Dont Boycott Ebay!!


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Wildalaska
August 4, 2004, 06:30 PM
There was a thread going on about ebay no longer selling "assault rifle parts", so there should be a boycott, and becasue we are power sellers on ebay, I made a comment about that to our rep..

I was pretty impressed today by the fact that a higher executive of ebay called me today to discuss the mag ban and "assault rifle parts" controversey.

Heres the bottom line...Ebay is a 30 Billion dollar a year company. The hunting and fishing divisions constitute about 30 million of that. Ebay is also a California company, as such, they have the d*ckheads that ruin the California AGs office breathing down their neck....and even worse....

California lawyereze wise they FACILITATE the sale of a HI CAP mag to a person who uses it to shoot mexican kiddies on the schoolyard, who is some enterprising shyster gonna chase? Adolf the white power freak OR SOME 30 BILLION DOLLAR COMAPNY, hooo boy, payday for Dewey Cheatam and Howe..

And yes to anticipate, they facilitate the sales of lots of stuff that can kill, BUT, the stuff we want to see sold is banned in Californ-i-a! See the diff...

Bottom line, they are losing a few points of their total biz for insurance from legal prob;ems..

Rather than waste efforts with a boycott, we should be working to ensure that companies are able to sell whatevcer they want without fear of reprisal. Tort reform, liability protection...

And No Kerry in 2004

WildlettheflamesbeginAlaska

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Hemicuda
August 4, 2004, 06:35 PM
I am bidding on some things on Ebay as we speak... I will continue to do so, being that it is not TOTALLY their fault, but they COULD move the headquarters to a more sensable state...

Foreign Devil
August 4, 2004, 06:39 PM
My impression is: I don't think the ebay corporate leadership is anti-gun or anything. They just can't keep up with all the state gun laws, so they ban anything that is illegal in any state. Hi cap mags, "assault weapon" parts, etc.

Wildalaska
August 4, 2004, 06:44 PM
The Move....thats what I mentioned to them...but thats probably unrealistic at this point...

WildtaxeswouldbeabetterreasonAlaska

SUE ROVR
August 4, 2004, 06:46 PM
They need to make like every self respecting company and incorporate in Delaware.

Telperion
August 4, 2004, 06:50 PM
Dunno Wild, you got the law degree, so tell me: has a tort been committed in California or the United States if ebay facilitates the sale of a 30 rd mag between a guy in Alaska and Arizona, if the mag is not imported into California like state law requires (and then some guy uses it to do bad things)?

pipdoesnotunderstandjurisdictionsqueak

GunGoBoom
August 4, 2004, 06:56 PM
If anyone can afford to attempt to be un-PC, as we need them to be, it's a company with that kind of sales/profit. If we don't boycott the folks that bow down to PC pressure, as they do, then who should be boycott? There are better reasons to boycott, to be sure, but this is a reasonable one as well - just like BassPros with run ranges not allowing EBRs - because they bow down to political pressure and/or extremely farfetched legal liability scenarios (or at least give this as lip service more likely), this sensitizes people to being more likely to freak out when they see someone who owns/bears one of those less and less frequently seen EBRs; this in turns makes the average fencesitter/sheeple vote FOR people who vote FOR gun bans of those scary guns; this in turn thus erodes our rights.Sounds like the brown-nosing he did to you really worked a number on your ability to reason, WildmakingexcusesforPCantigunoutfitsAlaska.

Standing Wolf
August 4, 2004, 06:58 PM
California lawyereze wise they FACILITATE the sale of a HI CAP mag to a person who uses it to shoot mexican kiddies on the schoolyard, who is some enterprising shyster gonna chase? Adolf the white power freak OR SOME 30 BILLION DOLLAR COMAPNY...

People who are afraid to exercise their civil rights don't still have them.

carpettbaggerr
August 4, 2004, 07:40 PM
30 billion can buy a lot of lawyers. Are they "working to ensure that companies are able to sell whatevcer they want without fear of reprisal. Tort reform, liability protection..."?

Chris Rhines
August 4, 2004, 07:49 PM
There are plenty of other reasons to avoid EBay, starting with their disgusting excuse for a privacy policy.

- Chris

larryw
August 4, 2004, 09:40 PM
Has a tort been committed if some dingbat buys HOT coffee and burns herself when she pours it onto her lap? Provided the seller has deep pockets, juries nationwide seem to think so.

rock jock
August 4, 2004, 09:46 PM
On the contrary, I have been using eBay more frequently in the past few months. I just bought a Palm Pilot and a golf club recently.

jefnvk
August 4, 2004, 09:46 PM
Kinda related, here is a note I got back from Paypal a while back on thier ban on some firearm related things:

Dear xxxxxxxxxxxxx:

Thank you for contacting PayPal. We apologize for the delay in
responding to your service request.

