[californiasushi]

i'm a beginner to firearms, and i was wondering what was the best american-made accurate autoloading (semi-automatic?) rifle under $500. i understand the learning merits of a .22 rifle, and would rather start off with nothing less than a .223 round.

i've read a lot about the sks's and their ak-equivalents but would rather have an american-made gun, simply because i want to support our firearms companies. it may sound stupid, but that is just my preference.

i've also read about the mini-14/30 and their price range is perfect, and it is american. however, these are carbines and i'd rather have a gun that is rather accurate to at least 300 yards.

also, i was wondering about the ar-15 knockoff's in this price range. are they good alternatives? i'd rather get something that is good to go out of the box, without needing to upgrade barrels and everything else in order to get reliable accuracy. or should i go for nothing less than a bushmaster and spend a few extra hundred?

i know there are many unexplained reasons about my question. but please, just recommend me a good american-made semiautomatic rifle with good accuracy out to distance that is at or around $500. thanks

[KaceCoyote]

Eh, 500 dollars and accurate to 300 yards? This may sound silly but I say the absolute most is learned for years at 15-50 yards. Shooting at that sort've range requires alot not only from you but also the equipment. Ammo for a .223 is cheap but it sure as hell adds up.

The a .223 boltgun that can put it reliably down range on paper will cost significantly more than just the price of the rifle. Theres also the price for scope bases, scope rings and a high dollar scope. All of which need to be top of the line. Lot of shooting ranges dont have anything out to that range, most of them around here are 100.

I know your gonna find somone to sell ya on a .223 but please listen, from a guy who DIDNT start with a .22. Recoil jerk is horrific, and its not a heavy caliber but its gonna take alot've rounds to break the rifle in(read money) not to mention rounds to train before you can be anything approaching reasonably reliable at that sorta range.

Get a simple .22 bolt action with iron sights. Buy a brick've a thousand rounds, go to a shooting range and get to work. Nobody will laugh at you, or look twice if you show up to the range with a .22. Its NOT a girl caliber. its not for wussies, its a caliber thats popular for a reason. Think of it like this, on the money sorta thing.


box of .223 match grade:13 dollars(varies) for 20 rounds
box of .22 match grade: 5 dollars(about) for 50+ rounds

A good .22 scope for 50 yard work: 8-20 bucks depending on preference
A good .223 scope for 50 yard work: 30-50 bucks without rings, and bases.

The .223 will eventually punish your shoulder on a long range day.
The .22 can be fired thousands of rounds a day.

You can make your own decisions but I urge you to reconsider.

[Zak Smith]

The AR15 is "easy" to make accurate due to its design. Get a decent barrel and trigger, and chances are it will shoot sub-MOA.

It is possible to put together a decent AR15 for under $500 if you carefully choose components and take deals when you can get them.

-z

[NoHarmNoFAL]

i've read a lot about the sks's and their ak-equivalents but would rather have an american-made gun, simply because i want to support our firearms companies. it may sound stupid, but that is just my preference.

Sans a kit gun you are not going to be supporting any American gun companies with $500 or less, not to mention the cost of glass. That being said there are some great deals out there in the used gun market, check gun shops that allow consignments and pawn shops. I find pawn shops just before and just after Christmas to be gold mines. ;)

Being a new shooter get a 10/22, a $50 Bushnell scope and $250.00 worth of wildcat and the have at it. I was shooting a 10" drum lid at 200 yards without much troble and did not have that bad of a group considering.

[SOT_II]

M1 Garand, USGI Service or Rack grade. Deadly accurate to well past 300 yards.
caliber wise it excedes you minimum spec.

There is a CMP purchase program availible.

M1 Garand (http://www.odcmp.com/Services/Rifles/m1garand.htm)

[L-2]

1. There's no indication as to what state we're talking about. Is it California [your user-name suggests Calif.]? If so, AR's are generally out of the question [illegal to be bought/sold. Governator Arnold S., please change the law.].

2. The Ruger Mini-14 in .223 is OK for 50 yards; not accurate for 300 yards, but the bullets will travel that far. Realistically, I only have one place which I can shoot at 300 yards in my area; then with my 25x spotting scope, I couldn't even see any holes left by something .223" in diameter.

