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"unloaded" weapon loophole not yet closed!(CA)

Discussion in 'Legal' started by PrudentGT, Jul 3, 2004.

  1. PrudentGT

    PrudentGT Member

    May 17, 2003
    Bay Area, PRK
    As if the state assembly doesn't have better things to do. Here' s the text of the flyer I had waiting for me when I got home from work this evening:

    Gun lobby kills tough Handgun-Carrying Law...
    Legislation would have closed the "unloaded" weapon loophole.

    Say "No" to the gun lobby and push back: find out how you can help.
    California State Assembly
    Rebecca Cohn
    Assemblymember, 24th District

    Dear Friends:
    The gun lobby did it again. It flexed its muscle in the Legislature and killed a proposed new law that would have stopped people from carrying unloaded, exposed handguns on city streets.

    Unbelievably, under current law practically anyone can walk around your neighborhood carrying a handgun in plain sight - as long as it is unloaded.

    An exposed gun is intimidating - even unloaded ones. And with a pocket full of bullets - which, under current law can legally be carried - an unloaded gun can quickly become lethal.

    Opposed to any restrictions on firearms, the National Rifle Association and other "pro-gun groups" did their best to scrap this new law. But they've pushed too far and it's time to push back!.

    You can help. Complete the attached card and let the Speaker of the Assembly and the Public Safety Committee know that the public is watching. By banding together, the gun lobby can be defeated.

    Capitol Office: State Capitol * PO Box 942849 * Sacramento, CA 94249-0024 * (916)319-2024
    District Office: 901 Campisi Way, Suite 300 * Campbell, CA 95008 * (408)369-8170
    E-mail: Assemblymember.Cohn@assembly.ca.gov
    Web Site: http://democrats.assembly.ca.gov/members/a24
    Assembly Web Site: www.assembly.ca.gov

    Please complete the card below, DETATCH, and affix proper postage.

    TO: Speaker, California State Assembly Chairman, Assembly Public Safety Committee


    Name, Address, blah blah blah...

    The gun lobby has gone too far! It's time to close the "unloaded gun" loophole. Carrying an exposed "unloaded" handgun should be illegal. Your support is necessary to help make neighborhoods safe from gun violence. Please know that voters are aware and watching.


    Well, I've already got a pretty good idea of whom I'll be writing and what I'll be saying, but I thought I'd give the board a chance to do what it does best... DISCUSS!!!
  2. PromptCritical

    PromptCritical Member

    May 5, 2003
    The State of the Beaver
    I already knew about this "loophole". I decided one would have to be an idiot to open carry an unloaded gun. It would serve no useful purpose and would just cause a disturbance among the sheeple. Besides, I'm sure nearby cops would want to ask why one would do such a stupid thing.

    The people behind this should be worried about things besides legal, open-carried, unloaded guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. Namely, illegal, concealed, loaded guns in the hands of criminals.
  3. RooK

    RooK Member

    May 13, 2004
    KY, USA
    They'd crap their pants if they knew you could open carry a loaded gun in Kentucky. :)

    I swear, they act like the unloaded gun is going to jump out of the holster and start a neighborhood massacre. Reminds me of the guy with the web camera on his S&W revolver. He's keeping an eye on it to see if it causes any crime, and if any internet viewer sees something suspicous they're supposed to contact him via email. :D
  4. Jim March

    Jim March Mentor

    Dec 24, 2002
    SF Bay Area
    Somebody has scanned this same thing and EMailed it to me. Tuesday I'll be checking to see if what she's doing is legal or not. I'm just not sure at this point.

    Here's what's REALLY going on:

    The bill in question (AB2828) was Irwin Nowick's idea.

    Irwin is this infamously weird dude who's basically THE top gun-control strategist in Sacramento. The Dems give him various innocous staff jobs but what he's really doing is thunking up new gun control.

    The guy is INCREDIBLY smart, genius IQ, absolutely no "street smarts" whatsoever and "people skills" ranging from pathetic to horrific :). A definate Asperger's case if ever there was one...I have it too, to a much lesser degree.

