CSI, right now: Painting gun owners as buffoons.


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BHPshooter
September 3, 2004, 12:23 AM
Firstly, let me say that I was rolling my eyes and chortling for much of this episode. The kicker was when they find a guy that just bought a new handgun and was shooting in his backyard, in a subdivision. The doofus says, "It was just a little target practice!!!"

No, I'm not really surprised, but I am pissed regardless.

Anyway, for the other silly stuff:

One of the obligatory 2 murders is a woman who is shot out of the blue and no one saw a shooter. The body is examined, and they determine that the bullet (a 9mm FMJ) penetrated 4 inches. The dude says, "Standard handgun penetration is 12 inches." :rolleyes:

That's right, ALL handgun calibers penetrate the same. Bet you just learned something new.

Then it shows said dude cooking up different 9mm handloads (again, with FMJ) while the blonde chick cooks up a few blocks of ballistic gelatin.

The full-power shot clocks 1100 fps and penetrates a perfect 12". :rolleyes: Yes, FMJ.

I could go on, but why bother? It's just interesting to see A) the ignorance of those who make television, and B) how the image of knuckle-dragging buffoons is spoon-fed to the masses.

Wes

P.S. :barf:

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Dbl0Kevin
September 3, 2004, 12:53 AM
Television and movies are ignorant in just about every subject. We just happen to pick up on it more when it comes to firearms, because we actually DO know about firearms. TV and Movies are fantasy and nothing more. All too often people start believing that what they're seeing is actually real and that's where the trouble lies.

Sindawe
September 3, 2004, 01:05 AM
Thats all it is. Like when the head Minbari starts ranting about the instabiltiy of the isolinier chips destabilizing the jump gates and how she wishes she'd not shared the Queatel Moulluscs the anaphasic Pa'Rath was having Rishathra with.

Sounds good the uninitiated, but makes no sense whatsoever to those who know a thing or two about the subject.

Crime Fantasy I beileve that show is called.

Justin
September 3, 2004, 01:35 AM
psst, Sindawe, it's Membari, not Minbari. (Yes, I'm a nerd.)

As for TV in general, the people who make TV got those jobs because that's what they're good at. They aren't good at being cops, robbers, spies, lawyers, doctors, politicians, or family members. That's why if you look too closely at any given TV show or movie, you'll see that it's really not true to life.

As for CSI, I watched a couple of episodes in the second season and was absolutely astonished at how poorly written the show is.

Sindawe
September 3, 2004, 02:10 AM
Psst, Justin, I refer you to this posting:

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=199606111809.OAA30900%40r05n01.cac.psu.edu

Best citation I could find on short notice. But you could be correct. I've always been sympathetic toward the Shadow's viewpoint myself. :evil:

You are correct in that those who's job it is to make good TV need to good story creators/tellers first. The rest is really just props and dressing for the tale. 'Course, correct info about the probs really helps a good tale. But it'll not save a bad one.

Endevoring to keep this gun realted, any thouhgts as to the plausabilty of the weapons on B5 and other entertainment? I suppose if one could make a gas of a metal compound, one could but enough of a magnetic charge on it to keep it cohesive long enough to hit a target.

Andrew Wyatt
September 3, 2004, 02:25 AM
Thats all it is. Like when the head Minbari starts ranting about the instabiltiy of the isolinier chips destabilizing the jump gates and how she wishes she'd not shared the Queatel Moulluscs the anaphasic Pa'Rath was having Rishathra with.

Is it bad that i know whence each reference in that quote came?

Calhoun
September 3, 2004, 08:46 AM
Come on, we're talking about CSI now. The same show that keeps all the lights off in their labs and every one of them knows everything about everything. The same character that is an expert in ballistics is an expert in forensic explosives, and insects, and automotive mechanics, and weather patterns, and... well you get the point. It's all done to make "good TV" (talk about an oxymoron; almost as bad as MicrosoftWorks). Take it for what it is, a really bad TV show. One other thing, as someone who has met a few real crime scene investigators, they are not all beautiful. Trust me.

Peace out,
Calhoun

Mal H
September 3, 2004, 09:21 AM
It's just a show.

However the doofus who ".. was shooting in his backyard, in a subdivision" is all too true. Happened in Fairfax County, VA not many years ago. A man was mysteriously shot while sitting at his desk in an office building. The police immediately think sniper. After some CSI of their own (the real kind) they determined where the shot came from - a populated subdivision quite a distance away. After going to the house where they determined the bullet came from, it seems the guy there was shooting his .44 Magnum at something in a tree in his yard (noisy bird, wasp nest, something like that, I've forgotten). He says, "I was shooting way in the air so it wouldn't hit anything else!"

The real life instances of gun stupidity are far more memorable to the general public than those from a TV show.

GTKrockeTT
September 3, 2004, 12:53 PM
anyone saw the CSI episode where they referred to a round as a ".45 Glock?"

strambo
September 3, 2004, 01:53 PM
The full-power shot clocks 1100 fps and penetrates a perfect 12". Yes, FMJ.
Sweet! Thanks for the info, I'm changin' carry loads from gold dots to cheap 124g FMJ.