PayPal has taken the stance that we do not want to be used for the sale
of firearms.

You may not use PayPal to sell any firearm manufactured after 1898.
Certain related items and high-capacity ammunition magazines are also
prohibited.

To view more details regarding the Acceptable Use Policy regarding
Firearms,Ammunition, Replicas and Militaria please click this link:

https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=p/gen/ua/use/index_frame-outside&
ed=firearms

If you have any further questions, please e-mail aup@paypal.com.

Sincerely,
PayPal Compliance Department
PayPal, an Ebay Company

jefnvk
August 4, 2004, 09:48 PM
Take that how you want, but when a company doesn't want to be involved, there is some driving force behind it. And I doubt that its fear of being sued. Aren;t auctioneers considered just a service of selling a gun, kinda like a message board, if they don't actually take posession.

larryw
August 4, 2004, 09:59 PM
Yeah Jeff, that's just a subtle nuance that ambulance chasers live for. Seller, facilitator, disinterested third party? Whoever has the money is the target...

CentralTexas
August 4, 2004, 10:46 PM
Why would they call you WIld instead of the NRA etc? Why not a local call to a gunshop? DOn't you find that odd?

The rest I just see as their excuses. The female CEO has made comments and thay have donated money to causes that don't help gun owners from what I understand.

As far as insurance, They make far more $$$ than Gunbroker etc. and they are in business. Recent lawsuits aren't holding gunshops liable if they follow the law either. They sell knives, chemical, beartraps, bogus drug and health aids. All sorts of other "liability" issue stuff on their pages. I think they have become aware of the negative press and are trying spin control....

CT

rick_reno
August 4, 2004, 10:58 PM
I suppose based on that logic the shyster lawyer should chase after Intel - Ebay uses Intel processors in their server banks - and they've got much deeper pockets than Ebay - and without the processor facilitating that transaction it couldn't have taken place.
What is the breakdown on Ebay on hunting and fishing if you break them out? They're unlikely to get sued over a lure - but much more likely to get nailed on something sold on the hunting side of the business. I really doubt firearms related items constitute enough of the bottom line that Ebay will bend at all on allowing certain "objectionable" items to be listed.
Did you have an opportunity to discuss their sister company - Paypal - with them? I'd like to hear their excuses regarding this.
I personally don't boycott them, but I will go out of my way to buy things elsewhere. There are gun auction sites that are friendly to us, you can wrap Ebay's BS up any way you want - but the bottom line is they are not friendly.

Wildalaska
August 5, 2004, 01:59 AM
A few notes...

Did you have an opportunity to discuss their sister company - Paypal - with them? I'd like to hear their excuses regarding this.

I did not discuss pay pal...my feelings on them reach deeper than any antigun animus and we wont use them (and tell everyoner who asks why)...

Dunno Wild, you got the law degree, so tell me: has a tort been committed in California or the United States if ebay facilitates the sale of a 30 rd mag between a guy in Alaska and Arizona, if the mag is not imported into California like state law requires (and then some guy uses it to do bad things)?

What ebay si concerned about is not what happens betweeen A and B in Arizona and Alaska, but what could happen if a high cap ends up in Cali.....

Sounds like the brown-nosing he did to you really worked a number on your ability to reason,

Golly mr GunGoesBoom Id love to respond to the rest of your post but I cant understand it...then again since I dont have, in your opinion, the ability to reason I think Ill ignore it...

Are they "working to ensure that companies are able to sell whatevcer they want without fear of reprisal. Tort reform, liability protection..."?

They dont have to....bottom line is AR15 parts just dont bring enough money vis a vis beanie baby parts for them to make the effort...

However if WE make the effort....

And I doubt that its fear of being sued.

Bet all the gun comapnies would have said that 10 years ago....

Why would they call you WIld instead of the NRA etc? Why not a local call to a gunshop? DOn't you find that odd?

Nope becasue I raised the issue and said I would be happy to discuss it with them.....maybe no one else has offered in a reasonable manner

I really doubt firearms related items constitute enough of the bottom line that Ebay will bend at all on allowing certain "objectionable" items to be listed.

