Whats this guy talking about?


PDA






boo17
August 20, 2004, 11:34 PM
Scroll down on this website and the guy who made it describes different ammo calibers. Scroll down more and it will list "dying calibers". Listed are the .454 Casull, .44 special, .300 Savage .300 WinMag, .357 Sig, .38 super, 10mm, and all shotgun guages except 12. What is this guy thinking; some of these cartridges are fairly new, like the .454 casull and the .357 sig.. Do you believe a word on this site, or is he completely full of it?

If you enjoyed reading about "Whats this guy talking about?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
PBIR
August 20, 2004, 11:35 PM
...


and the url is? (drumroll...)

Sunray
August 20, 2004, 11:56 PM
Whatever the site is, the guy is right and he's wrong. Some calibres just don't make it, commercially. The .41AE is an example. Good idea that got smashed by the .40 S&W. Now, IAI isn't making ammo or brass. I'm really happy I bought 500 cases when I bought the barrel. Mind you, finding suitable cast .41 cal bullets is a problem.
He's nuts about all shotgun ammo but 12 ga dying. Lots of 20 gauges around and it's likely the best training round. Likewise the .300 Win Mag. It's become a standard.
I wouldn't worry too much about the guy's opinions. The .45-70 has been dying for 100 years.

RJ357
August 20, 2004, 11:57 PM
It's probably just that they are absent from the stock of dealers and stores that sell nothing but the most popular calibers. Those calibers are particularly rare at the gun shows around here, for example.

Sylvilagus Aquaticus
August 21, 2004, 01:20 AM
Isn't that why it's called the Errornet?

I guess since everyone has an opinion one must have the smarts to be able to filter what one believes as the truth for themself.

AllI know is what I read, hear, and experience first-hand. From that, I run it through my tests and make my decisions as to the validity of such information as I find useful to myself. That's why I carry a 357sig...because it's such a 'dead cartrige'.

Regards,
Rabbit.

Justin
August 21, 2004, 01:53 AM
Oddly enough, I can find at least half of all of the calibers on that list in a local drug store. If the local Long's Drugs sells enough 10mm for it to be profitable, I hardly see how it's a "dying cartridge."

:rolleyes:

whm1974
August 21, 2004, 08:05 AM
Oddly enough, I can find at least half of all of the calibers on that list in a local drug store. If the local Long's Drugs sells enough 10mm for it to be profitable, I hardly see how it's a "dying cartridge."

Some cartiages take a long time to die.

-Bill

boo17
August 21, 2004, 09:02 AM
sorry.
http://www.alpinesurvival.com/gtg-ammo.htm

spin180
August 21, 2004, 09:39 AM
Well, according to his site, the calibers listed are those that would be hard to find in a post-SHTF situation. For that, he isn't necessarily wrong...

But he does have some real gems on his web-page. For instance:

My favorite tactical pistol to date is an H/k sitcom Mark 23; the very side arm of our elite Special Forces and it uses a caliber designed 90 years ago. The Mark 23 is the only 45 pistol I’ve seen that is not a jammer.

HK 'Sitcom' Mark 23? 'Sitcom'? Oh dear Lord, that's funny! Seriously! :D

And it's the only .45 cal. pistol that's not a 'jammer'... :scrutiny: :rolleyes:

I'm about to bust a gut! :p :D

jsalcedo
August 21, 2004, 09:42 AM
From the website:

My favorite tactical pistol to date is an H/k sitcom Mark 23;

:rolleyes:

mtnbkr
August 21, 2004, 09:44 AM
The title is "Dying Calibers in Post-survival times"

Emphasis mine.

If he's talking about what's useful after TEOTWAWKI, then he's right. Those calibers aren't going to very common.

I disagree with the common American calibers like 270, 357mag, etc. However, 454, 28ga, and 280, for example, are going to be a bit harder to come by, IMO.

Chris

444
August 21, 2004, 09:48 AM
I will actually have to read the link you provided to see what this guy is talking about but, I really enjoy thinking about this subject.
I just had a discussion the other day with a guy about the .22 WMR being a dying cartridge.

IMO, basically there is no good reason for that cartridge to exist. There are other cartridges that are very close to it ballistically that are better for some reason. Again, IMO it doesn't have a whole lot to do with popularity.
For example: the 12 gauge shotgun. Anything that can be done with any other shotugn can be done better with a 12 gauge. I may be out of touch on this but I don't see much difference in recoil so I think this even holds true for teaching new shooters or particularly small persons. This doesn't mean that you can't buy .410 shells, it doesn't mean that you arn't allowed to own one, all it means is that there is no real good reason to do so.
.300 Win Mag.: I have never really seen the sense in it myself. It is slightly better than the .30-06. It's main advantage occurs at ranges that are beyond the capabilities of the average hunter in terms of range. I have always been a believer in the theory that if you don't think the .30-06 is adequate for your purposes, then you need to take a BIG step up to at least a .338 Win Mag or more. I guess along the same line of reasoning, the .30-06 fits into that same catagory when compared to the .308. The '06 does some things slightly better than the .308, but the difference is so small as to be almost not worth talking about. So, if you have a .308, there is no reason to ever buy a .30-06 and vice versa. And if they don't do the job, go big or stay home.
Again, this doesn't mean that any of those calibers are going by the way side: there are far too many of them out there for that to happen. But, there isn't a lot of point in having a dozen different cartridges that are very close to the same thing.

