I have a hardwood sledge hammer handle (thicker and stronger than an ax handle) that I have hauled around for over thirty years.
It seems indistructable.
Lately, I've been doing a few home defense drills with it (my answer to the Tueller problem, just break the arms.)
This is superbly balanced, the right mix of light and heavy, can foreshorten grip in a split second, can use either end just as effectively, has AWESOME breaking power, yet short enough to fit in medium suitcase.
Only downside is if handle grets slick with sweat or blood, might lose it.
After all these years, after so many paths, I finally wend my path to Sensei Bubba.
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cordex
August 20, 2004, 04:14 PM
Be tactical. Tape it up with skateboard tape to improve your grip.
Also see if Surefire will make a mount for it.
Skofnung
August 20, 2004, 05:39 PM
Yhea, a cudgel can be a fearsome weapon.
If you are worried about grip, the skateboard tape thing will work, but I would either cut grooves with a triangular file or wrap it in some form of cordage, para-cord comes to mind. I find that skateboard tape is a bit rough, even on my caloused hands. Ymmv.
All the bubbas I know (and I know MANY) use axe handles. In fact, I saw a friend of mine's cousin get whacked in the back of the head with an axe handle by a little redderd... Even though my buddy's cousin was a big fellow and the other guy was a little one, he still spent a few days in the hospital, as it nearly killed him. The other guy went to jail.
I still prefer my 1 1/4" x 50" or a pair of 1 1/4" x 20" to a bigger cudgel. But I would not feel helpless with a sledge handle.
Jeepin' Lawyer
August 25, 2004, 07:43 AM
Pics?!?!?!? :p
hillbilly
August 25, 2004, 09:16 AM
Texian Pistolero......I know something of redneck weaponry, being a redneck from Arkansas.
While your sledge-hammer handle has a certain style to it, I can't say that it's the ultimate in redneck clubbing hardware.
What yew really need is one of them them Tar Arhns (tire irons) what gots only one socket on the end of it.
Now that thar is a real redneck club.
Plus, the tire iron is shorter and easier to swing with only one hand, and steel is a lot harder than hickory. And ain't nobody gonna wonder why you got a tire iron behind the back seat of your pickup.
hillbilly
Double Naught Spy
August 25, 2004, 10:23 AM
Don't forget to add the laser sight!
Oh, and sort of by definitition, half a million rednecks most definitely can be wrong. What do you expect from a group who is known for two last words phrases before they die doing something stupid?
1. Hold my beer.
2. Hey, watch this!
VaughnT
August 25, 2004, 09:35 PM
Shades of Clint in Pale Rider.
"Ain't nuthin' like a good piece of hickery!"
Personally, I wouldn't feel any shortcomings if armed with a club like that. It's not the tool that makes the difference.
Stephen King, when speaking of two cops killed by his main character, The Gunslinger, wrote something along the lines of, "They paid more attention to the weapons that they wore than the weapons that they were."
A truer truism has never been penned.
joab
August 25, 2004, 09:48 PM
Plus, the tire iron is shorter and easier to swing with only one hand, and steel is a lot harder than hickory. And ain't nobody gonna wonder why you got a tire iron behind the back seat of your pickup. No self respecting Redneck would hide his club behind his seat.
My pick ax handle sat proudly in it's own space in the gun rack, now it sits in the closet with the rest of my high school memetos.
The local gun shows here always have a group that does lazer engraving for that special BBQ club.
chickenfried
August 25, 2004, 10:21 PM
I forgot what book I read but the character had what he called a Redneck Katana, a piece of rebar with a duct tape handle :) . I laughed out loud when I read that part.
El Tejon
August 25, 2004, 10:59 PM
Great for the forearms. Keep it up, sifu!:D
Third_Rail
August 25, 2004, 11:20 PM
Snowcrash, Neil Stephenson, page 183. Hiro Protagonist is the character who is building muscle mass with it.
:D
I know trivia like you wouldn't believe.
