Anybody Ever Stop To Chuckle At the Irony???


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cslinger
August 23, 2004, 12:30 PM
You know the old saying "Be careful what you wish for....."

Because of ole' Diane Finstein, the Brady bunch and so on we have more EBR's on the street then ever would have been produced were there have been no bans or PR. We also have some of the finest pocket guns ever created due, I believe in no small part, to the magazine limitations.

Before the 1994 ban these firearms were not exactly flying off the shelves but with the Ban we now have huge demand and everybody makes an AR varient of some kind. Come September more people are going to buy more EBR's and full capcity magazines then ever imagined.

All this because of few people's misguided attempts to get these weapons off the streets. So what did they accomplish the exact opposite of what they wanted.

You just gotta love that. You just gotta laugh. I wonder if these folks kick themselves or lose sleep over this fact. Me personally I crack a big grin everytime I think of it.

Here is hoping the ban goes the way of the Dodo and the streets are flooded with EBR's and big magazines.

Chris:D

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R.H. Lee
August 23, 2004, 12:33 PM
Nearly everything leftists do is counterproductive to the stated purpose. However, nearly every leftist stated purpose is a smokescreen. Their real goal is create as much dependency in as many victim-groups as possible. This is their constituency and what keeps them in power.

notbubba
August 23, 2004, 01:02 PM
:banghead:

EBR = Evil Black Rifle

Diggler
August 23, 2004, 01:07 PM
Our morning show guy, Jim Quinn (http://www.warroom.com), has what he calls "Quinn's First Law":

Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.

Try to find an exception. You can't. Welfare creates poverty. Gun control results in more guns being sold. The list goes on.

cslinger
August 23, 2004, 01:38 PM
Notbubba,

Can I assume you do not like the term EBR?

Chris

RobW
August 23, 2004, 02:21 PM
Remember the "Prohibition"? Americans NEVER drank so much alcohol than during the "Prohibition". Additionally, ith brought the Mob to violent life.

Thank you, Carrie Nation!

The biggest threat to this country are the busybodies with the unsiatable urge to tell the people how they have to live their lifes.

Their slogan: "Don't do as I do, do as I say!"

Cacique500
August 23, 2004, 03:00 PM
My first EBR (sorry notbubba but I *like* the term! :) ) will be arriving on 9/15/04. Colt LE6920.

Can't wait!

Correia
August 23, 2004, 03:01 PM
You know, that Quinn's law is interesting. I can't really think of anything that violates it.

Social Security to help old folks retire, not they are even poorer because they are counting on SS instead of saving for themselves, and the next generations can't afford to save as much because their checks are getting robbed to pay for SS. :)

CJ
August 23, 2004, 03:10 PM
I'm trying to remember a list that I heard at a talk by Alan Gotlieb once...something like:

Banning small caliber, cheap guns (Saturday Night Specials)...leads to criminals using better, more reliable, larger caliber weapons.

Grr, he listed about 5 or 6 comments like this. Anyone heard one of his presentations on this topic and can remember more of them?

Diggler
August 23, 2004, 03:17 PM
Zero tolerance for violence in schools... more school shootings.
Gun confiscation leads to increases in violence in AU and GB.
"Save the forests" leads to build up of tinder and the lack of access roads, which destroys millions of acres due to forest fires.
Anti-war protests fuel more fighting by insurgents around the world.

Carlos Cabeza
August 23, 2004, 03:21 PM
It ain't about guns baby, it's about control. Yes I DO think it's funny !:D

TimRB
August 23, 2004, 04:13 PM
"All this because of few people's misguided attempts to get these weapons off the streets. So what did they accomplish the exact opposite of what they wanted. "

I know what you're saying, and I agree completely, but I would not use the words "off the streets" simply because the Feinstein crew always implies that any firearm in the hands of a private, law-abiding citizen is "on the street".

Another irony is now that the AWB seems on the way out, the gun-grabbers are in the position of hoping like crazy that there is a lot of crime committed with the banned weapons.

Tim

Kharn
August 23, 2004, 04:28 PM
And Sarah Brady is the NRA's best source of money and members:
Whenever she opens her mouth, new members and donations flock to the NRA.

I'll have to remember Quinn's First Law, sadly, I could probably use it a lot.

Kharn

GigaBuist
August 23, 2004, 05:11 PM
That law is the only reason I own an AR, and two AK's, and more magazines than I can imagine ever needing or using. My initial gun purchases were setup so that I got EXACTLY what they were trying to take away.