    So anyways...he comes up with this idea to ban the last vestiges of "open carry" still on the books.

    Problem: the WAY he did it was so incredibly convoluted it wasn't even funny. He made like 15+ changes (I lost count) across three major code sections...not just Penal Code stuff, but "business and professions code" and I don't even remember what else. It was just freaky. I was afraid the sucker had hidden "features" scattered throughout.

    So I asked the staffers for the bill's three authors what was up. NONE of 'em knew the whole story on what the bill was trying to do. Koretz's staff had tried to get him to avoid this turkey, but he wouldn't listen.

    I was running up against a deadline to put out SOME sort of written statement on this thing, the bill's author's staff were telling Irwin to call me, he didn't. There's rules on this sort of thing, they're supposed to tell you what's up.

    So I had to write *something* by the deadline (a few days prior to the Assembly Safety Committee hearing).

    THIS was the result:

    AB2828 (Cohn et al): Statement of Opposition

    Prepared by:
    Citizen’s Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms – 4/8/04
    Jim March – California Field Rep, 916-370-0347 / jmarch@prodigy.net

    Our organization has deep concerns over any bill in which the following situation arises:

    1) It seems to be the most confusing mess in legislative history, barring the yearly budgets.

    2) It is a product of Irwin Nowick.

    3) No staffers from the offices of Wesson, Koretz or Cohn are available who know anything about it.

    4) Irwin won’t return our calls.

    5) The bill changes 15 items across 3 chapters, in ways which appear to be impossible. Example: the term “concealed firearm†(as something illegal) is frequently changed to “concealed handgunâ€. If we’re reading this right, we’re about to legalize the concealed carry of rifles and shotguns!? Did somebody invest in a trench coat factory and are trying to boost sales?

    6) At least one set of proposed changes in Penal Code 12050 are not properly italicized so they can be spotted as changes, in the online edition of the text:


    Only someone very familiar with PC12050 would spot the additions (“permits for openly carried unloaded firearms� Why the heck?). If the text isn’t properly marked up as this instance shows, then God only knows what is going on here.

    Our organization asks that this bill be junked as the biggest mess since the Davis recall.

    Failing that, we ask that Irwin be dragged into detox long enough to explain just what in the name of Sarah Brady’s gun closet is going on here.

    At the committee hearing, they ran way late that day and the bill was one of the last heard at almost 7:00pm. All the other pro gunnies had gone home. As the sole opposition, I explained that open carry had been banned in the late 60's when the Black Panthers managed to scare the heck out of the legislature by carrying openly right in the building. While that was a politically stupid move on their part, fear based on one incident wasn't a good basis for legislation.

    Today, the last vestiges of open carry Irwin seemed to want to exterminate are used to protect honest people in rare cases such as carrying to/from hunting and similar; urban open carry of handguns was unheard of because legal or not, it would attract massive police attention. So law enforcement wasn't supporting the bill because they didn't see the need - rather than the whole legislature being scared, we were now down to the point of basing legislation on ONE person's fears: Irwin Nowick.

    I also pointed out the extreme complexity of the bill, and that I didn't have a supercomputer available to analyze all of it's possible effects and I doubted Irwin or the bill's authors did either.

    The bill died in that committee...which is VERY rare for a gun control bill and pissed Cohn off no end.

    This bizarre mailing is apparantly her response.

    What I want to know is, who did this SLICK layout? Did she get help from Brady/VPC or whatever? Who paid for all this?

    Dunno yet...but I'm gonna find out.
  5. Jim March

    Jim March Mentor

    Dec 24, 2002
    SF Bay Area
    GREAT piece on Irwin:

    Where's Irwin?

    When the combustible Peace termed out of the Senate last year and was named Davis' finance director, Capitol mavens seemed to have but one question on their minds.

    Whither Irwin?

    That would be Irwin Nowick -- also known as "the I man" and other less-desirable nicknames. The brusque, in-your-face policy savant has been wandering the Capitol halls at Peace's side for years, loudly rattling off tax statistics and the nuances of gun laws, and generally barging into a conversation near you.