Cyanide_357
August 21, 2004, 09:50 AM
This guy doesn't know what he is talking about... must have gotten alot of his information from video games.

357 Sig is increasing popularity for one... but also, (hopefully I'm correct about this), he listed 308 NATO as being 7.62x54... 308 NATO is 7.62x51 isn't it?

Aside from the incorrect information (or opinions), there's something about the site I just don't like... can't pick it out though.

Cyanide

10 Ring Tao
August 21, 2004, 11:18 AM
Aside from the incorrect information (or opinions), there's something about the site I just don't like... can't pick it out though.

Maybe its the fact all this info only relates to the survival of christian families:

When outfitting a Christian family for personal self-defense firearms it is wise to keep everyone on the same page caliber wise,

azrael
August 21, 2004, 12:02 PM
Sunray
41 ae you say?? funny thing...One of the FFL's that distributes my holsters (not enough BTW!), has like 6 boxes of the Speer GDHP for the 41AE...no, not components, preloaded and ready to go...

Guy came in several years ago, and prepaid him for the order...never came back and picked them up...They are out there

neat huh?

jeff-10
August 21, 2004, 12:11 PM
This guy doesn't know what he is talking about... must have gotten alot of his information from video games.

I like that line. You probably don't like that web site because he is talking like he is the end of all authority on the subject of modern firearms. Anyone who thinks 243, 270, 357 Sig, 30-30 and 20 gauge rounds will be hard to come by in the US, even in a survival situation, doesnt know what he is talking about.

Malamute
August 21, 2004, 12:26 PM
The guy that wrote the article is a little off base on several things. He mentions a "lifetime of experience", but doesn't know what "ACP" means in a caliber designation. I wouldn't trust any of his advice.

The "sitcom" H-K pistol was a hoot!

Maybe I don't have the right attitude, but I gave up thinking the "End of the World" was imminent. People have been forcasting it, with lots of "justification" and "evidence" for 30 years that I know of. I heartily concur that we shoould be prepared for difficulties in general, but other than a major natural disaster or temporary economic difficulties I just don't worry much about it anymore, and think it would be more localized than global. In any event, IF something major happened, waiting to find any amount of ammo AFTER the fact is waitng a bit too long.

xdoctor
August 21, 2004, 01:00 PM
I've often wondered about that. I really don't pay much attention to weather or not I'll be able to find ammo in a SHTF situation. The way I look at it, there are going to be be a lot more people buying up all the 9mm and .45 than there will be buying 10mm and .40. If things get to where its hard to find ammo, you didn't stock up enough.

Mal H
August 21, 2004, 01:45 PM
Cyanide_357: "This guy doesn't know what he is talking about... must have gotten alot of his information from video games."

I've gotta agree with that assessment. Just looking at the .45 ACP blurb alone, I found 5 fairly serious errors in his gun knowledge and then stopped counting. It does put the remainder of his "advice" in a questionable light.

boo17
August 21, 2004, 03:37 PM
whats TEOTWAWKI and SHTF?

Cyanide_357
August 21, 2004, 03:49 PM
wow, my post got alot of quotes used... I feel special.. :D

I wonder if the "sitcom" part was on his part, or if he originally used 'socom' and the spell check automatically changed it and he didn't notice. I had a simular problem with 'claymore', and it changed it to clamore, or such.

The strange 'feeling' I got/didn't like about the site was the overly religious thing... hinted to me to be simular to an extreamist... or racist... possibility.. but I just didn't want to be the one that said it.

I really don't care, thats his 'opinion' / 'right'... I'm not offended or anything... I'm not a minority or anything. Just your run of the mill caucasian [read: white person].

Cyanide

priv8ter
August 21, 2004, 03:54 PM
TEOTWAWKI: The end of the world as We Know it.

SHTF: Stuff Hitting The Fan.

If you stick around here long enough, you'll figure about 25% of our threads have that in there somewhere.

greg

Jim K
August 21, 2004, 04:09 PM
Malamute, people have been predicting the end of the world since, well, the beginning of the world. Probably won't matter to any of us; if I get hit by a truck tomorrow morning, that is the end of the world as far as I am concerned.

Jim

Roadkill Coyote
August 21, 2004, 07:27 PM
The "H/k sitcom Mark 23" is actually a rare prototype that was used by Wally and the Beaver in the lost TEOTWAWKI episode.

Carrying_1
August 21, 2004, 07:42 PM
He does make a great case for the 22lr thou. I need to get one. soon.

priv8ter
August 21, 2004, 08:05 PM
You don't have a .22??!?!??!?!?!??! :what:

Well, I'm going to admit that I don't have 10,000 rounds of .22 for each gun in that caliber :o

Now that I look a little closer, I see he also lists 7.62 X 39 on his list of 'Dying Caliber's in Post-Survival' times. I disagree with that one. I usually have more rounds of 7.62 X 39 on hand than I do .22lr. And, I find it much more useful in the 'hunting and personal defense' catagorys. I also disagree with where he placed .30-30 on the list. Although...around here in Washington, .30-30 is sometimes tougher to find.

greg

If you enjoyed reading about "Whats this guy talking about?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!