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Top 10 Battle Rifles

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Molon Labe, Nov 20, 2006.

  1. Molon Labe

    Molon Labe Participating Member

    Jun 17, 2003
    SW Ohio
    Military Channel's Top 10 Battle Rifles:

    10 - M14
    9 - Sturmgewehr 44
    8 - 1903 Springfield
    7 - Steyr AUG
    6 - Mauser K98k Carbine
    5 - FN FAL
    4 - M1 Garand
    3 - Lee Enfield SMLE
    2 - M16
    1 - AK47

    Would you agree with this ranking?

    Personally, I would put the M14, FAL, and M1 higher in the list.
  2. UglyGlock

    UglyGlock New Member

    Oct 23, 2006
    based on what? numbers issued?
  3. iamkris

    iamkris Senior Member

    Jan 6, 2003
    My own little slice of Purgatory
    Their criteria was flawed in my opinion.

    1) They used "Service Length" as a strange measure of how good a rifle was
    2) They did some bizarre rankings of "Combat Effectiveness" (how is an 03 Springfield "low", a 98K "average"? How is a FAL "average" but an M14 "excellent"?)
    3) A AUG was even in the running? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

    The Tuesday Nov 14 blog entry of Chris Byrne on Anarchangel does a pretty good job of summing up my thoughts

  4. browningguy

    browningguy Senior Member

    Jul 21, 2004
    Houston, TX
    Well you had to watch the show to really understand their reasoning. A lot of the score has to do with time in service, numbers issued, importance to military doctrine. Rifles like the M1 and M14 lose a lot due to the relatively short time they were an issue weapon. The M16 for example is 40 now, and the AK was standard issue in some countries for almost 50 years.Even though it may not be as accurate, or as finely built as others the AK is probably the most recognized firearm in the world, heck, it's even on some national flags.
  5. ribbonstone

    ribbonstone Member

    Jan 26, 2006
    New Orleans
    Seems they pretty much got the order right based on their criteria....change the criteria, and the results would change.
  6. RNB65

    RNB65 Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2006
    Richmond, VA
    Drop the M14 and add the Mosin-Nagant.
  7. mbt2001

    mbt2001 Senior Member

    Dec 5, 2005
    I am surprised that the M1 carbine isn't in their...
  8. No_Brakes23

    No_Brakes23 Participating Member

    Mar 19, 2005
    Everett, WA Recently escaped from San Diego, PRK
    I think the -14, (Of which I am no fan,) has more of a claim to the list than the AUG. If you are gonna kick an auto-loader off the list in favor of a bolt, lose the AUG.

    But the Nagant certainly deserves consideration.
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2006
  9. SoCalShooter

    SoCalShooter Senior Member

    Oct 3, 2006
    That's for me to know and not you!
    No. I disagee this is a poor list. For me I would rate a rifle on different criteria. Sturmgewer and the aug dont make the list for me.

    1. Combat effectiveness (according to troops)
    2. Reliability in combat

    If these were the criteria. My list would be

    1. AK and its varients
    2. Springfield 1903
    3. Gewehr k98
    4. Mosin Nagant
    5. Enfield Mk3
    6. M1 Garand
    7. m16 and all its flavors
    8. m14 / M1a
    9. Springfield .58caliber musket
    10. FN FAL
  10. MountainBear

    MountainBear Active Member

    Aug 7, 2006
    I'm sorry, but any list that doesn't have the M-1 Garand as number one has to be flawed. Something about some guy calling it "the greatest battle implement ever invented"? Something tells me Patton knew what he was saying...
  11. John-Melb

    John-Melb Member

    Apr 13, 2006
    To assess the greatest battle rifle you've got to assess it's use in combat real situations.

    The most major war in living memory is World War 2.

    The first significant defeat suffered by German land forces was inflicted by soldiers using the No1 Mk 3 SMLE. It was at a place called Tobruk.

    The first significant defeat suffered by Japanese land forces was inflicted by soldiers using the No1 Mk 3 SMLE. It was a place called Imita Ridge.

    In both case the rifles used were made at Lithgow.

    .303 - for when you absolutely have to put the son of a bitch down!
  12. kd7nqb

    kd7nqb Senior Member

    May 1, 2006
    Puyallup Washington
    Mountain Bear- What was Pattons view on the M16 or even the AK-47. Sorry new models do occasionally appear.
  13. eab

    eab Member

    Feb 7, 2005
    I personaly don't see even why the Springfield 1903 is on the list. Before you all call hertic on me let me explain. Yes it was an American rifle that served for a long time but in the end it was just a standard military bolt action of the time.

