What's in his nasssty pocketsesss?


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Oleg Volk
August 21, 2004, 03:57 AM
http://www.olegvolk.net/gallery/albums/arms/pockets.sized.jpg
Bigger file (http://www.olegvolk.net/gallery/arms/pockets)

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Harry Tuttle
August 21, 2004, 05:18 AM
diagraming that sentence finds a subject "you" missing in action

Mayhaps:

If a mugger orders, "Empty your Pockets"

MMcCall
August 21, 2004, 05:35 AM
So we're just to assume that the mugger is somehow justifying the use of deadly force?

0007
August 21, 2004, 08:03 AM
Uhhhh, yes...:neener:

sm
August 21, 2004, 08:47 AM
I like it !
As Always - great pic Oleg !

Gives new meaning to " keep the change" ;)

Raistlin
August 21, 2004, 08:59 AM
Great photo composition, Oleg!

But the wording, well...

:confused:

mtnbkr
August 21, 2004, 09:14 AM
So we're just to assume that the mugger is somehow justifying the use of deadly force?

Yes, since muggings are normally done under threat of deadly force.

Chris

MMcCall
August 21, 2004, 09:24 AM
I guess I'm just a little leery, as use of deadly force solely to protect property is very rarely acceptable in the eyes of the law. If your mugger ends up armed with nothing more than a pointy finger in his pocket, you're going to have some 'splaining to do :)

mtnbkr
August 21, 2004, 09:44 AM
use of deadly force solely to protect property

:banghead: :banghead:

A mugging is an act of violence. It's no longer about property at that point. What, do I have to wait until he shoots or stabs me before I can protect myself and my family? Do I have to ask, "mister mugger, is that your finger or a gun?".

Chris

BryanP
August 21, 2004, 09:47 AM
Great poster Oleg. If horizontal space is a problem for the wording you might try this:

If a mugger says "Empty Your Pockets"

Stand_Watie
August 21, 2004, 09:55 AM
Those grips are stunning. What kind of wood is that?

That particular photo deserves to be in an ad campaign for the pistol.

Nathaniel Firethorn
August 21, 2004, 10:33 AM
Oleg,

It could be read as subornation of homicide. Which could land you in a whole heap of trouble in a couple of ways I can think of.

Which we wouldn't want! ;)

- pdmoderator

Tamara
August 21, 2004, 10:40 AM
"If a mugger orders you to empty your pockets..." :)


Great photo! :cool:

R.H. Lee
August 21, 2004, 12:21 PM
The muzzle blast alone would probably set the mugger on fire. :p

Nice pocket gun photo, Oleg.

Oleg Volk
August 21, 2004, 12:25 PM
Just edited the caption, see the updated image.

rl2669
August 21, 2004, 01:09 PM
Someone else did a cute Photoshop pic at one point of some sweet young thing stuck in a broken down car in the 'hood. As the gang members were closing in to presumably rob/rape/kill her, tire irons and chains in hand, the caption says: "Got Glock?"

Of course with the stylized G's.

It was great. Wish I had a copy handy to post. Gaston and crew should use this as ad-copy.

Rob

wasrjoe
August 21, 2004, 02:47 PM
I like it. Of course, the idea of killing someone (even in self defense) will always offend some people. That doesn't mean that I (or you) should care about those people's opinions...

SunBear
August 21, 2004, 03:15 PM
Get a clue, people!!! MUGGING is slang for and by definition ARMED robbery. Whether or not he is actually armed is COMPLETELY immaterial. If he has convinced you that he is armed, then in the eyes of the law - HE IS ARMED and an armed response is entirely appropriate. Takin' out the trash. Happy trails.

ChristopherG
August 21, 2004, 03:23 PM
diagraming that sentence finds a subject "you" missing in action

The english imperative (i.e., 'give') carries an implied second person subject.

Johnson
August 21, 2004, 03:39 PM
I guess I'm just a little leery, as use of deadly force solely to protect property is very rarely acceptable in the eyes of the law. If your mugger ends up armed with nothing more than a pointy finger in his pocket, you're going to have some 'splaining to do

You gaurantee that I won't get killed, and reimburse me, and I'll bend over for the mugger. If not, he should be met with heavy resistance. :)

Dave Markowitz
August 21, 2004, 03:56 PM
Mugging = robbery. Robbery = theft accomplished through the actual use of or threat of force.

I like the pic.

BryanP
August 21, 2004, 04:10 PM
Very nice.