Moparmike
August 26, 2004, 12:25 AM
I have an Ash shovel handle about 4ft long that I broke trying to dislodge a rock that was way way way too heavy. After I had a rather bad experience being the victim of theft, I wrote "Anti-Theft Device" on it. ;)
I too am a redneck. And being the inventive guy I am, I just thought of something better than a Tar Ahrn. Y'all ever seen one of those bumper jacks from way back when, when bumpers had that rare metal known as STEEL in them? One of those "tubes" should seem fairly innocuous to the unaware...
joab
August 26, 2004, 12:44 AM
MoparMike where did you get that antique
For years my father refused to buy a car that had to use one of those sissy sissor or hydrolic jacks.
They worked great for getting a car unstuck just jack it up and push it off, repeat as necessary.
Dr.Rob
August 26, 2004, 02:35 PM
What is steel to the hand that wields it?
--Thulsa Doom
Whatever works for you my friend. You want to clean up town with a 2x4 and call your self Beauford.. go right ahead.
Several self respecting auto recovery professionals I know favored a cut down axe handle wrapped with electrical tape, and two ten penny nails at the head for added weight.
FYI: don't kid yourself, that's a deadly weapon, and used improperly can land you in the big house worse than getting popped for carrying a gun.
How do you pronounce 'kata' with a southern accent?
MrAcheson
August 26, 2004, 06:16 PM
"A half million rednecks can't be wrong"
Dang so the north really did lose the civil war?
Another nice piece of work is a wooden bokken training sword. They're balanced and weighted for swinging.
Swamprabbit
August 26, 2004, 06:25 PM
Wait 'till you see my axe handle with the picatinny rails installed :D
joab
August 26, 2004, 07:04 PM
Dang so the north really did lose the civil war? Contrary to the common misconception Redneck does not mean southerner some of the biggest rednecks I have ever known came from upstate NY and NH
hso
August 26, 2004, 11:36 PM
I gotta agree that I've run into more rednecks in the north than in the south. In the south we know the difference between a "redneck" and a "good-ol-boy", but yankees don't seem to have learned. In short, a good ol boy throws his beer cans in the back of the truck instead of on the side of the road.:D
WRT clubs, cudgels, bludgeons - it's very easy to kill someone with such a "non-lethal" weapon and great care should be taken when selecting and using one. Only hit to the head, face or neck if you intend to kill.
JOE MACK
August 27, 2004, 06:19 AM
:scrutiny: While I have wielded an ax handle a time or two, I prefer my matched set of burned rattan sticks.
Preacherman
August 28, 2004, 11:06 AM
How do you pronounce "kata" with a Southern accent?
"Kattuh", of course! :D
Lt. G
August 28, 2004, 12:31 PM
When I was about 16 years old, I remember going fishing with friends. When we would get a fish that thrashed too much, my buds would pull out a "FISH BILLY" It was a small billy club made out of a hardwood with a leather strap attached to it. We all had one under our car seats back then.
effengee
August 28, 2004, 10:01 PM
First of all, Yes Virginia, we won the war. Pun fully intended.
For those of you too redneck to get that, email me with your address and I'll send you a detailed drawing...
Second, A redneck by definition is anybody who labors outdoors in the sun and therefore gets a sunburn above their shoulders and below their head.
Hence the term "REDNECK"
Fourth, I aint got no use for a tire iron but spinning the lugs on my rims.
Number twelve, Here in Vermont we just carry what any common Bubba would easily recognize:
A REAL BOOM-STICK!
jimbo
joab
August 28, 2004, 10:25 PM
A redneck by definition is anybody who labors outdoors in the sun and therefore gets a sunburn above their shoulders and below their head. Actually Redneck was originally a slur aimed at a group of Scottish dissidents the term followed them as they settled in America especially in the south. It was also used as a slur aginst southern PresbyteriansFirst of all, Yes Virginia, we won the war. Pun fully intended. The pun is old and weak and nobody here has disputed the outcome of , or even brought up, the war in question.
I thought only us dumb southeners identified ourselves by our great-great grandfathers war or tried to bait arguments by invoking it's name
effengee
August 30, 2004, 10:10 AM
If you re-read ALL the posts you'll see why I wrote what I wrote...
My Grandfather got off a boat from the carribean in 1927...
His Father's boat. They were Scottish. Remnants of Cromwell's purge.
I've been south quite a few times and at least 5 times had to deal with a "good ol' boy" who didn't realize that the war ended...
Here in Vermont, you don't get that... We have rednecks, I'm one of them.