SodiumBenzoate
September 3, 2004, 02:34 PM
Excuse my ignorance... But about how far should a 9mm FMJ penetrate at that velocity?

cordex
September 3, 2004, 02:48 PM
heh heh .... he said "rishathra". *snicker*

SteveS
September 3, 2004, 02:50 PM
anyone saw the CSI episode where they referred to a round as a ".45 Glock?"

Maybe they meant .45 GAP

esldude
September 3, 2004, 05:56 PM
SodiumBenzoate,

FMJ 9mm rounds penetrate deeply. I forget, something like 30 inches I
think in ballistic gelatin. They make a smaller hole than HP's, but it is with deep penetration.

Taipei Personality
September 3, 2004, 06:18 PM
Not ballistic gelatin, but one of the better series of comparisons I've seen: http://stevespages.com/page8f.htm

crawfordew
September 3, 2004, 07:51 PM
I bet if they sent the CSI crew to look around "the grassy knoll" in Dallas they'd find out what really happened!
Gene :D

Standing Wolf
September 3, 2004, 09:14 PM
I gave away my television over a year ago. I haven't missed it for even a tenth of a nanosecond.

BHPshooter
September 3, 2004, 10:47 PM
Excuse my ignorance... But about how far should a 9mm FMJ penetrate at that velocity?

I don't know any "for-sure" numbers, but it will penetrate A TON in gelatin. I have heard that it will penetrate over 30". Forty-five ball penetrates a lot too, but I don't know if it's more or less.

Wes

pauli
September 5, 2004, 12:00 AM
csi is a lot of fun as long as you don't take it seriously. ignore anything you have any sort of knowledge about, and it's an entertaining show.

personally, i thought that in the episode originally referenced, they were protraying that gun owner as a buffoon.

this is the same series where a woman died due to waiting periods.

Roadkill Coyote
September 5, 2004, 02:00 AM
You want the really appropriate quote for this thread? Try this one. :p
"If you're wondering how he eats and breathes, and other science facts, la, la, la."

Ex-Doc
September 5, 2004, 05:29 PM
CSI makes it look easy. Yet they can't find a known female body in a known location at dump in Utah.

It's only a matter of time before Devry or Sally Struthers starts selling Forensic seince courses in only 6 months.....call now for you color brochure.....

Gus Dddysgrl
September 9, 2004, 03:34 PM
Actually I think the show is really good. I have met a Forensic scientist. She said that unlike TV the scientists never leave the lab. The nerds really do know all that stuff in all those subjects. And not everyone looks like TV. Though you can learn alot from the show since much of it is true, but not quite all of it.

However I think the show is very good. If they tried to show it like real life it would end up not being CSI since no one cares about lab nerds. The other side of it is the cop side where COPS and Law and Order come in. They had to smudge the lines to make a show. That's half the fun of TV. It's not real. That's what reality shows are for...., but I digress.

Jon and I have the first 3 seasons on DVD and the next one comes out soon. We have seen them all more than once. Yes we are nerds and we know what is and isn't real on the show most of the time(if not we look it up).

As far as gun nuts go I think it has goods and bads. It has on occassion shown gun owners is a positive light.

Gus

4nscguy
September 9, 2004, 10:02 PM
I leave the lab all of the time. It depends on who you work for and what your duties are, as to whether you are just a lab worker or a forensic investigator.

41mag
September 9, 2004, 10:10 PM
Well,it's not gun related but the show dis-appointed me today when they showed a transmission out of a 1st or 2nd gen Camaro supposedly in a 4th gen car.

*O.K. GM parts guy-car geek going to bed now.My nit is picked for the day*

horge
September 9, 2004, 11:46 PM
"Well, it's not gun related but the show dis-appointed me today when they showed a transmission out of a 1st or 2nd gen Camaro supposedly in a 4th gen car."

God Bless You.
:D

Tharg
September 10, 2004, 05:09 AM
ROFLMAO (specially at the GM dude...) heheheh

CSI is a wonderful show... it seeks to mainstream something and draw people in. My mom tells me about the neat visuals of "how something happened" (and last nights show talking about a .22lr "bouncing around in someones head" is something i've always heard... but like - they "visualized it" rofl was awesome.

Either way reality sets in... and then you realize shows like that reality show where they film the jurors... etc etc... and then you begin to see where common sense ... well... isn't.

CSI is a great TV show - IE an escape from the real world. In the real world my car got broke into back in 93 when i was in brittain and i drove it to the police station w/ 2 fingertips... My stereo had been stolen as well as some alcohol i had in the vehicle. My report went in ... i asked them if they wanted to fingerprint... i'm sure i actually said "aren't you GOING to fingerprint".... of course... they weren't. Naturally i did not get my Deck back - nor did i recover my backpack w/ the beer in it... gawd i hate low life thieves who ain't worth the lead in a bullet.

So CSI to me is a GREAT TV show... but... it comes down to NO ONE gets that "level of support"... per single "case"... I have no doubt in america's ability to figure out things... technological or manpower.... its just if its not "worth it" then its not going to happen. Too many people watch CSI and think they are going to get "THAT" investigation if something happens...

aint' gonna happen
J/Tharg!

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