... and I'd have probably never bought any if I wasn't afraid I wouldn't be able to in a few years.

SAWBONES
August 23, 2004, 06:21 PM
Even more interestingly, the "AWB" spawned a generation of small, easily carried, easily concealed CCW pistols, each of which used magazines containg ten or fewer rounds, representing a market that barely even existed before '94!

Oh, the pleasant irony of the hoplophobes getting the exact opposite of what they intended, and having it occur because of their own actions!
I smile whenever I think of it.

stv
August 23, 2004, 06:31 PM
If the streets are flooded, I'll be out there with a couple of big nets and my fishing pole. :)

RobW
August 23, 2004, 07:38 PM
Another irony is now that the AWB seems on the way out, the gun-grabbers are in the position of hoping like crazy that there is a lot of crime committed with the banned weapons.
Politicos want to rule and control
Only frightened people accept rule and control
Violent criminals frighten prople

= Politicos NEED violent criminals

boofus
August 23, 2004, 07:43 PM
That jackass lautenberg is the reason I went out and bought a machinegun. I figured the prices would keep going up due to his poison pill amendment in the FOPA until regular people couldn't afford even the entry level MGs so I better get one while I can.

If MACs were still $250 and MP5s were $2000 and there was no limit on how many could be made I probably wouldn't have been in such a hurry to buy.

1911Ron
August 23, 2004, 07:59 PM
I don't think that they stayawake at night worrying about their mistakes or anything else, other than how to make it harder to own any type of weapon that they don't like.:cuss: :fire: :banghead:

BryanP
August 23, 2004, 08:08 PM
That law is the only reason I own an AR, and two AK's, and more magazines than I can imagine ever needing or using. My initial gun purchases were setup so that I got EXACTLY what they were trying to take away.

Now that sounds familiar. I really enjoy my levergun and the boltgun I just bought, but I've gone out of my way to get an AR, an AK, and soon a FAL - not because I really really wanted them but more just to !@#$% Them Off. It's just incidental that I discovered that those guns are a lot of fun to shoot.

cslinger
August 23, 2004, 08:16 PM
Bryan P,

Your SIG line ......The TICK????? SPOOOOOOONNNNN!!!!!!

BryanP
August 23, 2004, 08:38 PM
Chris,

Some other favorites (I much preferred the animated to the live action series, but the live action had some good quotes too)

I am MIGHTY!!

Ah, Ha! I'll bounce off that broad, flat surface!

Aaaaaarrrrggghhhh!!!! Gravity is a harsh mistress.

Oh, and you can download sound clips from both here -

http://www.thetick.ws/sounds.htm


Why no, I'm not a fan at all. ;)

Standing Wolf
August 23, 2004, 09:03 PM
If the leftist extremists were capable of anticipating the results of their actions, they'd already have begun to outgrow leftist extremism.

mcneill
August 23, 2004, 09:37 PM
Good point, cslinger. Sort of the law of Unintended Consequenses.

Jim

reagansquad
August 23, 2004, 10:55 PM
"Our morning show guy, Jim Quinn, has what he calls "Quinn's First Law":

Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.

Try to find an exception. You can't. Welfare creates poverty. Gun control results in more guns being sold. The list goes on."

-Peace rallies don't create wars.
-A higher minimum wage doesn't cause people to make less $ per hour.
-Better environmental laws don't cause pollution.
Need some more?

cslinger
August 23, 2004, 11:11 PM
Reagansquad.

Peace rallies have been known to humor inserrections etc.

Higher minimum wage typically leads to less jobs.

Ya got me on the environmental laws though :D

I wasn't flaming you just calling it how I see it. You have good points.

Chris

boofus
August 23, 2004, 11:13 PM
Environmental laws can cause noise pollution. If they passed a law making it illegal to kill any sort of living thing all the frogs, crickets, cats, wolves, cicadas, and whatever else will start making noises at night that normally wouldn't be around to do it. :D

JohnKSa
August 23, 2004, 11:16 PM
A guy named "Anti" just won silver in 3 position rifle...

Morgan
August 23, 2004, 11:39 PM
"Better" environmental laws cause decent US plants to shut down, and the second and third world plants that start to take up the slack dump whatever they want wherever they want.

End result: more pollution.

larry_minn
August 24, 2004, 01:04 AM
Count me as one who didn't own a gun that held more then 10 rds BEFORE they started the ban. The ban was brought up and I had chance to pick up 15rd 9mm so I did. I had bypassed a number of AR type rifles but bought one, same for SKS and AK type rifles. Because of the law I own them.