I drive a truck, wear plaid flannel, own guns, and listen to Willie Nelson... But I don't hate someone for their race, creed, or environmental location.
If I hate somebody, I don't waste time on prejudices.
Perhaps you are correct in the definition/origin of "Redneck" but if you ask any "city slicker" to define "redneck" You'll get the common stereotypes of the "Southern rebel truck driver who was bottle-fed Budweiser and owns more guns than some third world nations can bring to bear"
Actually, NOBODY won the civil war...
We all lose when we fight amongst ourselves.
Jimbo
P.S. Just for the record, I don't flame bait, I tell it like it is. If anybody is personally offended by anything I say, I wasn't talking to you...
joab
August 30, 2004, 10:36 AM
If you re-read ALL the posts you'll see why I wrote what I wrote... Dang so the north really did lose the civil war? Even though I responded to that comment I somehow missed it when I responded to yours, Sorry. My post was out of lineI've been south quite a few times and at least 5 times had to deal with a "good ol' boy" who didn't realize that the war ended... That's a common misconception that alot of Northeners have. We know the war ended . But as Lincoln himself said if reconstruction was not handled properly the hatred and devisiveness would last for a hundred years , and reconstruction could not have been handled worse if they tried real hard.
The only problems I've ever had with yankees was the ones that come down here and want to tell us how it is done up north, which seems to be a common shortcoming.Actually, NOBODY won the civil war... Actually the North won the war and wanted to make sure the South realized it in every possible way. Which is why even though most are qualified noone in my family will ever be buried in Arlington.
Since I don't want to further hijack a fine thread I want make any further comments here.
Dr.Rob
August 30, 2004, 03:43 PM
Funny I always heard the term "red neck" came from Striking coal miners wearing red bandannas to identify them selves as 'good guys' when the shooting started.
At one time, being a no-good redneck meant you were a no-good striking communist.
(Source: Thunder On The Mountain)
You know I bet there are more than a few russian red neck who have distinguished themselves by using a toilet and a planter box, or fishing with a dupont lure.
It's about attitude, not geography.
effengee
August 30, 2004, 05:51 PM
Trust me, I don't intend to EVER go back south...
As Joab so conveniently proved by calling me a jackass in a private message after I tried to nicely point out his mistake, and as the guy at the gas station in Georgia so eloquently put it:
Southern hospitality died at Appomattox courthouse.
Personal experience beats a royal flush every time...
Redneck, Bubba, hick, bumpkin, Mountain man... Jackass...
Just words...
Lord, may the words I speak today be sweet, for I may have to eat them tomorrow.
If the words I speak personally offend anyone, then I wasn't talking to you.
And I still refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person.
jimbo
joab
August 31, 2004, 03:57 PM
As Joab so conveniently proved by calling me a jackass in a private message after I tried to nicely point out his mistake, After you pointed out my error I apologized publicly for my error.
In your "polite" e-mail you called my apology condesending and postulating and stated that in a battle of wits I am unarmed.
PMs are called private for a reason, that is why I replied to your insulting PM by PM, the fact that you feel the need to bring a private conversation to the forum and to outright lie about it tells me that my assessment of your character was correct.
Conversations like this should be conducted in PM not in a hijacked thread.
I have written an in depth PM to you on this matter please show some maturity and leave our dispute in PM
Actually don't bother you're #5
effengee
August 31, 2004, 04:12 PM
But that's OK becuase I'm not going to care about it anymore...
Model520Fan
September 3, 2004, 02:02 PM
Which is why even though most are qualified noone in my family will ever be buried in Arlington.
So you can probably understand my avoidance of $5 bills.
Little Loudmouth
September 4, 2004, 10:00 PM
I have a big piece of driftwood in my room. It's thick and big and spiky at the top. just wait, soon I'll have the ultimate tactical striking staff! Picatinny rails, laser sight, Surefire, non-slick jewelled grips....
effengee
September 5, 2004, 12:19 AM
Doesn't anybody carry these anymore???
I also see 18-wheeler drivers using a short aluminum one to thump the tires to check air pressure and "integrity"
Seems like it would suit the purpose as well...
Texian Pistolero
September 11, 2004, 10:08 PM
They are called "tire knockers" and can be cheaply purchased at any truck stop.
