44 Special Pet Loads???

[Float Pilot]

Sunday Dec 09,
Wet snow, and freezing rain. Temp 31-32 F. Wind 8 knots.
Fading light

Today was UNIQUE POWDER DAY. I even used a can of the new ALLIANT UNIQUE and not one of the several old cans I have from the 1970s.

I looked up loads in the recent Speer and Hornady books as well as loads from the Lyman book from a couple years ago.

GUNS: Taurus M-445UL with a 2.1 inch barrel and a S&W M-29 (44 mag) with a 6.55 inch barrel. (an old S-model)

Target at 15 yards, chronograph at 10 feet.

180 grain full wadcutter. (Matts Bullets) sized to .430
8.0 grains of Unique
WW brass, WLP
1.200 COl medium roll crimp
Vel- Taurus = 1,077 fps and a 2.5 inch group
Vel- S&W M29= 1,233 fps 3.0 inch group.
* This was much hotter than the book says it should be. Probably due to the .430 sizing, seating depth and small grease grooves on this bullet. Not very accurate and leads the barrel.

207 grain cast lead semi-wadcutter hollow point with gas check. (.429)
7.7 grain Unique
WW-WLP
1.500 col, roll crimp
Vel- Taurus = 900 fps and a 1.75 inch group
Vel- S&W M29= 965 fps and a 2.0 inch group.
* Perfect velocity, but does not group as well as other powders. I wish I could find more of these bullets.

216 grain Hollow base Wadcutter (Matts bullets sized to .430)
6.5 grains Unique
WW- WLP
1.200 col Roll Crimp
Vel- Taurus = 940 fps 1.5 inch group
Vel- S&WM29= 1,045 fps and a 1.0 inch group
* A little hot for this bullet weight. The .430 sizing, seating depth and small grease grooves seem to jack up the pressure. I am not in love with the hollow base idea.

240 grain Keith Style SWC
6.5 grains Unique
WW-WLP
1.475 col roll crimp
Vel- Taurus = 790 fps and a 0.75 inch group at point of aim.
Vel- S&WM29= 865 fps and a 0.50 inch group
Good Load

255 grain Keith Style SWC (from straight wheel weights, sized to .429)
6.5 grains Unique
WW-WLP
1.578 col, Roll Crimp (almost too long for 44 special)
Vel- Taurus = 730 fps and a 0.75 inch group
Vel- S&WM29 = 795 fps and a 0.50 inch group.
* not a bad load at all.

[the Black Spot]

Those last two loads should make a decent load for woods carry.

[Float Pilot]

The 240 grain Lead Semi-wadcutetrs seem to be a good all around bullet for the snubbie 44 Special. Here is a re-cap of the 240 grain keith Style SWC loads so far. At least some of the better loads.

240 grain Keith Style SWC
6.5 grains Unique
WW-WLP
1.475 col roll crimp
Vel- Taurus = 790 fps and a 0.75 inch group at point of aim.
Vel- S&WM29= 865 fps and a 0.50 inch group
Good Load

240 grain Keith Stle SWC
7.5 grains Power Pistol
WW, WLP
1.483 col Roll Crimp
Taurus=820 fps and a 1.0 inch group
S&W = 905 fps and a one hole group less than half an inch

240 grain Keith style SWC
9.0gr AA#5
WW brass, WLP, Roll Crimp
Vel= 803 fps and a 1.0 inch group 1 inch low

240 grain Keith SWC
7.5gr POWER PISTOL
ww-WLP, roll crimp
Vel= 828 fps and a 3/4 inch group 0.5 inch to the left
Good Load

240 grain Keith SWC
7.7gr POWER PISTOL
WW-WLP, roll crimp
Vel= 840 fps and a 1.5 inch group

240 grain Keith SWC
8.0gr POWER PISTOL
WW-WLP, Roll Crimp
Vel= 870 fps and a 3/4 inch group. 1 inch left
Still a little warm for an alloy gun.