3. Your criteria was American-made, semi-auto and minimally .223. This allows .308 as a possibility. Then consider one of the M1A variants. Now, we just have to get you to move that $500 estimate to $1500-$5000.

http://www.springfield-armory.com/prod-rifles.shtml

PS: -I forgot the M1 Garand! Doh!
-I was unaware of the Kel-tec!

[GunGoBoom]

Yeah, an AR15 in some flavor would do nicely, but rather expensive.

Seems like you're the darn near perfect candidate for the KelTec SU-16 or SU-16B:
-Inexpensive ($480-$520ish)
-Calif-Legal semi-auto (a rarity) - you are in CA, correct?
-.223 Cal
-Good reputation so far.
-American made/owned.

http://www.kel-tec.com/su-16_rifle.htm

And remember:

Rule #1: Buying American made is not stupid; it's a good idea generally speaking.
Rule #2: Buying from a company that doesn't infringe gun rights is even more important that buying American, and where the two conflict, this should trump the other consideration.

Since Ruger actively encourages gun bans by the federal gov't, it makes no sense to buy from them. Plus, the Mini 14 / Mini 30 have a reputation for terrible accuracy when the barrel heats up. Bleh.

I'd say, bottom line, for your purposes, get a KelTec SU16 in .223 if you want a semi-auto in .223. But if you're willing to forego a semi-auto get a Savage turnbolt in .243 - it will give you more long-range power and "accuracy" (wind-bucking ability, that is). Or if you want to sacrifice a little bit of trajectory for extra power and don't mind a little more recoil, a turnbolt in .308 Win or 7mm-08 might work for you as well.

Now, for autloaders for a little more $, and in more powerful calibers than .223.....Where are Brownings made? A Browning BAR in in .243, 7mm-08, .270 Win, .308 or even .30-06 might be just the ticket for you. Great rifle. It's just a matter of how powerful you want to go, and how much recoil you're willing to put up with. If Brownings are not made here, then a Remington 7400 would be a good choice.

[NevadaPistolero]

Well number 1 you dont use match ammo for blasting at the range or boondocks. I own 3 ARs and 3 AKs and this is the first time Ive ever heard some say an AR is punishing.....the recoil is negligible. Thats just bogus. Good wolf blasting polymer coated ammo is under $100 for a thousand rounds in .223. Go to AR15.com and ask a few guys that hang out there about ARs. You can get a nice AK for under $500...again cheap ammo $80-$90 per thousand for 7.62x39. You can shoot 300 yards with the iron sites on an AR...250-300 yards with an AK and be pretty damn accurate. If you are from calif.....MOVE where you can own real guns. Even when the AWB sunsets it wont affect Kommiefornia...they are a world on to there own. I built my last AR out of quality parts for around $450.......that was with an RRA lower. ARs are so easy to put together your little sister could do it. But alas ...the kommiefornia thing really cuts down on what you can buy.

[PMDW]

The CMP guns are not worth the price you pay after you go through the process they require. Having to participate in a shooting competition to buy a gun from them = stupid.

[lycanthrope]

Stag (RRA) lower from Eagle Firearms. $85

Complete kit from Model 1 sales: $415


$500 = brand new AR

[Brian Williams]

i'm a beginner to firearms
Then listen to someone who has BTDT Get a 22lr
Shoot at least 2000 rounds thru it and come back looking for a autoloading centerfire rifle

[cracked butt]

Definately start with a .22. $20 in ammo will last longer than you will in a day at the range, $20 worth of centerfire ammo will last you 1/2 at best.



For an accurate centerfire semiauto in your price range, a Service grade Garand rom CMP would probably be your best bet.

[Don of Kalifornia]

CMP is not that hard to get a Garand from, just join Garand Collectors for $25 a year(you get a lot of great info from them) Then just shoot a local high power match, hey you might really learn how to shoot and hit something at 200+ yards. Most local matchs charge about $20 to shoot a match using one of the club's Garands, they even sell ammo for the Garand, call a few of your local ranges/clubs.

This will also give you an idea if you really like shooting a Garand, if you don't, you only out $20-$30..not bought a rifle you don't like and want to sell

[JNewell]

The CMP guns are not worth the price you pay after you go through the process they require. Having to participate in a shooting competition to buy a gun from them = stupid.

Not required any more...CHL or equivalent, among other things, will do it.

[KaceCoyote]

CHL?

[Beetle Bailey]

CMP also accepts C&R license in lieu of shooting in a match. That's what I used to get my USGI service grade SA M1 from them. BTW, I'm very pleased and will probably pick up another one from them after I take care of some other things on the list ;) .