I got a wooden one.
Problem is, very few poh-leece are going to buy into the concept that you need one to test the rubber on your Honda Accord.
effengee
September 12, 2004, 11:50 AM
Honestly officer, these 21" low profilers on the spinning bling bling rims need a good thumping to maintain proper inflation and bead set....
seeker_two
September 18, 2004, 08:43 PM
First of all, Yes Virginia, we won the war. Pun fully intended.
The only winner of the War of Northern Aggression was the ever-expanding Federal Government...
In the end, we ALL lost... :(
As for the ACTUAL topic....
An axe/sledgehammer handle is pretty silly to have unless the axe/sledgehammer is still attached....
Nobody's mentioned baseball bats (w/ the complimentary glove), large Mag-Lites, tool box full of heavy wrenches, or walking canes---all easily explainable to the LEO's...
Clubs aren't less-than-lethal. Just like any other weapon, it's all in how it's used....
Any weapon will do if YOU will do...
Anything I missed?.... :D
DelayedReaction
September 19, 2004, 02:41 AM
I keep a 36" crowbar in my apartment for demolition work when I do theater tech. Granted it's not as southern as most (Maryland is about as north of the south as you can get), but it does the job rather well.
joab
September 19, 2004, 02:50 AM
seeker_two
The only winner of the War of Northern Aggression was the ever-expanding Federal Government.
Step lightly, sore toes and sore subject.
Nobody's mentioned baseball bats (w/ the complimentary glove), large Mag-Lites, tool box full of heavy wrenches, or walking canes---all easily explainable to the LEO's... For years I carried a 1" wrench in my old truck usually on the seat. I had forgotton about thatAn axe/sledgehammer handle is pretty silly to have unless the axe/sledgehammer is still attached.... The weight at the extreme end of the shaft makes it unwieldy and difficult to use unless your opponent is already on the ground and you are going to nail him one last time.
Axe handles were used regularly on guard duty when I was in the army in the 80s
4v50 Gary
September 19, 2004, 02:01 PM
Stick and stones will break bones. Be fleet of feet and let them see your soles before your blood.:D
effengee
September 19, 2004, 05:06 PM
How about a 32oz. framing hammer???
Short reach, but if it'll drive a 13d spike through rock maple it should do a nice job smacking some carjacker up side the head...
Even if he is from the south...
No offense bubba...
orangeninja
September 19, 2004, 05:58 PM
Don't let the cops catch you with a "billy club". The results tend to be jail. Tire irons work though....so do tee ball bats (with ball and glove).
confinedbythecurtain
September 21, 2004, 06:18 PM
I find that a horseshoe bar will swing like a champ. Ive had one thrown at me and it cut my leg up pretty good. They are pretty darn heavy too.
dogngun
September 25, 2004, 01:22 PM
Baseball bats seem to be popular in this area, too (Philadelphia region).
I have one in a corner near my kitchen door.
Mark
When bats are outlawed, only outlaws will have bats.
Sulaco
September 26, 2004, 01:09 AM
28oz's of terror
http://www.estwing.com/images/nvgframing.jpg
p35
September 26, 2004, 03:23 PM
I was looking at one of those aluminum "tire knockers" at Harbor Freight Tools the other day- shorter and lighter than what I would want in a fight. Y'all probably heard the radio interview with the trucker in Iraq who killed a would be hijacker with one whack from a framing hammer. Seems odd they won't allow civilian contractors to carry guns when everyone else in the country has one, but that's for another day.
Didorian
September 28, 2004, 07:09 AM
I use to use dual Kamas in my Karate class..... Later looking for a weapon that didn't seem to be a weapon to keep in my pick up... I happened upon a pair of Tire Thumpers in a truck stop... I know ya'll have seen em. It's a wooden handle about a foot and a half long with a band of steel round the top three or so inches. I LOVE these things...
The only problem is that they're kinda slick, so I wrapped the handles with Duct tape..:D
That solved THAT problem :evil:
fistful
October 10, 2004, 02:16 AM
I got me one o' them there Cold Steel Special Forces Shovels behind the seat o' my truck. Don't look much like a weapon to no LEO, I hope, but I reckon if an e-tool is good medicine for enemy soldiers, it'll work on common street vermin.