Mr. Kook
August 21, 2004, 04:33 PM
Mugging involves threatening force in order to coerce valuables from a person(s).

The act of mugging justifies using whatever response is necessary to eliminate the threat.

Some muggers are out for property. Others will kill you to avoid jail. All threaten violence or murder in order to achieve victim compliance.

Act accordingly.

Mr. Kook
August 21, 2004, 04:34 PM
Love the pic Oleg.

Dr.Rob
August 21, 2004, 04:43 PM
Nice Colt!

Good photo, strong message.

priv8ter
August 21, 2004, 05:03 PM
I think the revised version makes more sence, and probably comes across as more 'PC' since you mention life being threatened.

greg

Roc_Kor
August 21, 2004, 05:20 PM
Oleg does it again! w00t!! :D


All hail Oleg! :p

Very nice. The revised version is VERY clever. Another pic I'll be adding to my Oleg collection! :D

The_Antibubba
August 21, 2004, 05:36 PM
They can have My Precious when they pry it from my cold dead hands!

Standing Wolf
August 21, 2004, 06:04 PM
Great photograph!

"Fiver" is British for a five-pound note. "Five" is American for a five-dollar bill.

I'd headline it: "If a mugger threatens your life for a five, give him six"

MMcCall
August 21, 2004, 06:17 PM
The revision is sweet. The original just had a little bit of a Bernhard Goetz feel to it.

magsnubby
August 21, 2004, 06:31 PM
Oleg,
Very nice.

Mugging is a violent crime. Doesn't matter if the bg shows a weapon or not. Violance is implied.

I look at it this way:
I have emphysema, so every day i get out of bed and drag my ragged self to work it jeopardizes my health (whats left of it). A mugger wants my money, he just put my health in jeopardy which just threatened my life. I will respond accordingly.

jojosdad
August 21, 2004, 07:04 PM
Oleg - great poster (again) - but - who made those stunning grips? Where can you get them?

Muzzleflash
August 21, 2004, 07:37 PM
Fiver is fine.

BryanP
August 21, 2004, 07:58 PM
I've heard "fiver" used many times to refer to a $5 bill.

Persnickety
August 21, 2004, 08:50 PM
Well . . if my gun is a five shot, and he asks for a fiver . . . it seems only polite to comply.

mcneill
August 21, 2004, 09:39 PM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess I'm just a little leery, as use of deadly force solely to protect property is very rarely acceptable in the eyes of the law. If your mugger ends up armed with nothing more than a pointy finger in his pocket, you're going to have some 'splaining to do
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You should move to Texas.:D


Oleg - Good one, as always.


Jim

Archie
August 21, 2004, 09:57 PM
"If a mugger threatens your life for a five, offer him six!"

This implies a conditional response which I think is appropriate.

BHPshooter
August 21, 2004, 11:14 PM
I love it, Oleg.

If you read just the caption, it sounds like something out of the New Testament.

I'd be much more thrilled with going to church if Jesus said something like that! :D

Wes

Stand_Watie
August 21, 2004, 11:20 PM
British colloquialisms have become common enough in American parlance recently that I think that the catchiness of 'fiver' over 'five' outweighs the possibility of some people not knowing what a fiver is.

I suppose if you are going to convert to actual dollar value it would be between 7 and 8 anyway:D

SteelyDan
August 21, 2004, 11:38 PM
I like Archie's suggestion ("offer him six"), because otherwise it sounds like the mugger says "Give me $5 or I'll kill you," and you decide to kill him rather than pay the $5.

Nightfall
August 22, 2004, 10:29 AM
Great as always!

M2 Carbine
August 22, 2004, 10:50 AM
MMcCall

I guess I'm just a little leery, as use of deadly force solely to protect property is very rarely acceptable in the eyes of the law. If your mugger ends up armed with nothing more than a pointy finger in his pocket, you're going to have some 'splaining to do
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I love Texas law:D

Property can be a dollar bill.

Don't take my money and run, you'll only die tired.;)



Sec. 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property:
~ ~ (1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.41; and
~ ~ (2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:
~ ~ ~ (A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or
~ ~ ~ (B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and
~ ~ (3) he reasonably believes that:
~ ~ ~ (A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or
~ ~ ~ (B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.

M2 Carbine
August 22, 2004, 11:12 AM
Oleg Volk

Just edited the caption, see the updated image.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Nice work.
Good looking Colt.