240gr Keith Semi wadcutter. WW Brass, WLP, Roll crimp into top groove.
8.0 grains POWER PISTOL = 875 fps and a 3/4 inch group 1 inch to the left.
Stout recoil. Probably a little hot for an alloy gun. At least for extended use. The primers look fine. Clean. Best velocity from a 2.1 inch barrel, for this bullet weight.
SUPER LOAD 408 ft lbs of energy




240 grain LSWC,
Star-Line Brass, WLP, 1.487 COL Roll Crimp
6.1 grains HP-38 = 785 fps with a 0.75 inch group with one flyer to 1.25
6.2 grains HP-38 = 800 fps and a 1.25 inch group ME= 341 ft lbs
6.3 grains HP-38 = 793 fps with a 1.50 inch group
[COLOR="red"]5.4 grains TiteGroup = 780 fps and a 4.0 inch group[/COLOR]YES POWDER DOES MAKE A DIFFERENCE
240 grain cast lead Keith style, semi-wadcutter.
Winchester Brass, Winchester Large Pistol, 1.490 col w/roll crimp
9.0 grains Blue Dot = 705 fps and a 3.0 inch group, dirty, unburnt powder.

240 grain cast lead Keith style, semi-wadcutter.
Winchester Brass, Winchester Large Pistol, 1.490 col w/roll crimp
5.5 Grains Green Dot = Hi-750, Lo-713, and a 1.25 inch group ¾ inch low, clean
6.2 Grains HP-38 = ….Hi-812, Lo-790, and a 1.35 inch group ¾ inch left, clean

240 grain Keith Lead Semi-Wad-cutter, WW Brass, WLP,
Heavy Roll crimp 1.490 COL
5.3 grains GREEN DOT = 720 fps and a 0.60 inch group 1.5 inch low
5.3 grains RED DOT….= 790 fps and a 2.0 inch group POINT OF AIM
8.0 grains IMR-SR-4756= 715 fps and a 2.5 inch group

[the Black Spot]

Thanks for keeping us posted. Your testing has been very helpful.

[jfh]

Since edit is still available to you, I suggest that you go in and add the temperatures at which your results were achieved in post 128. IIRC, you've noted that before--and since you have provided results derived at temperatures a bit different from many other reloaders, it might be a good idea for us to have that recorded with the result.

I know that AA#5 can vary noticably with just typical 'summertime' temperature swings--e.g., twenty-five degrees or so. And, I know that I simply don't try to do chrono work at freezing; I can't handle it. So, for the rest of us, this info is a valid expansion for our recipe knowledge.

Jim H.

[jack44]

I use 19grains of Alliant 2400 and a BTB 300 gr cast lead in my super blackhawk- good shooter!.

[Float Pilot]

I see a lot of warmer loads out there. But that is why I own a couple 44 mags. I have been trying to keep my loads low enough in pressure to work in small frame revolvers and older guns.
14 grain pushes a 250 grain SWC at 1,000 fps from my old Colt Peacemaker. So your load for a 300 grain bullet seems kinda hot....

[Float Pilot]

Out again today.....

Temp Neg 7 F.
Fading light on snow.
Target range 15 yards
Chronograph at 10 feet.

From Taurus M-445 UL 2.1 inch barrel.

Only one type of bullet today.

186 grain full wadcutter cast from Lyman mold 429348 sized to .430
Brass: virgin Winchester Primer: Winchester Large Pistol
1.210 inch COL, Roll Crimp

7.3 grains Unique = 998 fps and a 1.0 inch group, some soot in cases

6.0 grains Green Dot = 915 fps and a huge 5 inch group. with tumbling
very dark case interior.

8.0 grains Power Pistol = 941 fps and a 3 inch group with keyholes.
Rather sooty load

6.1 grains TiteGroup = 924 fps and a 2 inch long verticle string.
*** each shot was 25 fps faster than the one before as the gun warmed up.
So each shot was just above and touching the one before. This is Temp Sensitive powder.

7.2 grains HP-38 = 971 fps and a 1.0 inch group. Clean load

[jibjab]

7.3 grains Unique = 998 fps and a 1.0 inch group, some soot in cases

Sounds like a bit more powder could be used ?

Any leading with the Unique or HP-38 loads ?