R.H. Lee
August 24, 2004, 01:13 AM
-Better environmental laws don't cause pollution.

heh. MTBE added to gasoline for the purpose of reducing exhaust emissions gets into groundwater, polluting wells and creating a health hazard.

Zundfolge
August 24, 2004, 01:40 AM
-Peace rallies don't create wars.
The generally don't stop wars either, ergo Peace rallies don't create peace (and they tend to raise the emotion level of political discourse thus increasing the possibility of violence).

-A higher minimum wage doesn't cause people to make less $ per hour.
As stated before, the more you raise the minimum wage, the more you raise unemployment. So higher minimum wage creates more people living off less (or no) money.

-Better environmental laws don't cause pollution.
in my opinion "better" environmental laws would be less environmental laws. But I figure you mean tougher environmental laws.
Tougher environmental laws push industries who pollute out of the country to countries with no environmental laws, so yes they do cause pollution. Plus they harm the economy (so, for example, less people can afford to get rid of their older car that puts out more pollution in favor of a new less polluting car).

Need some more?
Bring 'em on :evil:

JohnKSa
August 24, 2004, 02:12 AM
Burgeoning environmental legislation and the resulting liabilities have made it increasingly complicated and costly for small business owners to dispose of some types of chemicals. As a result, many are virtually forced to resort to illegal disposal methods since the legal methods are prohibitively expensive or expose the business owner to unacceptable liability risks.

reagansquad
August 24, 2004, 02:59 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-Peace rallies don't create wars.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


"The generally don't stop wars either, ergo Peace rallies don't create peace (and they tend to raise the emotion level of political discourse thus increasing the possibility of violence)."

Then why did the US pull out of veitnam? :)

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-A higher minimum wage doesn't cause people to make less $ per hour.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


"As stated before, the more you raise the minimum wage, the more you raise unemployment. So higher minimum wage creates more people living off less (or no) money."

That's actually false. A higher minimum wage leads to greater consumption of goods as most minimum wage earners spend 100% of their income. Greater consumption of goods leads to more demand for workers to produce those goods.

On the other hand, if you look at every example of trickle down economics in US history, they all either lead to, or do not solve recession.
Best examples are Hoover, Reagan and Bush... Now under presidents who have seen to it that the minimum wage is increased... well... The numbers speak for themselves.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-Better environmental laws don't cause pollution.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"in my opinion "better" environmental laws would be less environmental laws. But I figure you mean tougher environmental laws.
Tougher environmental laws push industries who pollute out of the country to countries with no environmental laws, so yes they do cause pollution. Plus they harm the economy (so, for example, less people can afford to get rid of their older car that puts out more pollution in favor of a new less polluting car)."

No, I mean better... I'm no Democrat. If you want to know where I stand, listen to or read some speeches by Ralph Nader or Jello Biafra on the internet.

Diggler
August 24, 2004, 05:48 AM
Only countries who can afford to have laws protecting the environment do; it is a luxury that we can.

Let's see how peaceful your friends will be at the 'stop the violence' protests for the GOP convention. Or is it OK as long as violence results in an end that suits you?

cracked butt
August 24, 2004, 06:22 AM
That's actually false. A higher minimum wage leads to greater consumption of goods as most minimum wage earners spend 100% of their income. Greater consumption of goods leads to more demand for workers to produce those goods.

Yup, for about a week, until inflation catches up.

Make the Minimum wage $10 per hr, and suddenly everyone making $10 per hr is now at minimum wage standard of living.

Raising the minimum wage does not raise up the lowest common denominator, but lowers many down to it.

Diggler
August 24, 2004, 07:11 AM
No, I mean better... I'm no Democrat. If you want to know where I stand, listen to or read some speeches by Ralph Nader or Jello Biafra on the internet.OK, so you follow a watermelon* and the lead singer from the Dead Kennedys??

You're still in college, aren't you?

*Green on the outside, red in the middle

JonnyB
August 24, 2004, 10:29 AM
reagansquad:

If the minimum wage increase works, why not simply raise it to, say, $20 per hour? Every 'working' person would be instantly removed from poverty.

If it works, why piddle around with a 75-cent increase over three years (or whatever is currently in vogue)? Get serious; make it count. Three dollars a year, until poverty is crushed! Three per year not working? Make it 5. Ten. Do what it takes.

