MSGT9410
Member
Just out of curiosity, what is the US Navy's reasoning behind issuing M-14s over the M16 and its variants, as seen with the other branches of the US Military?
What countrys use 7.62x51mm Battle rifles
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The Real Hawkeye
member
At sea, ranges are more often much farther than on land, which would indicate the need for a longer range weapon. That's my guess.
KriegHund
Member
Things would have to be pretty bad for that need to come in.
The Real Hawkeye
member
Oh? Well how about this. Your unit is on a ship to shore boat, and pirates with AK 47s open fire from another boat, or from shore, 500 yards away. Do you think a rifle with a 600 plus yard range would be handy, or would you rather have a poodle shooter?
Pafrmu
Member
I would rather use the .50 cal mounted on the side of the ship.
Crosshair
Member
My Co-Worker got to play with the 50 cals when he was in the Navy. Apparently you CAN hunt seagull with a 50 but there will be little, if anything, left. Then they would plink at trash that they threw overboard with the M-60s.
Then they would plink at trash that they threw overboard with the M-60s.No_Brakes23
Member
When I was ship's defense we were told that the Navy used the M14s because they were in inventory and because of the range and punch.
But if a hostile boat approaches, they also have the option of shooting with the .50s, (In Port or when anchored,) or the CIWS. Amphibs also have a 25mm cannons. We were told that unless "Release Batteries" was sounded over the radio, we were not to fire. We were also told that we would know when to fire because "A hellacious noise is going to be coming from the direction of the .50."
The reason they don't use the M16A* rifles is probably because they no longer recieve any M16 training in boot camp, (Usually they shoot the M9 instead.) Even back in 1996, the Nayv was having them shoot .22LR chambered ARs.
But if a hostile boat approaches, they also have the option of shooting with the .50s, (In Port or when anchored,) or the CIWS. Amphibs also have a 25mm cannons. We were told that unless "Release Batteries" was sounded over the radio, we were not to fire. We were also told that we would know when to fire because "A hellacious noise is going to be coming from the direction of the .50."
The reason they don't use the M16A* rifles is probably because they no longer recieve any M16 training in boot camp, (Usually they shoot the M9 instead.) Even back in 1996, the Nayv was having them shoot .22LR chambered ARs.
ghost squire
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Deck.
Guns.
Crosshair
Member
How long does it take to get the 5" deck gun on a destroyer ready to fire? I'm sure you have to start it up, load it, enter the targeting data and get it pointed at the target. (I have no idea how long this takes.) Then there is the problem of hitting a small target that is moving and may or may not be taken out by a near miss. (Not that it is going to be any easier for you to hit them in the boat.) What happens if the bow of the ship is facing away and the 5" can't be brought to bear on the enemy target, then what?
steveracer
Member
Ok, let's talk Navy tactics.
I'm at a Fleet Command, (COMSECONDFLT) and we handle most of these questions in-house, so maybe I can help.
M-14s are in the inventory and we order new ones all the time. All of the new ones we get are Semi-auto only.
The only time a ship's force is using an M-14 is when NOT out in the open ocean. Our typical littoral defense is a helicopter airborne, and small boats wherever we can use them.
Most destroyers and cruisers now have the GE M134 7.62 minigun, which is infinitely more effective than either an M-60 or M-14. These are used when transiting tight spots, like the Suez canal, or the straits of Gibraltar. We also have .50 cal M-2s on deck, and the occaisonal 20mm cannon.
CIWS can be operated remotely by manual control, and would make any small boat threat totally disappear.
The 5" gun, although a very good weapon, is really designed for open ocean fighting, or NSFS operations (think artillery)
Our best bet, when tied to a pier, is to have a very mobile fight stopper in the hands of as many people as possible. That means M-14s, and small boats with M-60s.
These use the same round (7.62x51mm) which makes good sense. If I'm on watch on any ship anywhere in the world, and the Force Protection Officer gives me a choice of weapon to carry around, I immediately say M-14. Try stopping a truck with a Beretta.
The other thing is, a squid with an M-14 can go anywhere on the ship or pier that he is needed. Not as easy with an M-60. These are better fight stoppers, but not as mobile.
Now, the minigun, M-60, and M-14 all use the same ammo, so why make things difficult for the Ordinance Officer by adding 5.56?
That's why we use them.
Questions?
I'm at a Fleet Command, (COMSECONDFLT) and we handle most of these questions in-house, so maybe I can help.
M-14s are in the inventory and we order new ones all the time. All of the new ones we get are Semi-auto only.
The only time a ship's force is using an M-14 is when NOT out in the open ocean. Our typical littoral defense is a helicopter airborne, and small boats wherever we can use them.
Most destroyers and cruisers now have the GE M134 7.62 minigun, which is infinitely more effective than either an M-60 or M-14. These are used when transiting tight spots, like the Suez canal, or the straits of Gibraltar. We also have .50 cal M-2s on deck, and the occaisonal 20mm cannon.
CIWS can be operated remotely by manual control, and would make any small boat threat totally disappear.
The 5" gun, although a very good weapon, is really designed for open ocean fighting, or NSFS operations (think artillery)
Our best bet, when tied to a pier, is to have a very mobile fight stopper in the hands of as many people as possible. That means M-14s, and small boats with M-60s.
These use the same round (7.62x51mm) which makes good sense. If I'm on watch on any ship anywhere in the world, and the Force Protection Officer gives me a choice of weapon to carry around, I immediately say M-14. Try stopping a truck with a Beretta.
The other thing is, a squid with an M-14 can go anywhere on the ship or pier that he is needed. Not as easy with an M-60. These are better fight stoppers, but not as mobile.
Now, the minigun, M-60, and M-14 all use the same ammo, so why make things difficult for the Ordinance Officer by adding 5.56?
That's why we use them.
Questions?
The Real Hawkeye
member
That makes sense to me, but the 7.62 NATO is also a better round by far than the 5.56mm.
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