[Float Pilot]

Yes they leaded... I only fired 15 rounds of each load and ran a brush through the bore every five rounds. Until my hands froze...

I did not shoot any from the longer barrel today because I called it quits after the nine volt battery died from the cold.

8.0 grains of Unique pushed the same Bullet to 1,077 fps.
7.3gr to 998 fps...
Maybe the happy load is in between.
Remember this is only a 2.1 inch barrel.

I do not think this Taurus likes the shorter bullets much. Seeming to prefer the longer bear surface of the 240s and 255 grain cast SWCs.

[Float Pilot]

Wow over 4,300 reads on this thread. Maybe interest in the 44 Special is a little mor ethan the industry gurus think it should be.

If 5% of the readers here would hit like on my business facebook page, I wonder if it would help any...
I have not really figured that facebook stuff out when it comes to a mom and pop hobby business. (that acording t my wife costs more to run than I make with it)

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Drago...ref=ts&fref=ts

Since my daughter is bringing the new freshly out of the oven grand-kid to our house this weekend, I may not be able to go to the range.. Maybe I can head over on Wednesday during the day. It gets dark here pretty fast this time of year.

[the Black Spot]

Congrats on the new Grandchild!

One of the best threads ever! One if these days I will contribute some more info

[the Black Spot]

Would 5.5 gr of unique be too much with a 310 gr cast bullet in the special? Still be around saami specs?

[Float Pilot]

I just happen to have some 310 grain cast bullets.... They look like a lead torpedo.
Let me do some figuring...

[jfh]

On recipes for something like this, IMO it ought to be run through Quickload....

Jibjab, is it you that has it? Somebody around here does, and IIRC, they even are a .44 Special shooter and may be following this thread.

Jim H.

[jibjab]

Jibjab, is it you that has it?

Nope it's not me.

I just happen to have some 310 grain cast bullets

I doubt enough velocity could be achieved from a 2" barrel to stabilize the bullet. But I guess we'll see

[Float Pilot]

It might work in my 6 1/2 inch M-24 just fine. But based upon the velocity loss I am having so far with other bullets as the weight increases. The 310s sure won't be going very fast, if I keep the pressures low.

[the Black Spot]

I wanna run the 310 gr out of my uberti cattleman with a 7.5" barrel.
I get under 3" at 25 yds in this gun shooting 9.5 gr of 2400 with a 310 gr cast bullet. But unique might get me tighter groups so hoping to find a load within saami specs.

[the Black Spot]

Well hopefully tomorrow will test some black powder loads with my 44 special. 20 gr of 2f black under a 255 gr cast bullet.
Gotta get some cases prepped for more unique powder testing.
Think I will start with 5 gr of unique with the 310 gr cast bullet and see how they shoot.

[Float Pilot]

I am interested how that will turn out.... I can go to the range today....
Busy hauling grand-kid around and spoiling him so he will not be fit to go home

[the Black Spot]

Got out today and checked my traps and while in the woods checked out my black powder loads, 20 gr of 2f under a 255 hard cast bullet lubed with 50/50 beeswax/olive oil mix. Resting my hands on a fallen log I shot at 15 yds and was rewarded with a neat 2" group for five shots. The group printed 2" above point of aim. I think I am hooked! May try some BP with my 310 gr cast bullets as well. Clean up was no different than when using smokeless, with the exception of cleaning fluids.
Have no idea of velocity would guess around 650 fps.
Firearm was a 7.5" barreled uberti cattleman.

[Float Pilot]

Any grease cookie or just the bullet lube?
Any powder compression?

[the Black Spot]

No grease cookie just lube.
About 1/8" compression
I loaded one round with a 200 gr cast. On this one round I loaded 17 gr of 2f black thick paper cookie 8 gr of cream of wheat then seated bullet with about 1/16" compression(roughly compares to old 44 Russian load). This one round shot to point of aim.

[Float Pilot]

It would interesting to see what type of velocity you are managing to obtain. I have always been amazed at my 38WFC (38-40) Black Powder loads.

[the Black Spot]

Wish I had a chrono