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Speer GD Short Barrel 9mm 124gr +P

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by The_Shootist, Oct 12, 2010.

  1. The_Shootist

    The_Shootist Well-Known Member

    The same brand has a good rep in .38/.357 so I guess this is aimed at the compact 9mm crowd (Kahr...etc?).

    So I saw a bunch of boxes at Gander Mtn of the 9mm short barrelled version. Now currently I'm carrying the non-bonded version of the Golden Sabre 124 +P round for CHL duty in my G19. But I'm guessing the SB version of the Gold Dot in 9mm would do the trick as well in my Glock, even if labelled for short barrels?

    I'm not thinking of switching, but its always useful to have a backup plan in case there is an interruption of supplies of your usual Sd ammo on the internet.
  2. DenaliPark

    DenaliPark member

    When last I stopped into Gander mountain, they were selling 9mm hollowpoints for damn near $60.00 a box(20).
  3. DonRon

    DonRon member

    Our Military uses 9mm 124 gr NATO FMJ with remarkable success and the are not being attacked by ballistic gelatin either. That's a no brainier for me.
  4. DenaliPark

    DenaliPark member

    Their not having remarkable success with the Nato load, it's universally despised as a completely untrustworthy performer on human targets. 9mm ball is about the worst manstopping cartridge I can think of, with perhaps the possible exception of 158 gr lead roundnose .38 special.
  5. DonRon

    DonRon member

    Gee, my son just completed 27 years in the Military and does not seem to share your views. He also did 6 tours in the sand box and only used his side arm once. He sure did shoot a lot of 5.56 NATO FMJ. Now ball ammunition has been a Military standard for many many years in many wars and as I recall we won most of those. Now as far as .38 round nose, that has played a very successful role with police departments for many years as well. Just how many men do you plan to stop today with your over price and over rated ammunition that was cleverly marketed based on lies?
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2010
  6. ProCarryNAustin

    ProCarryNAustin Well-Known Member

    First off, I appreciate your son's service.

    If he was happy with the performance of 9mm ball, he would be the first of many returning veteran friends of mine that didn't find it sorely lacking. Quite a few of these guys had to rely on their sidearm and with less than stellar results. 5.56 ball and 9mm ball have two totally different wound patterns. 5.56 yaws, splits and causes a lot of damage relative to its caliber. 9mm ball punches neat little holes with very small wound channels and without dumping much of their energy into the target. .38 lead round nose did not serve well as a stopper and it does not take much searching to find that information. Pistols are not good stoppers at best and it is wise to utilize every technical advantage possible. Saying that hollowpoint ammunition is "cleverly marketed and based on lies" is just not born out by the facts. Folks like Evan Marshall, FBI and some of the major state police agencies have been collecting data for many years now to support the effectiveness of more modern pistol ammunition. The fact is, I can't think of a single civilian agency out there that would even authorize full metal jacket ammunition for sidearms let alone mandate its use.
  7. DonRon

    DonRon member

    You are really going to believe the FBI and the Government? Not me! I will do my own thinking thank you very much!
  8. Madcap_Magician

    Madcap_Magician Well-Known Member


    Do you carry 9mm FMJ or something? You'd be the only one I know out of the people who have a choice. Even the NYPD a few years ago finally realized how stupid it was to continue doing that.
  9. ProCarryNAustin

    ProCarryNAustin Well-Known Member

    Actually, I am really going to believe those who have actual test results to base their decisions on instead of ancedotal opinions or those based on no testing at all.
  10. DonRon

    DonRon member

    The US Military has been killing people with round nosed ball and FMJ ammunition with remarkable success for almost 100 years now. That my friend is quantitative proof if there ever was any. Would you stand in front of a ,so called weak .380 loaded with FMJ and get shot with it. I would surely hope not. That is also quantitative proof as well. The human body doesn't do well being hit with objects at speeds over 100 feet a second from a sling shot. You can only imagine how the reaction to objects going at 1,000 feet a second regardless of it's shape would be.

