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Could it be? (Texas to allow switchblades)

Discussion in 'Non-Firearm Weapons' started by Wolfebyte, May 23, 2013.

  1. Wolfebyte

    Wolfebyte Well-Known Member

  2. Deltaboy

    Deltaboy Well-Known Member

  3. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

    Yep, our friends at KnifeRights were pretty busy this year.
    Last edited: May 24, 2013
  4. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Well-Known Member

    TX knife laws are a mess. If you want to know how screwed up they are, here's an example. I have an unmodified Opinel knife that qualifies as a switchblade under the existing law.

    This change will help the legal situation a lot.

    Unfortunately, it's going to cost me money because a whole new world just opened up... :D
  5. metalart

    metalart Well-Known Member

    Still irked that I can't carry my locking pocket knife when I visit my FIL in San Antonio....
  6. Yo Mama

    Yo Mama Well-Known Member

    Kniferights was an important organization for pushing this through. If you can please join them. They are the NRA for knife advocacy.

    Next is moving on to a few other states.
  7. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

    KR had several efforts in other states this year.

    We got preemption through in TN, but couldn't get auto or blade length restrictions removed while TX got switchblade restrictions removed, but couldn't get preemption or length through. The whole package went through in KS.
  8. whetrock

    whetrock Well-Known Member

    I don't even get real enthusiastic, about automatics, but am eager to see the outcome, hopefully OK will follow. I'd be more enthusiastic, if I could legally carry, and use mine in OK, but as it stands I'll just have to suffice without them.
  9. Barry the Bear

    Barry the Bear Well-Known Member

    Im still wondering when bowie knives will be removed . How can they be outlawed if it was the weapon of one texas` great defenders
  10. whetrock

    whetrock Well-Known Member

    What exactly constitutes a "Bowie knife" in legal jargon ? Seems like an awfully, subjective term. To me anyhow.
  11. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Well-Known Member

    It is subjective and it's a problem.

    There is no official/formal definition of a Bowie knife anywhere that I can find--certainly not in TX law. In addition, virtually any particular feature of Bowie knives one wants to choose to discuss (other than the agreement that it's a large fixed blade knife) is subject to debate.

    TX law also specifically outlaws throwing knives and knives with blades over 5.5" long. One would think those two categories, taken together, should have covered Bowie knives, so the only logical assumption was that there was some other "Bowie-like" feature of fixed blade knives the legislators were trying to criminalize. Since they they neglected to provide any amplifying information, about the only way to be perfectly safe is to avoid carrying any kind of fixed blade knife.
  12. mdauben

    mdauben Well-Known Member

    This is actually not uncommon in many southern states. Supposedly it was due to the common use of bowie knives for duelling (or at least there was a common perception that this was a problem)

    AL has similar wording in its laws on concealed weapons against "bowie knives" with no definition of what that is. There is a AL case law quoted on one of the knife law sites that says a large kitchen knife was classed as a "bowie knife" by the courts. Given that I would worry that any fixed blade could be classed as one by an LEO or the courts. :(

    Sent from my KFJWI using Tapatalk HD
  13. whetrock

    whetrock Well-Known Member

    21-1272 in OK states similar terminology, prohibiting the carry of "Bowie knives" among other stuff. OK needs to own up, and repeal these, dated, archaic, laws. They're of another Era. I mean, being in the cutlery business I encounter many customers sporting modern folders, including "assisted openers", which for most practical purposes, are automatic AFAIC, but still kinda, legal nonetheless (you won't get arrested in this neck of the woods, they're pretty common). If the average citizen can be trusted with such knives, why can't they be trusted with a bona-fide "Switchblade". Such logic is beyond me. It fires me up to see Texas making progress.
  14. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

    Kansas did it!


    Local restaurant owners are already wringing their hands and predicting they will go out of business after having to hire new employees to mop up the blood on the floor every night.

    I tried to reason with one by stating the 5" serrated steak knife in every napkin roll was just as deadly, if not more so, then a 4" switch-blade if someone wanted to get frisky with it.

    But it fell on deaf ears.

    Last edited: Jun 1, 2013
  15. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Well-Known Member

    It's one thing for a society to decide to outlaw certain items. It's another thing to implement that decision in such a way as to make it impossible to determine how to comply.

    Here are the TX knife laws with my comments inserted in red. They are hopelessly outdated, confusing, overly general and poorly constructed. They need to be completely reworked.