The plan to keep a Combat Magnum under the seat is waiting on a proper holster or lock-box, though.:)
I'd make some smart comment on North-South conflict, but my momma's from south Missouri and my daddy's from north Missouri, so I'm just confused.
AF_INT1N0
October 10, 2004, 02:37 AM
What about an ASP?? I keep one in the old redneck mobile (Dodge Ram)
Carlos Cabeza
October 11, 2004, 05:42 PM
I got me a nice "L" shaped scar on my forehead from an enraged bubba encounter I had back in high school. I did like 4V50Gary said and beatfeet, all the way to the emergency room for ten or so stitches. Being an electrician, I have found a two foot section of large diameter copper wire makes an excellent thumper, it'll wrap around when it strikes !:evil:
LawDog
October 11, 2004, 05:57 PM
Blackthorn walking stick.
No muss, no fuss, and legal in all fifty states.
Easier to carry while strolling through the mall, grocery store or college campus than a axe handle, and doesn't attract attention in eateries and theatres like a tire tool.
LawDog
fistful
October 11, 2004, 06:10 PM
My, LawDog,
What a dashing figure you must cut, you dandy! Seriously, fashionwise, how do you carry that off? A picture might help.
SLCDave
October 11, 2004, 07:26 PM
In high school wood shop, we would cut 24" lengths of cedar, file finger grooves into them, and call them "Cedar Beaters". You had to weight the end with something (A large bolt, lead, etc.), but they worked out ok.
My cousin also took a piece of an old shovel handle (again, about 24") and staggered hose clamps around the end of it, making a mean club. The Screw ends would tear out chunks of whatever you were hitting. I'm glad I never got hit with it.....
p35
October 11, 2004, 08:03 PM
hey LawDog-
Wouldn't that make the topic drift into "A million Irishmen can't be wrong?"
Does the stuff grow anywhere in the US?
LawDog
October 11, 2004, 11:48 PM
Seriously, fashionwise, how do you carry that off?
Fashion? *blink, blink*
To tell you the truth, fashion concerns never really ever crossed my mind. If it will help you though, a nice blackthorn will clash less with your wardrobe than an axe-handle, 2X4, tire-iron, tire-buddy or escrima sticks.
Does the stuff grow anywhere in the US?
Not to the best of my knowledge. You aren't, however, restricted to using blackthorn. There are any number of good, strong walking sticks on the market made of materials other than blackthorn, and CaneMasters makes an excellent self-defense-orientated cane.
LawDog
fistful
October 12, 2004, 01:06 AM
Fashion? *blink, blink*
To tell you the truth, fashion concerns never really ever crossed my mind.
I don't know how old you are LawDog, but I'm guessing you're over fifty. Us twenty-somethings can't carry around a walking stick, unless we're also wearing a tuxedo. That is, if we wish to be taken seriously - not just by girls, but by anybody.
I'm glad it works for you, though.
JMag
October 12, 2004, 01:30 AM
Do it up right with some Agrips, Surefire w/mount, Meps, put a Kimber label on it. Don't forget to get it refinished in hard chrome, get a Kydex holster, etc. :D
Powderman
October 12, 2004, 02:02 AM
Stephen King, when speaking of two cops killed by his main character, The Gunslinger, wrote something along the lines of, "They paid more attention to the weapons that they wore than the weapons that they were."
I think I just found my new sig line.
Texian Pistolero
October 12, 2004, 10:31 PM
I may be wrong,
but I think that Irish blackthorn,
while extremely durable,
is rather light.
If you want to break bones,
you need density of mass.
Cosmoline
October 13, 2004, 01:58 PM
I have a salmon club made from a hickory axe handle, about 2 1/2 feet long. It's light weight but packs a very mean punch.
Second the blackthorn vote. I'm still looking for a good one.
Dirty Bob
October 13, 2004, 04:01 PM
A person of any age can carry a crook-top cane. Most people don't even notice them. Just don't sprint around waving it over your head. You don't need to fake a limp or anything, just walk at a modest pace, and "carefully." If asked, you can explain how you sprained an ankle several weeks ago, and you're still not 100%. I carried a cane for a while for that very reason (sprained ankle, then sprained it again before it fully healed, because I wasn't carrying a cane that day).
