S&W Walther PPK, opinions? Worth buying?


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megatronrules
February 20, 2003, 02:53 AM
I looked at one yesterday,seems well made. Are these good guns? They sure seem nice :) Always wanted a PPK,but I heard Interarms were bad, and the war production guns cost a fortune.:( Thanks for any advice.

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Wildalaska
February 20, 2003, 03:14 AM
Best bet would to see what Earl at earls repair service says....

WildtheyhavelouseytirggersAlaska

Kahr carrier
February 20, 2003, 09:21 AM
Hi the S&Ws are PPKS .The Interarms PPKs are nice but with these you have to watch your grip on the gun if it is to high you will get slide bite.:( But the S&W version has a slightly longer tail so you can use a higher grip and not get slide bite a slight improvement on the original design. The S&W PPKs that I fired seemed nice and functioned fine.:)

jar
February 20, 2003, 11:58 AM
I've always liked the looks of the PPK and have bought three over the years, one German, one French and one American. All were unreliable and sliced the hell out of my hand. Now the new Smith is really catching my attention. Maybe, just maybe, someone finally made the PPK a viable handgun. I certainly hope so 'cause I'd love to have one that worked.

10-Ring
February 20, 2003, 12:14 PM
One e sales guys at a shop I frequent bought one. He's been impressed at its reliability and function. He was concerned about the stories of hammer bite w/ the older ones, but hasn't experienced any...yet :) Admittedly, he only has a couple hundred rounds through it, things might change.

VictorLouis
February 20, 2003, 12:30 PM
Yes, the extended frame tang means no more hammer-bite, for most of us, anyway.;) Oh, and the sharp serrated trigger now has a smooth face.

Standing Wolf
February 20, 2003, 10:54 PM
My interarms PPK's hammer has never bitten me onceā€”and if it ever does, I'll bite it back!

Kahr carrier
February 20, 2003, 11:09 PM
Ill bite it back OUCH>:what:

Blackhawk
February 20, 2003, 11:43 PM
No problem with hammer bite on my InterArms PPK, but the slide could easily be on a slicing course with my hand. Never let it, but I was always careful how I gripped it. Beautiful SS gun that now has a nice home with somebody else....

arinvolvo
February 21, 2003, 12:14 AM
Is S&W making or importing the PPK now? Does anyone have a picture of one?

M1911
February 21, 2003, 10:33 AM
I believe that S&W makes it. Here's a picture: http://www.waltheramerica.com/ppks.htmYou also might want to consider the Kahr MK9. It's a bit smaller and lighter than the PPK/S and it is 9mm.

Handy
February 21, 2003, 11:47 AM
If the PPK/S is importable, and the PPK is not, why would Walther have S&W make the PPK/S? That makes no sense.

ArmaLube
February 21, 2003, 06:15 PM
There is no question about it, the dimensions and lines of the PPK/S are beautiful. But, here is what is wrong with the PPK pistols:

1. .380 is a wimpy cartridge.
2. Since this is a very old mechanical design, it lacks the sophisticated safety features of quality modern pistols. For example, there is no firing pin safety. With a round in the chamber, these pistols can be dangerous if dropped.
3. Trigger pulls are notoriously hard.

IMHO, there are much better pistols available in this size range. Some of the compact 9mm S&W DA autos, for example. Better yet, a similarly compact 40 S&W would make a great choice.

But, ideally, a compact .357 Sig would be a tremendous choice. This is a cartridge that will 'deliver the goods'.

"Armalube (http://www.armalube.com) Hits The Mark"

TooTech
February 21, 2003, 07:01 PM
I've got a friend who was considering buying a new S&W PPK.

The clerk in the local shop was talking it up as having better quality than the US-made Interarms guns. Then we all noticed that the leading edge of the triggerguard was not closing all the way into its' recess in the frame of the gun! Even the clerk said he would not accept the gun in that condition, and could they order a new one from the distributor.

My friend REALLY liked the looks of the PPK, so a second one was ordered. We were both back at the shop a week later, and the second PPK had some major machine marks on the interior of the frame. Looked like it had been finished with a rat tail file. Needless to say my friend has since cooled on the notion of buying the S&W PPK, he'll look for a German one instead.

So look 'em over REAL carefully!

M1911
February 21, 2003, 08:48 PM
For example, there is no firing pin safety. With a round in the chamber, these pistols can be dangerous if dropped.Really? They are certified for sale in MA, which means they've passed drop tests. I know a couple changes were made for the PPKs (e.g., longer tang). Could a firing pin safety have been added to the design?

ArmaLube
February 21, 2003, 09:07 PM
M1911,

It is possible that the firing pin is locked in PPKs, when the manual safety is applied. I owned a PPK/S a few years ago and don't recall for sure if the firing pin is locked when the manual safety is on. If it is, then it would pass drop tests (when on safe).

I disapprove of manual safeties on DA pistols and believe they should be omitted. Pistols with decocking levers have automatic firing pin locks. So when the pistols are carried in the normal hammer down position, they are immediately ready to fire and they are still completely safe.