Why don't they? Because, you see, it *doesn't* work. The socialists know it, so they pretend to be "doing something", and trying to keep the 'poor working people' voting for them. They *need* poor people. They *need* victims. If everyone actually advanced out of poverty, they'd lose their voting base, and that simply wouldn't do.

Government isn't the solution; it's the problem.

JB

Diggler
August 24, 2004, 10:36 AM
The government understands the utility of keeping people in 'poverty.' So what is poverty? According to FedGov, you are in 'poverty' if you are in the bottom 10% of income earners. So, there will never be an America without poverty. Even if everyone in a socialist utopia made between $100k and $101k/yr, those who made between $100k and $100,100/yr would still be in poverty.

If someone was truly in poverty, they wouldn't have tv's, vcr's, etc. We have the richest po' folk in the world. Look at some of the shantytowns outside of Mexico City and find people in the USA that live like that (not by choice).

DevilDog
August 24, 2004, 10:54 AM
Peace rallies/anti-war protests may have ended our involvement in Vietnam. However, it has led to the current mess we are in. Now our enemies know that the US can be defeated in the war via the media. They know we will turn on ourselves, which gives them the fortitude to carry on.

I have to wonder if we had finished Vietnam right, would we have gotten more involved in Cambodia? Probably, since we were already dabling there. If we had, would the Khmer Rouge been able to get way with genocide to the sum of 5 million killed?

Diggler
August 24, 2004, 11:14 AM
This is too easy...

August 25, 2003 Sultan, WA: ALF activists cut fences at a small mink farm and released 10,000 mink, causing $500,000 in damages and incalculable losses in genetic history. Fifty volunteers worked to round up the mink, capturing about two-thirds of the traumatized animals. Scores died of dehydration or were killed on a nearby highway. Pen-raised mink are not equipped for life in the wild and some of the recaptured ones may die as well. The case is similar to two earlier break-ins at other fur farms in the county. An ALF e-mail said that the group plans to continue such actions.

January 4, 2003 - Poole, England: ALF activists broke into an egg farm barn, expecting to find hens in cages. Instead, they caused a stampede of over 7000 free-range hens, and about 150 were crushed or suffocated. The farm had been targeted 15 years ago, when scores of hens were turned loose, only to be killed by foxes.

March 15, 2002 Traveler's Rest, Ontario, CA: A group calling itself Activists Working for Animal Rights broke into a fox farm and released 40 foxes. The activists cut through a chain link fence and carved a note on a door threatening to "burn" next time. Most of the foxes were recaptured, but three died after being struck by vehicles on a nearby highway.

October 17 and 24, 2001 In Ellsworth, Iowa: Animal Rights terrorists attacked a small fur farm twice in six days, releasing 1700 mink to be hit by cars or fall victim to dogs, starvation, stress and cold. ALF claimed credit for the raids.

September 7, 2001 IA: 14,000 Mink were released and abandoned in a night time raid on Earl Drewelow & Sons Mink Farm at Boyd. Fences were knocked down and much of the operation's facilities were destroyed. ALF claimed credit for the action, which caused estimated losses of over $100,000. About one-third of the mink found their way back, but most did not survive, hundreds were killed by passing cars after swarming on the nearby highway and others have been subsequently spotted at half-size, starving and hostile in the surrounding area.

August 23, 2001 Netherlands: In the second major mink farm attack in Europe this summer, hundreds of mink were destroyed on roads and in the surrounding area of a mink farm in Valkensward, near Eindhoven, when approximately 17,000 mink were released.

May 22, 2001 CA: The combination of the 1998 ban on certain kinds of traps and the ban on cougar hunting in California has been accompanied by a rise in alarming statistics. USDA recently released figures showing that the 5,600 animal kills by predators in 1995 had jumped to 14,900 last year. The loss to ranchers was estimated at $5 million in the year 2000. Mountain lions killed 3,300 cattle and calves last year, compared to 1,500 animal kills five years ago.

June 19, 2000 UK: Animal rights activists have been sending death threats to scientists conducting "badger culling trials," experiments designed as part of a five-year trial to establish if there is a link between badgers and TB in cattle. The harassment has been going on for two years, but the increased gravity of threats warranted increased police protection. A spokesman for scientists noted the irony that the trials might lead to fewer badgers being killed, as there is no clear evidence that badgers are to blame for bovine TB to date.

Zundfolge
August 24, 2004, 11:16 AM
Then why did the US pull out of vietnam?

The US pulling out of Vietnam didn't "create peace" ... in fact once we left the violence escalated and spread to Cambodia.