CaliforniaSushi Based on your desire for a .223 cal autoloader made in the USA and assuming you actually live in California, your best bet is a Keltec SU-16, with the Ruger Mini-14 coming in second place. IINM, those are the only two choices in your price range that are California-legal.

However, unless you are trying to pick one of those up before the gun haters in California ban them, your best bet long-term is to pick up a .22lr bolt-action with iron sights. It doesn't have to be fancy, or even NIB. Just something you can shoot lots of ammo out of. The skills you build shooting .22lr translate well into shooting the centerfire cartridges, but the .22lr is also a very fun round to shoot in it's own right.

[Rupestris]

Remington 7400 in .308, .233, or .270. - $400
Marlin Model 60 .22lr - $99 at Wal-Mart

[rauchman]

I have to agree with some of the other posters here. Get the .22lr. You can get a 10/22 for roughly $150-200. Through on an aftermarket barrel (somewhere around $100.00) and possibly a sear/trigger combo (call it $60.00). Or get the 10/22 T (target model). I went the build it yourself route and with the right ammo, the gun will shoot 1/2" groups at 50 yards. Also consider a bolt .22. To me, they are the most fun rifles I have. For the ranges that you would be using the rifle at, you don't need a super expensive scope. You can go anywhere from way under $100.00 to a little over $300.00 for a Weaver Grand Slam 6-20 variable (kick ass scope by the way). I use the Federal 711B Gold Medal ammo and it runs about $22.00 per 500 rounds. It happens to work real well in my Ruger 77/22. That combo will hold MOA at 100 yards. Depending on your gun, you may find the low end stuff works best ( where you're paying less than $10.00 per 500 rounds). I have a Bushmaster as well, and yes while the Bushie is fun to shoot, it's over twice as expensive to shoot using Wolf, which I have never used. I find it's 3x as expensive to shoot .223 over .22lr. If you find a range that will let you put steel poppers at various ranges up to 100 yards, you will definitely become adept at adjusting for drop. With a 50yard zero, the .22 drops about 5 inches or so at 100 yards. At 100 yards I've seen the bullets be pushed left or right 4 inches from gusts of wind. If you can find a 200 yard range, this is proportionally equivalent to shooting a .308 at 1000 yards. You really begin to understand about judging wind and drop. The .22 is the caliber to learn on. Once you've got the fundementals down, then move up to the .223 or some other caliber.

[Dbl0Kevin]

The .223 will eventually punish your shoulder on a long range day.

I really gotta speak up on this one. I don't know what .223 you have been shooting, but my AR15 doesn't kick much more than a .22lr. I could shoot it forever without "punishing my shoulder". :confused:

[SRYnidan]

????????
Concealed
Handgun
License
?????

[lycanthrope]

i understand the learning merits of a .22 rifle, and would rather start off with nothing less than a .223 round.

With what you asked for (intended purpose would have allowed us to be more clear), let's summarize.....

If you want AMERICAN and a $500 cap that narrows it down to:

AR-15
Mini-14
Remmy 7400
Kel-Tec SU-16

Even for a novice, .223 recoil is no where near hurtful.....unless you fire a few hundred rounds with the buttstock against your forehead. It is also one of the cheaper centerfire rounds.....but underpowered for large game should hunting be in the picture.

The AR can be accurized the easiest in the above list, IMHO.
The 7400 will offer the most calibers and was designed for hunting.
The Min-14 is rugged, but not known for accuracy (although many shoot very well).
I have little info on the Kel-Tec but looks appealing if you live in CA.

A .22 is a good idea to learn marksmanship, but if you are on a limited budget and want a centerfire then get one. You will need to lean the same precautions and skills whatever the caliber. The .22 will allow you to practice more, but will not fill the criteria you describe.

[schromf]

Not exciting or glamorous. But cheap, reliable, and accurate. Look at a Remington Nylon 66. See:

http://www.gunbroker.com/auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=21395718

(no its not mine, and I know nothing about the seller, its just good pic's )

That and two bricks of 22 lr ammo. These are real nice little rifles, one of the first rifles to go past the 1,000,000 round mark back in what about 1958 or so, don't remember the advertising hype exactly, but I have owned these in the past, there aren't any negatives unless you want to pull it apart and fiddle with one ( DON"T !!!!!), which there is no reason to do anyway.