And thats how it is.......no matter what the CEO says and does, its the bean counters that control

WildresipsaloquitorAlaska

deej
August 5, 2004, 02:14 AM
Meg Whitman (CEO of eBay) seems to spread her money around some:

opensecrets.org (http://www.opensecrets.org/indivs/search.asp?NumOfThou=0&txtName=whitman&txtState=CA&txtZip=&txtEmploy=ebay&txtCand=&txt2004=Y&txt2002=Y&txt2000=Y&Order=N)

This story (http://www.internetnews.com/ec-news/article.php/70301) discusses eBay's original decision to stop listing firearms in 1999.



"While we acknowledge the gun collectors and sports enthusiasts among our users, eBay takes its role as a responsible member of the online community very seriously," said Steve Westley, eBay's vice president of marketing and business development.

"After careful consideration of the issue, we believe the process of buying and selling firearms online is sufficiently different from the offline world and it is appropriate for us to end the user listing of firearms. . ."



Steve Westley, by the way, is now an elected Democratic official here in California (State Controller.)

NukemJim
August 5, 2004, 07:01 AM
Wildalaska,
Frankly I would be more inclined to believe e-bay's version on their no guns/parts/mags/policy being based on legal concerns a lot more if I did not know about some of their other policies.

Body armour, look for Interceptor body armour on ebay. You will find it. At least 90% is stolen. According to some goverment sources 100% of it is stolen.

SAPI plates, 100% of them for sale on dbay are stolen goverment property.

The "real" MREs ( There are a lot of copies) that are sold on ebay are stolen from the goverment. The goverment has aked ebay to stop listing "real"MREs on ebay. Ebay has not done so.

It is my understanding, that ebay has now become a standard place to sell stolen merchandise according to some friends who are LEOs.

I do not know for sure but it sounds like spin control to me.

NukemJim

PS I like your singature signature

Wingshooter
August 5, 2004, 09:00 AM
Nukemjim,

Went to ebay to see if there were any of the vest or plates there. Wow, quite a few actually. They also sell much cheaper than I thought they would. Going price is around $300.00+ for the vest and saw some SAPI plates as low as $60.00. I have no use for them, but for someone with that kind of money burning a hole in their pocket... I guess it's a good deal?



One of the SAPI plates had this disclaimer on it:


Note: You must be over 18 years old to purchase this item. You must also have a clean criminal record and swear that you have no intention of utilizing this item in the commission of a crime.

That's beautiful.

flatrock
August 5, 2004, 09:29 AM
Ebay seemed to be willing to fight when the wanted to stop Nazi memorabilia from being sold on their site.

Ebay seems to be willing to stand back and say they aren't responsible for people selling or attempting to buy things where they are illegal, except where guns are involved.

They also own Paypal which has taken an active offensive against companies that deal with firearms.

The exec that called you might be a nice and reasonable person. It's admirable that he called you. However, if that's the case he doesn't appear to be in a situation to direct Ebays business practices.

Boycott Ebay.

2nd Amendment
August 5, 2004, 10:54 AM
It's amazing what you can sell and buy on ebay if you just keep your mouth shut and do it. :) And PayPud doesn't have a clue what's going on so they can talk about what you "aren't allowed" to do all day.

NukemJim
August 5, 2004, 12:58 PM
Went to ebay to see if there were any of the vest or plates there. Wow, quite a few actually. They also sell much cheaper than I thought they would.

Carefull, many of the SAPI plates look "odd" to my poor untrained eyes, also do not forget that the SAPI plates can be damaged by dropping them wrong, AND they are illeagal to posses. Stolen federal property, since they were never sold commercially and are not surplused ( they must be destroyed :( ) if you have one and are not issued it you could be in trouble.

Same for Interceptor vests only here there are conflicting reports. Some reports say no Interceptor vests were sold commercially, some say a small number were. In either case the vast majority of Interceptor vests on ebay are stolen goverment property. If you have one and are not issued it you could be in trouble.

Nukemjim

Pebcac
August 5, 2004, 02:15 PM
I did not discuss pay pal...my feelings on them reach deeper than any antigun animus and we wont use them (and tell everyoner who asks why)...

Just curious, so: Why? :D

WonderNine
August 5, 2004, 05:21 PM
Ebay seemed to be willing to fight when the wanted to stop Nazi memorabilia from being sold on their site.

Ebay seems to be willing to stand back and say they aren't responsible for people selling or attempting to buy things where they are illegal, except where guns are involved. - flatrock

Exactly. There's a double standard here which should be obvious to all, including people who get phone calls from Ebay executives. 1st Amendment good, 2nd Amendment bad.

bedlamite
August 5, 2004, 07:45 PM
Pebcac, take a look here:

http://www.paypalsucks.com/

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