I like the first one. (second one to)
Direct and to the point.:)


BTW,
I hate our use of the word "Mugger". It's like "Undocumented Worker".

It's a politically correct way of making a serious crime sound like a minor inconvenience against society.:fire:

Oleg Volk
August 22, 2004, 02:26 PM
And Gollum's eyes hurt from the bright muzzle flash...

I edited the text once more.

R.H. Lee
August 22, 2004, 02:39 PM
Mugger: "Gimme yer money"
Victim: "I think I've only got 5 on me" (reaching in pocket)
Mugger: "Gimme %$# or I'll @#$"
Victim: (Drawing pony from pocket) "Nope, I've got 6, you want 'em all?"
Mugger: (Jaw drops, eyes widen, beats feet)..................

Johnson
August 22, 2004, 02:44 PM
Mugger: "Gimme yer money"
Victim: "I think I've only got 5 on me" (reaching in pocket)
Mugger: "Gimme %$# or I'll @#$"
Victim: (Drawing pony from pocket) "Nope, I've got 6, you want 'em all?"
Mugger: (Jaw drops, eyes widen, beats feet)..................Blood spurts from holes in chest.

I fixed it for you.

Treylis
August 22, 2004, 04:18 PM
Nice, nice.

SMLE
August 22, 2004, 08:28 PM
How about a series of these with different guns? Just change the "offer him ***" to match the capacity of the particular piece. Then sell them as t-shirts? Personally, I love Colt snubbies, but the G-lock folks and 1911 folks etc.. may feel left out. :neener:

Don Gwinn
August 23, 2004, 12:01 AM
Actually, Johnson, that one IS murder, even in Texas. . . . . . :uhoh:

Range Ninja
August 23, 2004, 12:13 AM
How exactly is that murder in Texas? The mugger is threatening you, may even kill you and wants your property. In Texas if that mugger is caught doing that after sunset, he is as good as dead. That is Texas law.

Range Ninja
August 23, 2004, 12:17 AM
One more thing I'd like to add, If I'm being mugged I reasonably think I'm in substantial risk of death and or bodily injury - and I will act accordingly.

Gixerman1000
August 23, 2004, 12:18 AM
Nice, and it is just fine the way it is.

Stand_Watie
August 23, 2004, 12:22 AM
How exactly is that murder in Texas? The mugger is threatening you, may even kill you and wants your property. In Texas if that mugger is caught doing that after sunset, he is as good as dead. That is Texas law

If you reasonably believe that he may kill or seriously injure you it's not murder (sunset or not). Otherwise it's dependant upon whether or not he's actually already gotten your money.

keyhole
August 23, 2004, 12:49 AM
Great job Oleg! Another Gold Medal!:D

Gifted
August 23, 2004, 01:18 AM
Do you put these on a website I can link to or something? I want to spread the joy.

Archie
August 23, 2004, 01:45 AM
And I think any other round count weapon would just not have the same 'song' to it.

F'rinstance: "If he demands five, offer him seventeen." See? The 'five' and 'six' have a connection. It 'sings'.


I suppose one could show a large capacity autopistol and make the caption
"If he demands five, offer to up the ante."



The only other asthetically pleasing combination would be a S&W Chief's Special, and the caption would be

"If he demands five, offer him five."

or

"If he demands five, offer to oblige."

TonyB
August 23, 2004, 09:21 AM
I always said I'd give up money to a robber.....50 cents at a time(the cost of 38+P+ ammo):cool:

M2 Carbine
August 23, 2004, 11:00 AM
Don Gwinn

Actually, Johnson, that one IS murder, even in Texas. . . . . .
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Actually it IS NOT murder in Texas.


TX law
"(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime"

("NIGHTTIME" refers ONLY to theft or criminal mischief.)





("IMMINENT COMMISSION of......robbery")
True example,

Man is jogging and is stopped by man demanding money. (no gun shown)

Jogger pulls out a 38 and kills Mugger.

Jogger is "No Billed" by Grand Jury.




You are not only protecting your property (money) but you are protecting yourself from possible harm.

TX law
"PC§9.32. Deadly force in defense of person.
(a) A person is justified in using deadly force against another:

(A) to protect himself against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful deadly force; OR

(B) to prevent the other's imminent commission of aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery."