    Care to address that with all your internet expertise?
  11. ohwell

    ohwell Well-Known Member

    JHP ammo is designed to do a couple of important things, one is to expand so as to create a bigger wound channel this may help in a faster stoppage of the threat. Two is to expand and stop in the intended target and not wound more people that may have been in the line of fire. I believe the military may be very happy with just wounding and making more enemy combatants stop fighting to take care of the wounded. They may also like the idea that they could wound more than one person with one shot. Thats not exactly want you want to do in a self defense non militerized zone area.
  12. ProCarryNAustin

    ProCarryNAustin Well-Known Member

    The military uses FMJ because they have to. That is not a compelling reason nor is it quantitative (not sure how that word even applies here) proof. I am not aware of any organization that has a choice and still chooses to use FMJ pistol ammunition. Maybe you could point me to an example. If not, the implication is that all those with a choice have choosen poorly and somehow you and the military (which does not have a choice) are masters of the correct answer. Unlikely.

    I would also be curious how you reconcile the following two statements.
    "You are really going to believe the FBI and the Government? Not me! I will do my own thinking thank you very much!"
    "The US Military has been killing people with round nosed ball and FMJ ammunition with remarkable success for almost 100 years now. That my friend is quantitative proof if there ever was any."

    So are you basing your argument on what the government does, or not?

    If you are interested in the study of actual shootings, I would strongly recommend any of the current books by Evan Marshall. I don't consider this the end all be all, but at least it is based on actual data collected and not just ancedotal assertions.
  13. DonRon

    DonRon member

    You don't really believe that speculation drivel of Evan Marshall now do you. Psst, I have seen real shootings up close when I was in the service and as a police officer. Shot the Hollow point stuff if you feel inclined too but don't knock those of us that don't and stop trying to force your will on me. I do my own thinking, thank you very much.
  14. usp9

    usp9 Well-Known Member

    I am a big fan of Gold Dot but I did not like the Speer GD Short Barrel ammo I tried in my Kahr and HK P2000sk. It is a good, high quality round, no doubt, but it seemed to have a good bit higher recoil. I value being able to get back on target fast and the SGDSB just threw me off too much. I went back to my normal ammo, Ranger T and lately Winchester PDX1+P.
  15. DonRon

    DonRon member

    This useless argument is real easy to shut down. Robert Kennedy was shot and killed by a .22 shot lead round nosed bullet. Just let me know when you would like to see if you like being hit with a .22 shot round nosed bullet sir.
  16. DenaliPark

    DenaliPark member

    The US has signed onto the Hague conventions of 1907(actually they honored the first one too in 1899 but didn't sign it)in which article 23(e)states that no member nation shall use ammunition intended to create unnecessary suffering! Thats why we use ball ammunition, however you should understand that this is considered voluntary by DoD, in fact last I checked, US Special operations troops were all using expanding tip(hollowpoint, or exposed lead, and exotic blended alloy)ammunition!

    Nobody, and I mean nobody of any serious experience, would ever forward the argument that 9mm ball(100 gr, 105 gr, 115 gr or 124 gr)is anything more than a barely marginal performer on human targets.
  17. ProCarryNAustin

    ProCarryNAustin Well-Known Member

    You dispel another person's data collection with only an insult. This is in line with your other posts that I have read and I should have expected as much. Again, please feel free to provide one single organization that has a choice between FMJ and hollowpoint/expanding ammunition and has opted for FMJ. If not, your argument is without support.
  18. eddism

    eddism Well-Known Member

    MagSafe ammo rules with regard to velocity and energy dump in the 9mm size. For me, hopefully, I pray, in the event for the need of using deadly force. That single shot has to finish the job. Price of the ammo has no bearing on the outcome. A cheap lawyer costs around $125/hr.
  19. gofastman

    gofastman Well-Known Member

    Yes, I would bet its a good round too.
    I wonder if the extra recoil you felt was due to a faster burning powder :confused:

    My favorite load for short barrels (well, favorite overall 9mm load :D) is the HST 147gr+P
  20. ProCarryNAustin

    ProCarryNAustin Well-Known Member

    HST is my personal favorite. I have used the standard velocity 147gr in my Glocks and now in my STI. Accurate, clean and performs well within the FBI protocols.


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