    So it was accurate and powerfull, so were Mausers and Mosin Nagents and most other military bolt rifles of the time.

    It was based off the Mauser for crying out loud. The Mauser parent company acutally sued for patient infringments in US courts and won.

    Mauser bolt action rifle yes, most copied military bolt action on the face of the earth I would say. Springfield, no.
  14. MountainBear

    MountainBear Active Member

    Aug 7, 2006
    Yes, they do, but I would argue this. The M-16 has had a long run, but I'm sorry. I've talked to soldiers. I will not debate the caliber, as that is a cna of worms I care not to open, however the complaint I have always heard is that it is not tough. Most, if not all, of the soldiers that I have talked to have used the example of the M-14 or M-1 being used as a step being held by two soldiers to help someone over a wall. They claimed that (and I would tend to agree) if you tried this with an M-16 (or clone, M-4, etc), it would at the least bend the buffer tube, at most break the plastic stock. The use of a rifle being used as a step is not a test of battle effectiveness, it does demonstrate toughness.
    As for the AK-47. It would be a close second to the M-1. It has the numbers edge. No one debates its toughness. I would argue that it is more of a spray and pray firepower weapon. Less accurate, more make the enemy keep his head down.
    I would argue the accuracy, the toughness, and the historical significance of the M-1 and its conflict (WWII, Korea) places it at the top of the list.
    I would hate to live on the difference if the AK had been in service in WWII.
  15. The_Shootist

    The_Shootist Participating Member

    Aug 15, 2003
    Richmond Tx, CSA
    Of Course

    If I was sent to hell...or another planet....and given ONE choice as to assault rife to carry, it would be the ONE...the ONLY AK-47!! :evil:
  16. TimboKhan

    TimboKhan Moderator

    Apr 15, 2005
    Greeley, CO
    Objectively, I don't agree with the AUG being included. If it were me, I think a much more deserving rifle would be the Swedish Mauser, or even going back further in time, the Krag.

    Personally, I hate the FAL. I know, I know, it is a good rifle that everyone but me loves, but I have just never liked them, and I probably never will. Again, this is only my personal opinion, but I think I would have not included the FAL in favor of something like the BAR, or even the K31 or SKS. Heck, I personally would place the AUG ahead of the FAL. Like I have said though, that is my personal opinion, not my objective one.

    Also, I don't disagree with the AK being #1, but I do disagree with the Garand not being higher. The AK is probably not the over-all finest battle weapon around, but it is the most ubiquitous of the group, and it does have a fine reputation for reliable service in pretty much all climates. Certainly, the Garand was more accurate, and in it's glory days, it was "the" battle rifle of choice. However, the Garand had nothing near the longetivity or the widespread dispersal of the AK, and for those reasons, I think the AK is probably good at #1. The Garand is a better weapon than the M-16, and I will go to my grave defending that statement. I am not an M-16 hater by any stretch of the imagination, and it probably does deserve to be on the list, but I just think the Garand is a better rifle. Specifically, I would probably just flip the Garand's and the M-16's positions, because the SMLE is one hell of a rifle.
  17. Shweboner

    Shweboner Active Member

    Feb 17, 2003
    Newberg, OR
    The Steyr AUG? What the?

    If I made a top 25, that wouldn't even cross my mind.
  18. ilbob

    ilbob Elder

    Jun 14, 2006
    If length of service was a criteria the brown bess musket should have been included.
  19. cbsbyte

    cbsbyte Participating Member

    Mar 24, 2005
    Cradle of Liberty
    It would if the list was the top 25 fugly rifles ever made. :D

    Nope not true. Springfield knew before they build the first rifle that some of the 1903 designs infringed on several Mausers patents, so they sent the plans to Mauser who of course agreed that they did infringe on their rifle patents. They worked out an amicable deal where Springfield had to pay royalties for several years. It was DWM the inventer of the sptizer bullet that took the US military to court for design infringments for the 30.06 rifle bullet. DWM won in court after WWI, and the US Government had to pay hefty fines to basicaly buy the design off DWM.
  20. 12GA00buck

    12GA00buck Member

    Sep 3, 2006
    " Accuracy is average, but the Kalashnikov compensates for this with its ability to unleash a lethal wall of lead."

    Sounds like spray and pray to me. Funny, I thought shot placement was important.:D

    I think there should be seperate lists for battle rifles, assult rifles, and sniper rifles.

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