt).

Seems to me we are overcomplicating the situation. Either you get your hands on a suitable weapon in time (preferably a rifle with a good cartridge [if expecting armored goblins] or shotgun or a serious pistol) or you won't. If you do, I really don't think that M1 carbine of a 30-30 lever action or an AR10 or whatever you may have would make a big deal of difference. You shoot and hit the goblin, you'll keep it from doing the same to you long enough to repeat performance. You don't hit right away, you get worked over in turn. In short, living to see the bottom of your magazine would represent a real stroke of luck in case you are molested by professionals. Being awake for the fight and near any gun would mean a lot more than wondering is 40gr SP beats a 55gr FMJ. Ditto for sights: indoors, point and press. If anything, my bias would be for things which go through sheetrock and whoever is behind it. Place would look swiss-cheesed in any case, win or lose.

[gk1]

Skunk, you should combine the ideas from your various recent posts:

Stop buying toys, move to a place with reasonable housing prices, and buy a house. Anything left can be spent on training or ammo, and you'll have solved several of the "problems" you've had recently. ;)

If you don't like that advice, then I suggest the shotgun with birdshot as a distant second.

George

[Farmed Ship]

Steve Smith saith:

Art, we are ALL at home here. THR...home for wayward "nutzoidal" folks.

=================================
This comment saddens me.
Has it come to this, that we are now internalizing
the hoplohobs' ignorant deranged view of us?
We are all perfectly normal, with intelligence level noticeably above average, creative and productive members of the society, with a keen aprreciation of history and the price and blessings of freedom.
It's the anti-gunners and neutral-gunners who are natzizoids.
Let's not dirty ourselves.

FS