Bank the difference and start saving for your AR, FN whatever.

[GunGoBoom]

Aren't even Rem 7400 over the $500 limit by quite a ways? If you're willing to spend that much, then why not a Browning BAR instead? Better gun than the 7400, as I understand it. Are all Brownings made in Belgium, or are some made in USA, or what? Anyone know? I don't know. Bottom line is, his best bet may be a .22, probably a Marlin model 60 if you ask me, but *within* his parameters, his best bets are:

1. KelTec SU16 (by far)
2. Ruger Mini 14 or Mini 30 (distant second)

I don't think the Rem 7400 is within the price criteria, and the AR is not Cali legal. So there you have it. KelTec. Actually, the Mini 14/30 is not even within his stated parameters - he said "accurate".... :neener: That leaves the KelTec as pretty well his only choice, and easily the best choice, seems to me.

Wait a sec - isn't there some American company who is making a Kalishnikov now, or am I dreamin?

[NoHarmNoFAL]

I really gotta speak up on this one. I don't know what .223 you have been shooting, but my AR15 doesn't kick much more than a .22lr. I could shoot it forever without "punishing my shoulder".


The a .223 boltgun that can put it reliably down range on paper will cost significantly more than just the price of the rifle....The .223 will eventually punish your shoulder on a long range day.

KaceCoyote was more than likely talking about a bolt gun.;)

If not then KaceCoyote must be a little girly. :neener:

[telewinz]

I have a Colt SP1 (1978), a Colt H-Bar and an Olympic Arms "Plinker". The Plinker can be had for $450 and up new. My "Plinker" shoots as well or better than either Colt with identical reliability and it has a LIFETIME warranty. It's hard to beat, cast receiver and all!M1 Garand, USGI Service or Rack grade. Deadly accurate to well past 300 yards. Not according to the accuracy standards imposed by the inspectors...4 inches at 100 yards, 8 inches at 200 yards and 12 inches at 300 yards. How come everybody's guns shoot sub moa but mine? I am considered an excellent shot by ALL who know me. Deadly accurate!? Maybe if you are shooting down a 300 yard , four inch pipe!:D

[rbernie]

Aren't even Rem 7400 over the $500 limit by quite a ways? If you're willing to spend that much, then why not a Browning BAR instead? Naw - you can get a parkerized synthetic-stocked 7400 in most hunting calibers (243, 270, 30-06, etc.) for around $300. I wouldn't necessarily recommend one (I had a few disagreements with my 7400 and sold it not long after I bought it), but it is a viable option for light usage.

why not a Browning BAR instead? Better gun than the 7400, as I understand it. Indeed - almost twice as expensive but probably twice as nice. Unfortunately, I don't think that it'll qualify as a 'Murrrican-made.

I think that an AR or a SU-16 would be a neat option to pursue. I found that I really outgrew my 22LR pretty quickly once I decided to regularly play at 100+ yards.

[cracked butt]

The Remingtong 7400 is not a rifle that is suitable for a rifleman. They are good for shooting a few shots in a hunting situation and that is about all. I've worked at a deer rifle sightin clinic for several years and have seen hundreds of these rifles perform- they shoot accurately for about 3 shots and then the barrel heats up, warps, and it throws shots all over the place.

Someone mentioned that a garand isn't accurate- it all defines what you call accurate. My M1 shoots 2" groups with handloads, and when it gets hot, the accuracy doesn't degrade much and the point of impact doesn't change either- its a far cry better than a remington, but not nearly as good as a good AR or bolt gun.

[NEtracker]

I believe the original poster indicated "good" accuracy, not sub MOA.
The Service Grade M1 Garand from the CMP will yield fine groups for a battlerifle, the price is right, and you end up with a super piece of history in your shootable collection.:cool:

(oh, and yes, one of those major issues keeping me from considering any move to CA, is that I'd have to part with my AR's):mad:

[NevadaPistolero]

Well last time I checked and its been awhile...mini-14 mags are cost prohibitive....AR GI mags are $15, AK mags brand new $10....unless your a girly man (as ahnold would say) go for the bigger caliber....22s are fun but hey...get a real gun.