Johnny Guest
October 15, 2004, 12:12 PM
There’s been a lot of writing here about modification of sticks and tool handles to make ‘em better anti-personnel devices. Tape wrapped, skateboard taped handles, and so forth.
I realize the following deals with the law in Texas, but I’d wager that most if not all states have similar provisions - - Texas Penal Code, Chapter 46 - -
Sec. 46.02 Unlawful Carrying Weapons
(a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his person a handgun, illegal knife, or club.
Sec. 46.01. Definitions.
In this chapter:
(1) “Club” means an instrument that is specially designed, made, or adapted for the purpose of inflicting serious bodily injury or death by striking a person with the instrument, and includes but is not limited to the following:
(A) blackjack;
(B) nightstick;
(C) mace;
(D) tomahawk (Emphasis added.)
At age 23, a badly broken lower leg kept me on crutches for four months and used a cane for a couple of months more. No one ever commented on a young guy needing a walking stick.
A friend who worked for the phone company gave me a two-foot length of (I think) 64-pair cable, simply cut off at either end. The gray outer jacket provided a good hold on the rather hefty piece - - Entirely legal, not “adapted” for striking purposes, or anything illegal. I showed a willingness to use it on a couple of young men once (no blows struck.) I became nervous that passersby would notify the police, so I tossed the cable.
While in high school, I always kept an old style army entrenching tool unfolded under the seat of my car. I had some artfully applied dried mud left on it. On one occasion I took it out to help an El Paso PD officer unstick his patrol car. A knowing smile, but no comments were made.
As often mentioned previously, the mind is the true weapon.
Best,
Johnny
Simon76
October 15, 2004, 07:56 PM
My question is, why use JUST the handle? Keep a big, double-bit axe in the bed of the truck, between the cap and the cab, or right up on the front seat. If the cops ask, you were cutting firewood for a friend. (Be ready to give them the name and contact info of a collaborating friend, of course).
On a more serious note: Two sticks, hickory, oak, rattan or bamboo, 1 1/4"x26" on my front seat...back in the day. These have subsequently been replaced by a Glock 22 (.40S&W) and spare mags.
Simon.
fistful
October 15, 2004, 08:58 PM
My question is, why use JUST the handle? Keep a big, double-bit axe in the bed of the truck, between the cap and the cab, or right up on the front seat. If the cops ask, you were cutting firewood for a friend. (Be ready to give them the name and contact info of a collaborating friend, of course).
You're going to LIE to cops to explain an ax? It's an ax, man! For crying out loud! You need to explain an ax?! You mean to tell me, if a cop asks you why you have an ax in your truck, you're going to EXPLAIN to them why you have an AX?!
:banghead: :banghead: :cuss: :fire:
Calm. Calm.
First, look at the friendly officer as you would at any other insane person. Tell them an ax is a tool used for trimming small limbs, cutting down trees, and similar tasks.
Simon76
October 18, 2004, 10:03 AM
fistful - Dude, switch to DECAF! Lie to a cop? Uhhhh, YEAH. I don't see the problem there. "I was cutting firewood for a friend.", like I said before. Chill, dude. Just chill. It'll be alright, really.
Simon.
(If you think THAT'S bad, don't ask me about blue helmets.).
p35
October 18, 2004, 10:52 AM
To answer the question, though, a big ax is almost a one shot weapon- one good swing and you're so far off balance that you're nailed before you get it back into position for another. Of course, that one swing may end the fight if you connect, but if you don't you're in trouble.
Also, it raises the lethality of the confrontation- the police are a lot less likely to hear about some lowlife getting bruised up by hassling the wrong guy that they are to hear about him showing up at the ER with an arm cut off!
hso
October 18, 2004, 12:00 PM
Any bludgeon can be improved with a little file work. A triangle file can be used to make the first cuts and a round file can make them for comfortable. This gives a solid grip that is not abrasive. Just don't cut too deep and weaken the grip.
Axes have too much mass and much too much momentum (with that mass at the other end) for good speed and returns.
Shovels should be selected to be short and light to allow for good speed. Home Depot, and other garden centers, will have small gardening shovels that are perfect. They may lack the flat edges that can be sharpened (and, yes, there is a legit reason to sharpen one edge of a shovel used for roadside emergencies), but they are easily stored under/behind a seat along with your jack.