("aggravated" means if they have a weapon)
(it's interesting that you can shoot to stop a "aggravated kidnapping" but not a "kidnapping")




You folks that live in the repressive socialist states really need to take your rights and state governments back.:(

MagKnightX
August 23, 2004, 11:33 AM
I think he was referring to the fact that the mugger was retreating. I think that once they retreat, you cannot shoot them. Though, if you want to make a citizen's arrest, there is always the classic "Stop or I'll shoot!"

BHPshooter
August 23, 2004, 11:48 AM
How about a series of these with different guns? Just change the "offer him ***" to match the capacity of the particular piece. Then sell them as t-shirts? Personally, I love Colt snubbies, but the G-lock folks and 1911 folks etc.. may feel left out.

That's a pretty cool idea.

I like the latest caption, Oleg. ;)

Wes

M2 Carbine
August 23, 2004, 11:52 AM
"MagKnightX,
I think he was referring to the fact that the mugger was retreating. I think that once they retreat, you cannot shoot them. Though, if you want to make a citizen's arrest, there is always the classic "Stop or I'll shoot!"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As long as they still have your property (money) you CAN shoot them.
(if there is no other immediate way to recover your property)

If you SEE them drop your property, you can NOT shoot because you are no longer protecting or trying to recover your property.


True example

Girl with 22 confronts a man in the garage.
Man takes power tool.
Girl tells him to put it down and get out.
He tries to leave with tool (property)
Girl shoots him. (I don't remember if she killed him or not)

(obviously the girl can not overpower the man to recover her property)



"TX law
(B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and

(3) he reasonably believes that:

(A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or

(B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury."

roo_ster
August 23, 2004, 01:20 PM
Oleg:

Man, that Colt is so purty, it almost made me cry.

*****

Man oh man, why did I wait so long to move to Texas?

spacemanspiff
August 23, 2004, 02:52 PM
tell you what MMCall, put your finger in your pocket and point it at the nearest cop, while saying "gimme your wallet punk!"

i think maybe you are still under the assumption that the best advice is to 'comply with your attackers demands'.

that advice may have been useful 15-20 years ago when the average criminal was afraid of being charged with murder. nowadays, murderers dont always have to face their entire prison sentence and thanks to the inept justice system, they may not even see any jail time. so the average criminal today doesnt give a hoot if they kill their victim.

and a criminal does not have to display a deadly weapon in order to make their intended victim fear for their life.

Johnny Guest
August 24, 2004, 11:21 PM
(Image of a J-frame Smith - - -)

"If he demands five, LET HIM HAVE IT!"



Hey, just kidding! Honest, I'm a pacifist.

:rolleyes:
Johnny

MMcCall
August 25, 2004, 06:24 AM
tell you what MMCall, put your finger in your pocket and point it at the nearest cop, while saying "gimme your wallet punk!"

i think maybe you are still under the assumption that the best advice is to 'comply with your attackers demands'.

Uh, no, but thanks for playing. I was simply saying that the original wording of the illustration didn't imply imminent threat of physical force on the mugger's side, and could have been misleading.

Each situation is unique, and would be judged accordingly.

cls12vg30
August 25, 2004, 12:48 PM
I'd also like to see something like this with other weapons, while "Offer him seventeen" with a Glock may not flow to nicely, I think a Makarov with the caption, "If a mugger threatens your life for a five, offer him eight." sounds okay. (Or nine if you want to assume one in the pipe.)

StopTheGrays
August 25, 2004, 01:21 PM
If a mugger threatens your life for a five, offer him six

Maybe add:
If a mugger threatens your life for a five, offer him six instead .

Or:

If a mugger threatens your life for a five, offer him six in return .

StandOnGuard
August 27, 2004, 05:02 AM
Like the new picture. I've also used your site a few times in debating with anti-gun folks.

tyme
August 27, 2004, 09:01 AM
Totally agree with sentiment.

Legally, it makes me nervous. It suggests shooting until you run out of ammo, which is not necessarily legal.

Double Maduro
August 27, 2004, 01:52 PM
Oleg,

Such a nice image, and look what you started.

"Your use of the language is wrong.

Your use of the language is correct, but misguided.

What you must have meant is-------.

Of course you don't mean it is ok to shoot someone for trying to take your money!"

The list goes on and on.

All because of a pretty poster.

At least you made people think.

DM

Robert J McElwain
August 27, 2004, 02:11 PM
Question:

If you are mugged, what are the odds that the mugger is high on drugs and will shoot you, whether you comply or not? IE, does a drug crazed mugger give a damn about your life?

Bob

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