[444]

Please go to the CMP website and read what it takes to buy a rifle from them. When I first looked into it I found that I had all the qualifications already. I was a member of a club that held CMP matches, even though I didn't shoot in them, this was a requirement. And, I was an honorably discharged vet. There are all kinds of variations you can use to quailify for one. Heaven forbid you actually go out and shoot a match (which is what the CMP is all about) and learn how to shoot from some guys that really know what they are doing. :scrutiny:

The M1 rifle will be far more accurate than you can shoot for quite awhile. When you get to the point that you can shoot better than the rifle, there are dozens, if not hundreds of gunsmiths that accurize them. You can get a 1 MOA guarentee for some of them. Yeah, this costs money, but it isn't included in the inital outlay for the rifle. I have been informally shooting rifles for years and can't outshoot any of my M1s from practical positions.

The M1 is 100% American made if you get a USGI rifle, and costs less than $500.

[Hand_Rifle_Guy]

Not mentioned yet, but definitely built here, is the Ruger Deerfield carbine in .44 Magnum. Dunno if this one meets the criteria of ".223+" or not, but I'll just throw it in the ring fer gits 'n shiggles.

'Nuther possibility is the longtime-out-of-production Remington Model 8 or Model 81 Woodsmaster. These John-Browning-designed guns were first introduced in 1906, and were in constant production until WW-II. After the war, inventoried parts werte made into finished guns and sold, but production was not resumed as it had become too expensive to make these labor-intensive rifles.

The Remington was the first truly successful commercial autoloading rifle made, as the competing Winchester Self-Loading line was a blowback action, and therefore an evolutionary dead-end, which topped out at the .401 WSL cartridge. The Model 8/81 was a long-recoil, locked-breech action that chambered all of the Remington Rimless series, (the .25, .30, .32, and .35 Remington, all very similar in capacity and power to the .30-30.) and culminated in the emminently useful .300 Savage. These guns were not spectacularly popular, as they are somewhat ungainly in appearance, and are rather complicated when compared to the average boltgun, but they were designed by John Browning and display superb engineering. They were made during the days of gun manufacture when craftsmanship was paramount, and the excellent workmanship and fit and finish is obvious on close examination. They all have a 22" barrel, and a fixed five-shot magazine. They balance in a single hand very well for hiking around while hunting, and their surprisingly solid heft (They weigh as much as a Garand!) settled them quickly for fast shots in ther woods.

Most have been equipped with one or the other receiver peepsights by the likes of Lyman or Williams, and best of all, with a little diligent digging you can usually find one in good condition, in either .35 Remington or .300 Savage, (The two rounds still readily available from regular retail sources.} for $300 or under.

These guns are really well made. They're a steal. Making 'em today would price 'em in the thousands.

They might not have been a runaway hit, but they stayed in production forty years straight! Not many guns can make an equivalent claim. That speaks well of the viability of the design.

Production ceased due to post-war labor cost increases, which speaks well of the amount of fine workmanship involved in their crafting. Finding such high production value in guns produced today is rare and/or very costly.

The .300 Savage chambering barks right on the heels of the .308 Winchester in power. It's certainly no slouch, and it's readily available. The .35 Rem is less powerful, but it's one of the best big-bore deer-hunting cartridges available for the task.

if you've bever looked closely at one of these unusual hump-backed rifles, you should. They're findable for reltively cherap, and they'll give any other gun made a run for it's money for the title of "Best American Autoloader", and cost a bunch less to boot.

[rbernie]

Hand_Rifle_Guy - not to hijack the thread or anything, but have you shot a Rem Model 8? If so, how was its recoil? (I was really interested in one a while back, but the word I got at the time was that the recoil was pretty hefty for the chamberings..)

[Hand_Rifle_Guy]

I've got two. One in .300, and one in .35.

Now, on the one hand, I didn't find the recoil of either gun to be at all prohibitive. A bit odd, perhaps. Downright confusingly un-natural-feeling, actually, if you can seperate out the various bits of the cycle:

The action spreads the recoil impulse out over a relatively long time period, and at the end of the recoil stroke after cocking the hammer, the barrel-bolt unit gets caught and has it's motion stopped by a SUBSTANTIAL buffer spring, whereupon the barrel unlocks from the bolt and returns forward, extracting and ejecting the case before finally tripping the release on the bolt which is driven forward, stripping the next round out of the mag, chambering it and then locking the bolthead to the end of the barrel. The barrel-return/recoil spring would do credit to a garage door, and when the barrel stops it's forward motion against the inside of the barrel shroud, you get a bit of forward recoil impulse.