I know that the PPKs do not have the firing pins locked when the safety is off. 'Safety off' would be the preferred mode of carry for any good DA pistol. But this is not acceptable with the PPK series.

Good question, and thanks for asking.

"ArmaLube (http://www.armalube.com) Hits The Mark"

denfoote
February 21, 2003, 11:21 PM
I have one and the fit and finish is excellent. The reliability is excellent also...provided you use the Walther bannered mags. I bought four aftermarket Mec-Gar mags and the reliability dropped to zero!!! :what:

M1911
February 22, 2003, 01:49 PM
I owned a PPK/S a few years ago and don't recall for sure if the firing pin is locked when the manual safety is on. If it is, then it would pass drop tests (when on safe).
I disapprove of manual safeties on DA pistols and believe they should be omitted. Pistols with decocking levers have automatic firing pin locks. So when the pistols are carried in the normal hammer down position, they are immediately ready to fire and they are still completely safe.
I know that the PPKs do not have the firing pins locked when the safety is off. 'Safety off' would be the preferred mode of carry for any good DA pistol. But this is not acceptable with the PPK series.I thought the PPK/S was the model that is being built by S&W for Walther. How could you have a PPK/S a few years ago when they just came out last year?

Firing pin safeties are an orthogonal issue to manual safeties and decocking levers. Most firing pin safeties ARE NOT operated by a manual safety. Instead, like a Series 80 Colt, pulling the trigger withdraws the firing pin safety. There are plenty of DA/SA guns that 1) have manual safeties, and 2) have firing pin safeties, and 3) are safe to be carried with the safety on or off -- that is, the firing pin safety is still operable with the manual safety off. Examples are S&W third generation, HK USP, Beretta, etc. Those guns are no more and no less safe than DA/SA guns that only have a decocker (e.g., Sig).

If you don't want to carry a DA/SA gun on safe, that's fine, that's your choice. But that doesn't mean that DA/SA guns with safeties are more dangerous carried with the safeties off. Nor does it mean that DA/SA guns without safeties are somehow safer -- they're not.

As we know, the PPK/s design was modified somewhat from the standard PPK design when Smith & Wesson started manufacturing them. For example, we know that the frame tang was extended. Does anyone who has a PPK/S (not a PPK) know whether or not it has a firing pin safety?

ArmaLube
February 22, 2003, 03:39 PM
The PPK/S firing pin IS LOCKED when the manual safety is in the SAFE position. The firing pin IS NOT locked when the safety is in the FIRE positioon. This is a significant disadvantage of an old design. The entire PP series are essentially the same in mechancal design details.

Of course the Walther PPK/S has been around for many years, long before S&W's recent licensing arrangement. Many facts about the the PP and PPK history are offered at this site: http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/2188/index.html

One of the key advantages of modern, safely-designed DA pistols is that they may be carried hammer down, round in chamber, with revolver-like readiness. A manual safety, if included, is probably required and reduces readiness. Those modern pistols of advanced design, having no manual safety, give the owner the full advantages of instant, fool-proof readiness without sacrificing safety. Why settle for less than the best?

All pistols are not equipped with full-time firing pin or striker safeties. Those that do are the best ones to own. Some of the good pistols, offering this capability include the SigArms models, S&W autos with decocking levers (not manual safeties), Glocks, and a few others.

The PPK/S and other pistols in the same series, great pistols in their day, are not up to par in terms of modern design and safety engineering.

It is best for gun buyers to be informed and aware of the facts and the differences in various pistol designs. Then, and only then, may the most intelligent decisions be made.

"ArmaLube (http://www.armalube.com) Hits The Mark

M1911
February 22, 2003, 11:26 PM
S&W autos with decocking levers (not manual safeties),On S&W autos with decocking levers, the decocking lever is an integrated safety, much like that on the Beretta 92 series.
Why settle for less than the best?That's why I use a 1911. Why settle for an sucky DA trigger;)?

kalibear45
February 26, 2003, 06:53 PM
I have a stainless Interarms PPK (made in USA) in .380 that I bought used and it hasn't given me any problems - other than getting scratched on the webbing between my thumb and index finger after a while of shooting. But this helps me to hold the gun properly. It is very accurate and reliable and mine has an unusual light trigger pull. All I did so far is get it hard chromed from Tripp Research and changed to a heavier recoil spring. Believe it or not, this is one of my favorite guns. Not only does it look cool, but it makes me feel like James Bond everytime I hold it :D

http://home.attbi.com/~kbug1/images/walther_pair.jpg

Watch-Six
February 26, 2003, 07:20 PM
A friend of mine had two vintage German made PPK pistols, not the PPK/s. They were great little guns. I wanted one, but had to settle for the importable PPK/s. It was also German made. All three of the German guns worked fine. When the American made "real" PPK became available, I sold my German PPK/s and bought one. It was a real disappointment. Even after sending it back to the factory, it still would not function. I dumped it. After that lousey experience, I wouldn't even consider an American made Walther. This was all several years ago. Now days why bother with a 380 when small 9mms like the Kahr PM9 are around? Just my opinion. Watch-Six

mini14jac
February 27, 2003, 10:21 AM
What are the S&W PPKs selling for?

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