    6) "Illegal knife" means a:
    (A) knife with a blade over five and one-half inches;
    (B) hand instrument designed to cut or stab another by being thrown;
    (C) dagger, including but not limited to a dirk, stiletto, and poniard; (Absolutely NO definition of what any of these are. This section is generally interpreted as banning double-edged knives. If that's what it means, then it needs to say that. If no one remembers why this section is here it needs to be deleted.)
    (D) bowie knife; (Throwing knives, and knives with blades over 5.5" are already banned above--what is this section supposed to do? No one ever talks about it, but it could conceivably ban any fixed blade knife given the debate about what, exactly, constitutes a bowie knife. This section needs to go--it's just plain idiotic to have a prohibition that can't be defined.)
    (E) sword; (Why is there a need to call out swords separately when knives with blades over 5.5" are already illegal and the definition of knife below clearly includes swords? Delete this--swords are already illegal under 6A combined with 7.) or
    (F) spear. (No definition. If you lash a mini SWAK to a toothpick with a length of dental floss, you have undoubtedly created a spear--admittedly a very small and non-threatening spear--but still illegal. If this is to stay, there needs to be a definition provided.)
    (7) "Knife" means any bladed hand instrument that is capable of inflicting serious bodily injury or death by cutting or stabbing a person with the instrument. (This definition is hopelessly general. An icepic, a screwdriver, a #2 pencil or any other "pointy object" with any length to it is capable of inflicting serious bodily injury or death by stabbing. A #2 pencil is NOT a knife and neither is an icepic or a screwdriver.)
    (11) "Switchblade knife" means any knife that has a blade that folds, closes, or retracts into the handle or sheath and that opens automatically by pressure applied to a button or other device located on the handle or opens or releases a blade from the handle or sheath by the force of gravity or by the application of centrifugal force. The term does not include a knife that has a spring, detent, or other mechanism designed to create a bias toward closure and that requires exertion applied to the blade by hand, wrist, or arm to overcome the bias toward closure and open the knife. (A loose Opinel can be swung open and has no bias toward closure. Therefore it is currently a switchblade in TX. Stupid, stupid, stupid. This prohibition needs to be totally deleted--apparently the legislature finally agrees.)

    (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally or knowingly possesses, manufactures, transports, repairs, or sells:
    (5) a switchblade knife; (There is no exemption I can see for possessing a switchblade in one's own home. Fortunately the prohibition seems to be going away.)

    (d) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution under this section that the actor's conduct:
    (1) was incidental to dealing with a switchblade knife, springblade knife (There is no definition of what a springblade knife is. This is the only one of two mentions of it in TX law. The term needs to be defined or deleted--preferably deleted.) , short-barrel firearm, or tire deflation device solely as an antique or curio;


    Sec. 371.179. DISPLAYS OF CERTAIN WEAPONS PROHIBITED. A pawnbroker may not display for sale in a storefront window or sidewalk display case or depict on a sign or advertisement in such a way that the item, sign, or advertisement may be viewed from a street:
    (2) a dirk; (Define or delete!)
    (3) a dagger; (Define or delete!)
    (6) a sword cane;
    (7) knuckles made of metal or any other hard substance; or
    (8) a switchblade, springblade, or throwblade knife. (This is the only mention of "throwblade knife" in the TX statutes and therefore there is no definition of it. Define it or delete it!)
  16. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

    What's really hard to believe is, all the Federal level switchblade law BS started with movies like Blackboard Jungle, Rebel Without a Cause, and the West Side Story dance number!!

    There was never any basis in fact that switchblades were any more likely to be used in crime then any other knife.
    Like a kitchen junk drawer butcher knife for instance.

    It reminds me greatly of present day 'evil black rifle' bans.

    Last edited: Jun 1, 2013
  17. SleazyRider

    SleazyRider Well-Known Member

    I hear ya, RC, it's always been a source of puzzlement for me as well. The paranoia has even found its way into our local school system, where last year a student was suspended for carrying a "switchblade" comb. Yes, that's right, a comb! Seems that the madness knows no bounds.

    I EDC an inexpensive Schrade Smedy, a side opening push-button automatic that's well under 25 bucks. What a sweetheart of a knife! I'm spoiled by its simple, one-handed lightening deployment, and use it a dozen times or more during the day to open boxes, cut rope, or shave down a wooden shim. As a defensive weapon it one of the last things I'd reach for---it's a tool!
  18. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

    If anyone whines about the switchblade law point out that the cheapest American made modern switchblades start at $60 and go up from there steeply and that imports aren't allowed. Criminals don't use expensive knives to commit crimes and any EMT will tell them that kitchen knives and box cutters and steak knives are what they overwhelmingly see used.
  19. Sam Cade

    Sam Cade Member

    In my very limited experience*, it is 7" Old Hicks and those stainless RADA paring knives.

    *Disgruntled lovers+methamphetamine+18" novelty baseball bat+2 cases of haemophilia+SAK=2 near fatalities and the biggest mess I have ever seen.
  20. greyling22

    greyling22 Well-Known Member

    hso, imports may not be allowed, but they're certainly here. Since apparently there are knife laws I knew nothing about, I certainly have not purchased a ganzo 707 off ebay as a "folding camping knife" for about 15 bucks. Because that knife, while being heavy as a brick, would certainly have been a medium-low quality automatic from china freely sold to any american anywhere.

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