All-in-all, quite a complex bunch of activity, involving a couple of substantial masses moving back and forth at different times between three different heavy springs, all in a fraction of a second. "Frenetic" comes to mind.

But like I said, the primary impulse is spread out from here to Timbuktu, and handed to all these different partiscipants. To ME, it seems to be totally reasonable. Nicer than the belt I get from a standing-breech gun firing a comparable cartridge, I think.

But that's just MY impression. I'm a well-known recoil abuser, and my standards are to be viewed with suspicion. Witness the username, and know that I spent way too much money custom-ordering a derringer chambered in 7.62 x 39 that is known as The Monster, and I didn't name it.

Therefore, on the other hand, there are a few well-experienced shooters on this board who have purchased Remington Model 8's identical to mine, who report the recoil of the M-8 to being comparable to being slugged by a bus full of fat kids on their way to Camp Stomache-Staples for a little intensive attention. (My words.)

I exagerrate a little, but the report stands. Other reputable folks (More than one, mind you.) have reported that they are surprised at the strength of the recoil of these guns, even in the context of their not insubstantial weight.

So while I'll still say it ain't all that bad, I'd be inclined to think that H_R_G is a friggin' loon just like he says he is, and his standards are from some alternate reality where getting your clavicle chiropractically re-adjusted by a steel buttplate is somehow equal to the delicate touch of a falling snowflake, which is substantialy incorrect.

That aside, it's a stout shove that won't bust you in the chops or give you a scope cut, but it definitely is no love tap. Brace for it, so it doesn't surprise you.

[patentmike]

I've been thinking along these lines myself. The Browning BAR I looked at recently said "made in Japan". I am leaning toward going the CMP route. Is there any reason to prefer the H&R over the Springfield?

[GunGoBoom]

Ooooh, I like that idea of the Rem model 8/81, esp. in 300 Savage, or the Garand. But you've got to have some patience to jump through the hoops to get a garand from CMP, so that you can get one for under $500. What do those model 8s and 81s run on the used market? Oops, Brownings made in Japan....and way beyond price parameter.

[Marshall]

Used BAR in excellent condition! ;)

[HankB]

Like a previous poster, I had occasion to work for several years at our local gun club as a range officer during deer sight-in days, and saw a LOT of Remington autos go through.

A lot of them - by a lot, I mean percentages WELL into double digits - were jammamatics. Some worked fine, so it's probably more a matter of execution rather than design. (Maybe the rifles made Monday morning and Friday afternoon were trash?) But unless I had a chance to test fire it first, I wouldn't want to take a chance on something with a 1 in 5 . . . or maybe 1 in 4 . . . chance of being a junker.

Semi-auto Brownings all seemed to work well, as did the occasional Winchester M-100 that showed up.

The AR-15s that didn't work well all seemed to be parts guns - Colt, Bushmaster, and Armalite seemed to be quality products. But then, they're over your $500 limit.

AK variants and SKSs seemed to work OK, but they're generally imports and Kali has some screwy restrictions . . . and 300 yard accuracy is "iffy."

I recently put in an order for a "Service Grade" CMP Garand. These ARE used rifles - probably rebuilt a time or three - but from what I've been reading, you'll get one that's FUNCTIONAL and isn't a reweld or something like so many gun show specials are. I'm keeping my fingers crossed I don't get a dog.

[Marshall]

Rem 7400 $624.00 MSRP (can be had for less)
http://www.remington.com/images/firearms/7400wd.jpg


Browning BAR $889.00 MSRP in .243 or .308 (can be had for less)
http://www.browning.com/products/catalog/firearms/images/031001m.jpg





Here's an article you may be interested in. Article Best Semi Auto Hunting Rifles (http://hunting.about.com/cs/guns/tp/tp_auto_rifles.htm)

[Hand_Rifle_Guy]

Some handy threads for the curious and interested, since we're going into detail, here. Detailed analysis, etc. Enjoy:

Remington Model 8/81, the first. (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=33915)

Remington Model8/81, the second (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37549)

Non-military semi-autos (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5846)

Weird Autoloaders (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=56400)

Lever vs. 7400 vs. BAR (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12999)

More general autoloader comparisons (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12140)

Mind you, these are just the ones that I remember starting or contributing too. Might be more info around with more diligent searching, but these offer a good start and cover a vast amount of good posts. Pics too.