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357 gyrojet?

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by Reefinmike, Jan 21, 2013.

  1. Reefinmike

    Reefinmike Well-Known Member

    I know this is all way out there, but today as I was sorting out some brass and general post range day cleanup, I removed the 1911 that I was cc'ing as well as a few 357 mag rounds I had in my pocket. As I was sorting brass, I just decided for the heck of it, to clear the 1911 and see if I could drop a 357 down the pipe. It fit just fine!

    I was wondering if... IF... theoretically, If you were to have a 357 load with a very very tight crimp, a nice soft federal primer, and a slow burning rifle powder, that if you drop it down a 1911 barrel and pull the trigger, it would pop the primer out and the powder would continue to burn, turning the cartridge into a mini rocket.

    of course this is all theoretical bs and Id never attempt to try it, but wouldnt that be cool to see a self propelled fully intact 357 round?
  2. ljnowell

    ljnowell Well-Known Member

  3. Gryffydd

    Gryffydd Well-Known Member

    I'm having a hard time figuring out what you're even describing. Appropriate user name perhaps?
  4. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Well-Known Member

    Slow is a relative term when it comes to smokeless powders. Milliseconds come to mind.
  5. PapaG

    PapaG Well-Known Member

    The original gyro jet was an abject failure....and it had three angled exhaust ports.
  6. Patocazador

    Patocazador Well-Known Member

    If you can find any ammo for the Gyro Jet, it's worth a fortune as a collectible.
  7. Jesse Heywood

    Jesse Heywood Well-Known Member

    Theoretically, the case sidewalls will rupture and spew brass fragments from the gun, probably into your hand(s) and face. It shouldn't be bad enough to destroy the gun or kill you, but the results are guaranteed to be painful and will do nothing to improve your good looks.
  8. Shadow 7D

    Shadow 7D Well-Known Member

  9. ljnowell

    ljnowell Well-Known Member

    No, it wouldnt. There would be nearly no pressure, becase the case would rupture venting all the pressure out the barrel. Many people have accidently fired a 9mm in a 40, same thing. A real light pop, bullet usually travels very slow, in some cases only a few feet. No contained burn = no pressure.
  10. GLOOB

    GLOOB Well-Known Member

    I'll play along.

    First off, even a slow 50BMG powder wouldn't work. If you got the powder to ignite, at all, it would still be wayyyy too fast to make a rocket. If you don't get enough pressure to blow the case up, you probably wouldn't even get ignition. Just a squib.

    But I can imagine this "working" if you found the right fuel, capped the case with a very light tip (maybe just plug the top of the case with a little sheet of brass soldered over the top), and you reamed out the flash hole.
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2013
  11. Reefinmike

    Reefinmike Well-Known Member

    gryffyd- no, my name is referring to the fact that another hobby/my business is marine reef aquariums, but I get where that could be misconstrued.

    as stated, everything is theoretical, I wouldnt ever do this unless I had a gun I didnt care to possibly destroy, a vice and a very long string tied to the trigger.

    gloob- you have some ideas there. brass welding(is that even a real thing?) a brass slug on top would probably be the best bet. I was thinking a very very tight roll crimp might work, its either the bullet or the primer that pops out. maybe even ream out the primer pocket so that the primer barely wants to stay in? maybe if you were to crush down the powder and somehow make a solid plug that perfectly fits in the case it would have a more controled burn? kind of like model rocket rockets?

    Its all in the name of fun, would you rather see another post asking where to find $26/k cci primes, h335 powder and general banter about price gouging :)
  12. mdi

    mdi Well-Known Member

    I think if you could find the right propellant, you would have to drill vent holes in the case head instead of hoping the primer would blow out.
  13. Gryffydd

    Gryffydd Well-Known Member

    Yeah, this is the part that really has me confused. I'm not really sure why one would expect "it would pop the primer out" to happen.
  14. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

    Because if the .357 was loaded with slow burning rifle powder as the OP suggested?

    Thats what it would do.

    Here is what happens to unconfined cartridges when they ignite.


    Notice the .223 rifle round blew the primer out of the case and the powder burned out through the flash hole without bursting the case or moving the bullet out of the case.

    The thing is though, even if the .357 case blew the primer out and ignited the slow rifle powder?

    It would not be stable, and would exit the barrel not like a spin stabilize Gyro-jet rocket.
    But like a fireworks pinwheel.

  15. blarby

    blarby Well-Known Member

    If you want to make a solid rocket pistol, just make one.

    Solid rocket boosters are not hard to make.

    A brass case would be a great nozzle- its just angled wrong at the exhaust port.

    And its open topped- great for multiple stages !

    Its not likely to generate the force needed to spin through rifling, however- at that size.
  16. Gryffydd

    Gryffydd Well-Known Member

    There's a bit of a difference between a round just hanging out in a tube and being ignited via heat and a round sitting in a barrel and ignited via a firing pin with a bolt face on one side. I would expect exactly what you see in Shadow 7D's link in this scenario. A pierced primer perhaps, but not a completely missing primer.

    What you show in your loose round tests is also exactly what I've seen before in similar tests. It seems like when things aren't held in place on any axis, the case tends to move a lot faster than the bullet. But in this scenario the case & primer would have the bolt face to contend with, so I'm not sure where the primer is supposed to go when it gets ignited.
  17. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

    I believe it would go foreword at least far enough for the primer to blow out just from the 1911 firing pin impact.

    The 9mm in a .40 and 30-30 in a .410 ones you see in the photos were held in place by the extractor or rim, or the firing pin would not have hit them.

    A loose .357 in a 1911 would have to be held back by gravity.
    And the long travel firing pin would knock it away from the breech-face far enough for the primer to pop out.

  18. Reefinmike

    Reefinmike Well-Known Member

    thanks for the input as always RC and others. accuracy- of course it wouldnt be accurate at all, would probably go a handful of feet before tumbling. after searching through my odds n ends range brass, it looks like a 41 remington magnum with the case rim trimmed off would be a nice fit down a 45 barrel. a loose primer pocket would probably be a must as well as a permanently affixed bullet and maybe even opening up the flash hole some to control the burn rate.

    heck, a 41 mag case nearly fits in a 45 mag. trim it down some and use a wadcutter style "plug" and then the user can hand cycle the "repeating pocket rocket"

    now we just need someone with a spare 45 they dont mind experimenting with!
  19. Ex

    Ex Well-Known Member

    Mike, hopefully you're not asking for an Ed Brown or such? ;)
  20. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

    Shirley, You are not serious!

    We don't need any more mad bomber accidents in the news.

    Enough "Crazy Gun Nut" stuff in the news already with three gun-show ND shootings over the weekend!!


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