So no, the US "Peace" movement didn't achieve peace.

Daniel T
August 24, 2004, 11:32 AM
If you want to know where I stand, listen to...Jello Biafra on the internet.

Ha. Haha. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA.

Yeah, maybe if you sing and wish hard enough, and the bad things will go away.

OF
August 24, 2004, 12:04 PM
I love the minimum 'living' wage crap. Talk about looking for a free lunch. Like Jonny said, why not raise it to $100 an hour!? Then we can all be rich!

Woohoo!

As was said earlier, poverty in the US is a joke. When poor = satellite TV and cell phones, you know you're in the USA.

- Gabe

Diggler
August 24, 2004, 12:14 PM
Let's be honest, hardly anyone works for minimum wage anymore. Even McDonalds hires people at more than a dollar over minimum wage. It is irrelevant... except for the fact that many unions have their pay increases tied to the minimum wage. When the minimum wage goes up, the union guy who is making $60k a year gets a bump too. THAT'S where all the pressure comes from.

A side note, I saw on the news last night all the unions protesting the new overtime requirements. Funny, since (as I heard on WSJ This Morning yesterday) the union contracts are EXEMPT from the new regulations! Purely political.

notbubba
August 24, 2004, 12:49 PM
cslinger

No I like the term I just forgot what "EBR" ment and had to spent five minutes looking it up.

Then I started banging my head.
:banghead:

Sistema1927
August 24, 2004, 01:04 PM
Hey, I didn't think about it before, but it may be correct that the AWB is the reason for the existence of both the Kel-Tec P32 and the Kahr PM9.

Because of this, I can be armed all the time with not only a primary weapon, but a backup as well.

(The AWB is also responsible for me adding a couple of EBRs to my collection as well.)

1911Tuner
August 24, 2004, 01:23 PM
Great thread! And spot on. Riley nailed it, though...It's about control.

The thing about the whole can of worms is that telling Americans that they CAN'T have it is the sure way to see to it that they DO have it. It's a fine old American tradition that started with the Boston Tea Party. We've been
thumbing our noses at those who would make our decisions for us ever since...and THAT, my friends, is what the Feinstein/Schumer/Brady alliance
really wants to squelch. That American "And YOU can just go to hell"
attitude that is so much a part of us. They can't figger out just why we are so adamant about independence and making our own decisions and why we don't accept that THEY know what's best for us.

In their world, they're so much smarter and more capable of directing our lives than WE are, and it scares'em that we don't see it that way.
They don't hate us...They're frightened of us.

Cheers!

Tuner

Sistema1927
August 24, 2004, 02:24 PM
"Peace rallies don't create wars" - No, they create genocide.

"A higher minimum wage doesn't cause people to make less $ per hour." - No, it causes less people to make any $ per hour.


"Better environmental laws don't cause pollution." - Yes they do, as has been stated by the comments on MTBE, as well as the situation found in our Western forests where "environmental laws" don't allow harvesting and thinning, thus leading to huge forest fires that pump tons of pollution into the atmosphere.

Liberal "solutions" always cause problems.

hillbilly
August 24, 2004, 03:09 PM
Coming back to the thread, here's my experience.

I was a shooter since the time I was 8.

However, the very first handgun I ever bought for myself with my own money was purchased on the final weekend before the Brady Bill went into effect just so I could beat that stupid law.....a Taurus .357 magnum revolver.


The very first rifle I ever bought for myself and with my own money was a MAK-90 I picked up right after the passage of the AWB back in 1994.

In fact, I didn't start going to gun shows until after both the Brady Bill and the AWB passed and all the libs were crying about how awful such "weapons bazzars" were.

I've since tried to purchase the most scary-looking, magazine fed rifles I could just because those were the ones the government said I shouldn't have.

So, for me, yeah, the AWB and the Brady Bill both spurred me to economic action. Both laws had exactly the opposite intended effects for me.

hillbilly

Feanaro
August 24, 2004, 03:54 PM
I, too, can have a hearty chuckle at the AWB. I own my CETME and SKS in large part because I was supremely ticked that someone would try to keep me from owning them.


Daniel T, Diggler et al, I agree with most of your points. But things like "You're still in college, aren't you?" and "Yeah, maybe if you sing and wish hard enough, and the bad things will go away." don't exactly seem like The High Road, to me.

Andrew Wyatt
August 24, 2004, 04:17 PM
A higher minimum wage doesn't cause people to make less $ per hour.

yes, but it causes more people to get fired.

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