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Who had the best machine guns? The Nazis or America? MOVIE

Discussion in 'NFA Firearms and Accessories' started by PTMCCAIN, May 25, 2012.


    PTMCCAIN member

    I thought you guys would appreciate this old Army movie.

    I'm still trying to put my feelings about it into words, but it is apparent it was intended to bolster confidence in American machine guns in light of the overwhelming superiority of the German machine guns.

    Here is the movie, see what you think.

  2. Beagle-zebub

    Beagle-zebub Well-Known Member

    Ours (the 1919) fired from a closed bolt and had no provision for quick barrel-change. Slam dunk, I'd say.

    PTMCCAIN member

    Sorry...you are saying:

    America's were the best?
  4. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam


    Not the ones I used between 1964 and whenever it was I saw my first M-60.

    All Browning LMG's fired from an open bolt, and always did, as far as I know.

    One could give the Germans credit for the quick-change barrel on the MG34/MG42.
    Our M60 used a lot of features from the MG32/MG42 later in the 1950's.

    But one has to question the unrealistically high rate of fire of the MG42 if you were the one trying to pack enough ammo to feed them and keep them running during a battle.

  5. 56hawk

    56hawk Well-Known Member

    I have heard that open bolt conversions were done to 1919s around the Vietnam era for vehicle mount, but WWII 1919's were closed bolt.
  6. Driftertank

    Driftertank Well-Known Member

    ...especially given that it used full-power, full-sized rifle ammo. I've heard plenty of guys complain about humping extras for SAW gunners. Imagine carting that loadout in 7.92x57...

    PTMCCAIN member

    As my kids would say, "Word!"
  8. R.W.Dale

    R.W.Dale Well-Known Member

    Your kids are older than me if they're saying that :p
  9. Marlin 45 carbine

    Marlin 45 carbine Well-Known Member

    if your life depended on it I'd say franz would hump a couple links or more.
    they were mostly defense weapons though.
  10. AlexanderA

    AlexanderA Well-Known Member

    The Germans had the best LMG of WWII, the MG42.

    The U.S. had the best infantry rifle of WWII, the M1 Garand.

    This makes sense because the German squad "base of fire" centered on the LMG, while the American "base of fire" consisted of the individual riflemen.

    A meaningful comparison would pit the firepower of squad vs. squad, taking into account ammunition supply, rather than comparing weapons of particular categories.
  11. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

    We won, so our MG must have been better! :D

    Seriously we all know that had nothing to do with anything.

    But still, we are still using Browning .50 MG's, and not using MG-42's, or the MG-42 derivative M60s, much.

  12. wdyasq

    wdyasq Active Member

    The reason the US won was several fold. Most important was we had OIL!

    The Germans had better airplanes (ask the old pilots who flew against them). The Germans had better tanks. The Germans had better rockets ( oops, the US didn't have any rockets). And, the Germans had damn good small arms.

    The Germans didn't have the fuel to run their war machine. They were fighting on two fronts and lost many troops in Russia.

    But the main thing was the Germans lacked the fuel to run their war machine. This same energy 'shortage' caused manufacturing slowdowns and reduction of materials needed on the fighting front.

    And all of this talk about machine guns. The US militia doesn't need machine guns. Our Congress and Supreme Court have so decided. So, it is a fact.

  13. mgregg85

    mgregg85 Well-Known Member

    Seems like America didn't learn much from WWII, we went into the war with a powerful semi-automatic rifle and then scrambled to equip our troops with more submachine guns and intermediate weapons like the M1 carbine. After the war when looking for a replacement rifle they went to the 7.62x51 in the M14. It's only advantages over the Garand were it's detachable mag and the largely useless ability to fire in full auto.

    I wonder how long it would have taken to dump the M14 if McNamara hadn't forced the M-16 adoption.
  14. zoom6zoom

    zoom6zoom Well-Known Member

    We're not, but the basic design is still in widespread use. Both Germany and Italy are among those using the MG-3, which is an improved version, Austria runs a version of it, and the Swiss MG71 is basically a beefed up version.

    The US tried copying it for our use during the war but the .30-06 ammo was apparently too powerful for it.
  15. Ian

    Ian Well-Known Member

    There's not necessary problem adapting the MG42/MG3 to .30-06, it's just that the guys who did the conversion (the T24) during WWII really screwed it up. I have the testing report posted on my site, if you care to read it:


    They didn't allow for the greater OAL of the .30-06 compared to 8mm Mauser. No surprise then that the guns didn't work.
  16. tepin

    tepin Well-Known Member

    If I remember correctly, one of those TV shows rated the top 10 machine guns and I believe the German Sturmgewehr was #1.
  17. azgun

    azgun Well-Known Member

    If I am not mistaken, that was top 10 battle/ assault rifles.

    Either way, both the mg-42 and 1919 have aspects which make them great machine guns.
  18. Ranb

    Ranb Well-Known Member

    The Americans had much better planes. The P-47 and P-51 could hold their own against the Bf-019 and the FW-190 plus the American planes had a much longer range to bring the fight to Germany. Bombers; the Germans never had a bomber that could equal the B-17 and B-24. The V-1's and V-2's were much less effective than bombers.

    The German leadership and oil supply sucked, that is why they lost the war.

  19. Mp7

    Mp7 Well-Known Member

    +1 Ranb

    .... early in the war, while the US wasnt in it, german planes, armor ... everything was better.

    Later on US planes and russian armor caught up. The end was sheer
    overwhelming man and material power.

    And as a german i can say i´m glad.

    Only a madman would declare war on the world.
    Idiots prefer oil-rich midlle eastern countries :D
  20. Ar180shooter

    Ar180shooter Well-Known Member

    Only thing is both the MG34 and MG42 were 5-6lbs lighter than the M1919 Browning and M1917A1...

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