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The Difference Between Generic Gun Trusts and Lawyer-Drafted Gun Trusts

Discussion in 'NFA Firearms and Accessories' started by Bartholomew Roberts, Jun 17, 2013.

  1. Aaron Baker

    Aaron Baker Well-Known Member

    The BATFE doesn't "approve" trustees OR beneficiaries. They have no control over who you name as either. As long as your trust is legal under state law, the ATF doesn't get much say in the matter.

    I could go on and on about why they wouldn't even have any way of knowing whether or not trustees are related to you based on last names, the inability of the ATF to run background checks on anyone based on a name alone, etc...

    But suffice it to say that approved tax stamps are issued to trusts every day that have trustees and beneficiaries who are unrelated to the grantor/creator/settlor of the trust.


    P.S. Where DO these rumors get started?
  2. Bartholomew Roberts

    Bartholomew Roberts Moderator Emeritus

    You would think that should be the case; but I just talked with another attorney who had a client's Form 4 denied because of a typo in his trust that had no effect on the validity of the trust. He was able to resolve it by calling the examiner; but the fact ATF was even looking at provisions that had no effect on the validity of the trust or whether trustees were prohibited was ridiculous.

    However, none of that changes what Mr. Baker said about non-family members. Who trustees and beneficiaries are is a matter for state law - and I'm not aware of any state with the limitations you mentioned.
  3. diablo2184

    diablo2184 Active Member

    anyone is south florida have a good attorney i could use for this?
  4. MCMXI

    MCMXI Well-Known Member

    Is a trust created by an attorney in one state valid in all states? For example, let's say I buy suppressors in state A and register them with the ATF using a trust created in state A. I then move to state B (that allows suppressor ownership) and buy more suppressors. Can I use the same trust from state A to register those suppressors with the ATF even though I'm living in state B?
  5. MCMXI

    MCMXI Well-Known Member

    I spoke with a very knowledgeable attorney in MT today who offers a trust service specifically for those wanting to own or purchase NFA items. He even bothered to differentiate between Title II weapons and Class III FFL dealers (big plus there). He mentioned that it's more likely that a trust created in a state other than MT would be valid here rather than the other way around. He cited the "low bar" to establish a trust in MT as being the reason.

    A quick search revealed this from the Montana Judicial Branch.


    72-38-403. Trusts created in other jurisdictions. A trust not created by will is validly created if its creation complies with the law of the jurisdiction in which the trust instrument was executed or the law of the jurisdiction in which, at the time of creation:
    (1) the settlor was domiciled, had a place of abode, or was a national;
    (2) a trustee was domiciled or had a place of business; or
    (3) any trust property was located.

    History: En. Sec. 52, Ch. 264, L. 2013.
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2014
  6. Well done!! Thanks for this great advice and insight...
  7. PBR Streetgang

    PBR Streetgang Well-Known Member

    diablo2184, I used an gun friendly and firearm law attorney out of Ft Myers .Did my trust and educated me along the way....J.Patrick Buckley 239-278-7700 www.buckleyesq.com .

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