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Pyrodex vs Triple 7

Discussion in 'Blackpowder' started by neal7250, Feb 4, 2008.

  1. neal7250

    neal7250 Well-Known Member

    I recently aquired a T/C Encore 50 cal muzzle loader. I was wondering what the best powder/pellits to use. I will be using the hornady 50 cal sabots.
  2. JJBlanche

    JJBlanche Well-Known Member

    Both my father and I use triple seven exclusively. I only shoot a Ruger Old Army Pistol, but my father has the exact gun that you do (encore 50). Very sweet piece. He uses the trip seven pellets. He tried Pyrodex, but didn't like it. It performs less than triple seven, and makes more of a mess.

    I'm pretty sure the Encore uses 209 primers, right? Winchester just came out with a 209 primer designed specifically for triple seven. It might be a gimmick, but if you can find them at your local gun shop, give them a go.
  3. Mark whiz

    Mark whiz Well-Known Member

    I also will give a thumbs up to 777 powder - although I use loose powder rather than pellets as loose gives me greater control and more load options.

    Go with the 300gr Hornady offerings (XTP Mags or SSTs) over 80 to 100gr of 777 and you should see excellent accuracy.

    Personally I stay away from powder loads over 100gr of 777 as they usually just poorly affect accuracy. Plus the more powder you use, the worse the dreaded "crud ring" can become down by the breech (this issue is what the 777 209 primers were designed to help).
  4. neal7250

    neal7250 Well-Known Member

    Great Information
  5. dispatch55126

    dispatch55126 Well-Known Member

    Use AP. I've had the best accuracy and consistency with it.
  6. Mark whiz

    Mark whiz Well-Known Member

    I was pleased with American Pioneer back when it was Clean Shot - until I had bottle of it go bad on me overnight practically, even though it was kept under HVAC and was less than 6 months old.

    Also AP is about 25% less powerful than 777 - verified both by my Chronograph and target experience. A load that takes 100gr of 2fg 777 needs 125gr of 2fg AP or Clean Shot for equal performance.

    I will say that AP shoots remarkably clean though - almost spooky.

    I did get a bottle of 3fg AP and I'm gonna compare it to the 2fg 777, if it can get results closer to 777 I might consider going to it - IF I can keep it from going bad like before.
  7. Wildfire

    Wildfire Well-Known Member

    Agianst The grain.

    Hey There:
    I hate to do it But I will. I don't use 777. I tried all of the clean burn powders and found no REAL accuracy with them. I use an Encore only.
    80 grains of Pyrodex "P" gives me the accuracy I want. And yes I have to clean my gun. I must run a lubed patch between shoots if I want 1/2 minute of angle accuracy from it. I am an accuracy nut and do not care about magnum loads. I deer hunt with this rifle and wack anything else that gets in the way too. Good Woodchuck gun. I have found after a lot of testing that there are 3 bullets that will shoot the same 1/2" groups with my Encore at 100 meters. The T/C shock waves 300s , The Hornady 300 SST/ML, and The 250 Barnes MZs. All of these will shoot the 1/2" groups with the same 80 grains of "P" and the Rem. 209 ML only primers.
    There is a photo of the target in a thread called "Cast bullets VS Sabots.
    There you can see the groups. :)
  8. scrat

    scrat Well-Known Member

    well i have used both. As of now im out of pryodex but well stocked on both goex and triple 7
  9. dwave

    dwave Well-Known Member

    I use real Black powder myself, but when I do use the subs, it is 777. AP was alright, but it was weak.
  10. alsaqr

    alsaqr Well-Known Member

    My Encore shoots very small groups with 777. However, it is necessary to almost completely clean the bore between shots. Just swabbing the bore will not do it.

    The first shot is always dead on from a clean bore. The second shot from a dirty bore will be somewhere on the target, usually at least 6" from the first shot.
    Have tried every popular brand of primer including all the 777 ones: Still there is that awful 777 crud ring. Totally gave up on 777.

    Am currently using 90 to 110 weighed grains of JSG and a very tight fitting sabot. JSG likes a tight fitting sabot that is seated very firmly: I lean on the ramrod as hard as possible. It works well for me.
  11. Wildfire

    Wildfire Well-Known Member


    Hey There:
    I maybe should have went further then I did. The fact is "alsaqr" is right. I must also clean my bore very well, and not just run a patch down it. My Sons SS Encore is different and wants a slightly fouled bore to shoot straight.
    Pyrodex will leave a hard crusty ring at the bottom of the the bore also but not near as bad as 777. 777 seems to really dry out a bore. And STINKS.
    I choke on the smell of that stuff. And as I said , have never acheived real groups from it. But all bores and shooters are different.
    I am almost sure REAL BP would shoot very well in my Encore also. But to date none of the clean burners have. :)
  12. JNewell

    JNewell Well-Known Member

    This hasn't been the case with my 10ML-II. I have found that I must run a single damp patch down the bore between shots, but brushing or multiple patching doesn't affect things.

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