    Would Peace bring Nowick along to the staid Department of Finance?

    Apparently not. But Nowick said he's keeping his options open, including a move to Pennsylvania where he could keep watch over the shopping malls he inherited and enjoy a lower income tax rate.

    "They'll get (my income tax) and you guys will get nothing, so you ought to act with a little more respect," he warned last week.

    Davis press secretary Steve Maviglio confirmed that Nowick has applied for a job with the administration.

    "Irwin is an unique individual with unique talent," Maviglio said.

    The most likely outcome, however, has Nowick staying on as an employee of both the Assembly and the Senate, as kind of a two-house consultant/irritant.

    "Irwin is kind of like the Capitol cat," said one Senate staffer, "and we're not going to get rid of the Capitol cat, either."

  6. Don of Kalifornia

    Don of Kalifornia New Member

    Jan 26, 2003
    I know Irwin well myself, he also wrote the Kalfornia energy deregulation bill, that caused us power black outs, and monthly power bills over $500.00. This 'man' is truely a total slob(watching him eat will totally turn your stomach), he lives a block or two from the capitol so he can walk to work, as he has no driver's licence, and can not seem to handle passing the driver's test. He comes from a very weathy New York Jewish family inheriting millions in trust accounts, and salery he receives working for legislators, he donates back to them. Other than writing gun bills, he's now thick in screwing with the trucking industry here in **********.

    He wrote our 'gunshow bill' here in **********, in which he required one policeMAN for every five tables at the gunshow, I was working at the Capitol then representing gun dealers, my reply was 'Can't police women also watch the tables?' The bill sponser Ellen Corbett turn bright red, you can tell she never ever read, or had some one read the bill.
  7. WilderBill

    WilderBill Active Member

    Dec 25, 2002
    Mr. Nowick sounds like a real piece of work.

    I'd have to disagree about the concept that unloaded, open carry serves no purpose.
    While it isn't much use for defense, it does help the sheeple get used to the idea and it could serve as a vehicle to a revised version that includes loaded, open carry.
    Yeah, I know, it's Kommiefornia.
    Here's my idea; if there were even a very few exceptions, say for off duty LEOs, then the average crook would have to guess if that handgun on your hip is loaded or not.
  8. LAR-15

    LAR-15 Senior Member

    Mar 1, 2004
    I would investigate those emails.

    That woman is an idiot if she thinks the NRA runs Sacramento
  9. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

    Dec 24, 2002
    Idahohoho, the jolliest state
    Only if you're a.) completely stupid; b.) completely irrational, or c.) both.
  10. Old Fuff

    Old Fuff Senior Elder

    Dec 24, 2002
    Standing Wolf:

    Since we're discussing a situation in California ....

    Both conditions apply ..... :cuss:
  11. anapex

    anapex Participating Member

    Jun 10, 2003
    Free at last in PA!
    Man, I'm feel for ya Jim but please keep him there! If I ever get the chance to move back to PA he's definitely one person I don't want to find there!
  12. Treylis

    Treylis Participating Member

    Dec 14, 2003
    Tempe, Arizona
    Wouldn't that be nice, though? ;-)
  13. PrudentGT

    PrudentGT Member

    May 17, 2003
    Bay Area, PRK
    Yeah, I was wondering about who footed the bill for the fancy scare propaganda, too. I just assumed that we the taxpayers did.

    I actually spoke to someone who voted for Cohn a while back. He says she was going door to door for votes at the time, which impressed him, and that she stated she had no interest in gun control. When I brought this recent mailing to his attention, he was 'very disappointed.'

    I do get the feeling that with the overall disatisfaction in California's government, people are starting to realize that gun control only affects the law-abiding.

    Keep us posted, Jim!
  14. gunsmith

    gunsmith member

    May 8, 2003
    Reno, Nevada
    I man

    Probably couldn't handle living in PA,sounds like he would have a meltdown like that Star Trek episode,you know the one the machine that thinks Cap't Kirk was it's inventor.
    How would he handle all the concealed carry and other cool PA laws?

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