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Thought Crimes and the British Gestapo

Discussion in 'Legal' started by MicroBalrog, Jul 17, 2003.

  1. MicroBalrog

    MicroBalrog member

    The following was given to me by John Pate, the representative of the Self-Defense Network in the UK

  2. rrader

    rrader member

    The first thing that comes to mind is that this fellow is much too easily pushed around. A baseball bat or axe handel in the trunk of the car (cricket bat in the boot?) would have gotten the tow-truck driver to back off, and a little practice in telling the police to politely go fu*k off would help also.
  3. CGofMP

    CGofMP Well-Known Member

    They defeat one socialist 'gentleman' and elect a bunch of others...
    Must be a European thing.

    Go figure.


    Gun Grabbers Slogan: Peace In Our Time?
  4. Navy joe

    Navy joe Well-Known Member

    All over a musket folks. I guess the lesson here is that there is a critical point after which the collective is too powerless to resist the controllers. We're not there yet, but not for lack of some of our public "servants" trying.

    What's Standing Wolf have to say upon this matter of great import?
  5. fallingblock

    fallingblock Well-Known Member

    Well, at least there are still some places

    WORSE than Australia when it comes to treatment of gun owners:rolleyes:

    I had to obtain TWO import permits to be allowed to receive 70 unprimed empty .303 cartridges recently...the friend in N.Z. had sent them unsolicited and I didn't even know I was a lawbreaker until the Customs letter turned up. :eek:

    My concern is the same as this fellow's...I wonder if that means my name on a list of 'armed & dangerous scofflaws' somewhere :uhoh:
  6. agricola

    agricola Well-Known Member

    oh dear me:

    Some thirty minutes later I
    was moved to an interview room and, some time later, asked to give my
    consent to a search of my home. The inference was clear: either consent to
    a search or, wait in a cell while a warrant was sought.

    Under s.18 of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984 Police do not need your consent for a search of your property if you've already been arrested for an offence and an Inspector has reasonable grounds to suspect that evidence of an offence is on the premises. In addition there are powers under the Firearms Act that can be used to inspect the arrangements made for the storage of weapons held under a s1 licence. There is no issue of consent on the facts given - they would not ask for it.

    Having nothing to
    hide I gave my consent and was permitted to drive my car home while the
    police followed.

    If the author actually was under arrest there would be no way that he would be allowed to drive home, never mind "followed by a Police car". Of all of this, this rings the least true (which in itself is an achievement).

    Thereafter to take a holiday out of the force area until
    it was time to fly out of Britain as there was a grave danger that Avon
    and Somerset Constabulary may re-arrest me on some minor offence (conduct
    likely to cause a breach of the peace?) or under the Terrorism Act 2000
    (which makes it a criminal offense, for example, to have a list of names
    of your elected representatives)

    The Terrorism Act 2000 does not make it a criminal offence to be in possession of a list of names of MPs, councillors, or anyone else for that matter. There is an offence of being in possession of material likely to be of use to terrorists, but this refers to the content and the manner in which the information was gained. For instance, a list of MPs names would not be covered - but a list of (for example) Unionist MP's home addresses, notes on security at those addresses, police response times and so on might well be if associated with other terrorist material.

    "Breach of the Peace" is an archaic but still used piece of common law legislation used when there is a likelyhood of violence. It could not be used in such a situation as described by the author.

    Despite being the victim I was arrested and held for a total of six
    hours while my person and property were searched.

    He cant even remember what he wrote: from time of arrest, he spends thirty minutes in a corridor, then an interview (which from his story seems short) and an hour at his home. This makes for an hour and a half, at most two hours. Four and a half hours travelling time?

    In fact, I'd suggest that the Police would be more likely to seize his tinfoil hat rather than the pistols. :rolleyes:
  7. 0007

    0007 Well-Known Member

    So I guess the guy just made up the whole story so you could get out your skeptic brush and once again tell us that things are really ok for that (fast dwindling) dispised group known as gun owners in merry old england?
  8. agricola

    agricola Well-Known Member

    no, I'm suggesting the story is grossly exaggerated for the reasons listed above.
  9. Thufer

    Thufer Member

    Sounds like the United States in another 10 years.
  10. rrader

    rrader member

    More proof, if any was needed, of just what a low and retrograde legal system the UK has. Not even the basics of protection of civil rights are there, sad.
  11. Ryder

    Ryder Well-Known Member

    I didn't know they used "miles" there.

    I've never been absolutely positive that the american indians weren't really onto something by refusing to let their pictures to be taken at the risk of having their souls stolen.
  12. agricola

    agricola Well-Known Member


    how can the UK's legal system be "retrograde" if you idealize the old UK system (via the US constitution)? honestly, please learn some new words.
  13. rrader

    rrader member

    "Idealize" the British System? In case you missed it there was a revolution fought to rid ourselves of the low and retrograde British Legal system.

    As for for learning new words, perhaps you could explain why you bleat on endlessly about Martin having shot one the the thugs who burglarized his home "in the back as he ran away." You haven't evaluated any blood splatter evidence that indicates the thug was running away. The most that can be said is that Martin shot in the dark after waiting and trying his best to identify the intruders. How sheep-like of you to bleat the assumption that it was an ambush killing.

    Truthfully, You don't own any firearms or have any experience with them. You merely bleat your biased and ignorant nonsense about a shooting you don't have the experience or basic knowledge to evaluate. Or do you have some special intelligence background, in the proud British tradition of Philby, Burgess, and McLean perhaps, which affords you special knowledge of the case?

  14. agricola

    agricola Well-Known Member


    rrader, the evidence was presented at Martin's trial, in which, by the "low and retrograde method" of having twelve of his peers hear all the evidence and determine him guilty of murder in light of that evidence.

    oh, and do you know of William Blackstone? Maybe you should read how the framers consulted Blackstone, and the 1688 BoR, rather than quoting yourself.

    But, i dont own a gun, so my intellect is clearly defective. :rolleyes:
  15. MicroBalrog

    MicroBalrog member

    And that's fine with you?:uhoh:
  16. agricola

    agricola Well-Known Member

    yes - it satisfies, having an acceptable level of vigilance, without descending into blowing people up without trial, internment and so on.
  17. MicroBalrog

    MicroBalrog member

    Let me give you an example:

    A few days before 9/11 I downloaded an aircraft operations manual. Needless to say, my friend was totally freaked out when he hear of it 9/20.
    (true story)
    Am I a terrorist?

    Is possession of The Anarchist Cookbook 4.14 a crime under that act?
  18. agricola

    agricola Well-Known Member


    by itself, no. However would you to be in possession of that, materials to make a bomb and/or plans for its deployment then you would be.
  19. MicroBalrog

    MicroBalrog member

    I'm currently in possession of

    a)Aforementioned aircraft manual
    b)Anarchist cookbook
    c)material to make a bomb (common household stuff)

    Am I a terrorist?
  20. agricola

    agricola Well-Known Member


    do you intend to use that information/material for violence?

    if so, yes.

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