Anything you can carry in your car for roadside emergencies should be selected with it's use as a weapon as well.
fistful
October 19, 2004, 01:40 AM
Anything you can carry in your car for roadside emergencies should be selected with it's use as a weapon as well. Even a compass? :p
Simon, you chill out. Is it against the law to have an ax in one's vehicle? You're going to set up some alibi with your friend so you don't get caught having an ax without a "sporting purpose"? You owe no explanation for having some mundane tool in your truck. It's not a lock-pick or a stick of dynamite. If a cop asked my why I have an ax behind the seat of my truck, I'd ask him, "Why not?" I had a similar experience with a knife, and refused to answer the question, as I am not required to give a reason for legally carrying a legal item. If your friend fumbles or gives information different from yours, you then look very suspicious.
Just be honest. I'd kill a blue helmet before I'd lie to him.
hso
October 19, 2004, 11:30 AM
Even a compass?
If you've ever gotten bonked on the head by a 2 lb. metal Brunton Pocket Transit (don't ask) you'll wonder if they weren't intended as a weapon:D http://www.stanleylondon.com/brunton.htm
effengee
October 19, 2004, 12:17 PM
I just thought of a good one:
A Leatherman pocket tool...
Just grip it in your hand and punch. Instant brass knuckles! Replace in pouch before anyone notices and claim you hit them barehanded.
A good knife will do you better than any improvised weapon and IIRC the self defense laws against carrying in most states deals with concealed blades in excess of 4". You can wear a K-bar on your hip plain as day and suffer nothing more than some weird looks and the usual "why do you need something like that?" which always come from ignorant unarmed victim-type people. A cop or a bad guy will know...
An ax, hammer, shovel, pick, pry-bar, and any other non-powered hand tool, is in NO WAY considered a weapon until it is used to commit a crime. Then it is both a weapon and evidence, and subject to confiscation.
If a cop asks me why I have any of these present, anywhere in my vehicle, it's just curiosity. Tell them any reason but for self defense.
If you live in a state that won't allow billy clubs or ninja stuff, and want something better than a tire iron, then get what is called an "E-tool" through a military surplus place. They fold up small and look nothing like a weapon in their belt pouch. These are made to not only dig in or out, but already are sharpened for cutting limbs; natural and human.
Matter of fact, Special Forces are taught how to use it with full lethality.
It can cause serious damage even if you aren't that skilled.
EVERYBODY can swing a shovel at somebody's head and get one lucky hit.
That's sometimes all it takes.
State laws must be closely studied and scrutinized.
Most name and ban any type of sword, battle axe, billy club or blackjack for self defense. However, I have friend who's into medieval re-enactment and often carries a mace or a some such in his truck. He's always got a sword in a scabbard in his gun rack. He's driven through many States where they are banned for use as self defense, but the few times he's been pulled over the one time any cop ever said anything was:
"I was going to ask about the sword until I saw your bumper stickers..."
The entire truck is covered with medieval faire promo's and sayings like:
"Have you hugged your Unicorn lately"
"Knight seeking Damsel in distress"
"Ask me about edged weapons, I dare you"
I don't know about you guys, but here in Vermont it's legal to have a full gun rack in your truck's back window. Granted, the law states that it can't be loaded but the magazine/ammo doesn't need to be locked up either.
Handguns are allowed to be loaded but the Police, If they say anything about it, will ask that handguns be concealed. It scares the tourists.
If I get pulled over while carrying, I don't legally even have to tell the officer I am armed UNLESS he specifically asks me: "Are you carrying any weapons?" which they will typically only ask right before they search you or your car for whatever reason...
I tell them right after they ask for license and registration.
My hands on the wheel at 10-2, the engine off, in a clear and calm voice:
"Officer, I think I'm supposed to tell you that I have a handgun with me."
I've been thanked and told that legally I don't have to.
I usually get asked the famous question of the curious fellow shooter:
"What kind of gun do you carry?"
Sometimes I've been jokingly told something like:
"Well, as long as I don't see it while I'm talking to you, that's O.K."
Whatever you do, don't put a weapon in your car that you have no familiarity on how to use it as such...
jim
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